mirrage Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 Hi all! Once again I am back with a question about aircrafts differences and again the aircraft is one served in the US NAVY. I recently trade a kit I had for the Hasegawa 1/48 F-4B/N Sundowners that I want to convert to F-4J and paint it in the colours of VF-84 Jolly Rogers. Can you tell me what are the external only differences of the B/N with the J. I do not really care for the cockpit because the canopy will be closed. Links and/or pictures are more than welcome Once again I thank you for your time and help! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dave Williams Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 The main difference is that the B/N had narrow main tires and a flat upper wing and gear doors. The -J had wider tires that required a bulge in the upper wing skin, as well as a bulge that ran across the MLG doora and into the forward part of the speedbrake wells. Usually, the thin wing VS thick wing issue kills trying to convert one model into the other for most people. Also, the -B originally had non-slotted stabilizers, and the -J all had slotted stabs, but many -Bs were retrofitted with the slotted stabs, or got them when converted into -Ns. In addition, the engine exhausts are different, and the -J has a smooth nose without the underside IR fairing on the -B/N. Honestly, you may be better off trading your B/N to someone for the -J kit. Aside from saving the hassle of conversion, the newer releases of the -J have recessed panel lines, as well as a correct rear cockpit. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew D. the Jolly Rogers guy Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 Or, if you just want to model a Jolly Rogers phantom, they also flew the B and the N. But they are very different airframes, wingwise. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mirrage Posted February 23, 2007 Author Share Posted February 23, 2007 (edited) Or, if you just want to model a Jolly Rogers phantom, they also flew the B and the N. But they are very different airframes, wingwise. I know they flew the B and N but I want to make the J because i think its paint scheme is much more amazing than the B and N. The full black rudder and the skull are great! I hope that if I do not find someone to trade my kit I will not destry it in my attempt to change it. Edited February 23, 2007 by mirrage Quote Link to post Share on other sites
otis252 Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 (edited) Hey Mirrage, That is a very difficult conversion. You should trade the F-4B for a F-4J. Both Hasagawa kits, but of course the F-4J is fully scribed and perfectly done. If I could help you with that trade, please let me know. Just trying to help. Chuck Edited February 23, 2007 by otis252 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew D. the Jolly Rogers guy Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 (edited) Well, the N's had the same markings, unless you closely count the number of yellow chevrons on the fuselage band....and the B's were repainted upon return from their Vietnam cruise in pretty much the same scheme as the J's, except for the stars on the tail. Although, I certainly agree that the J's just look meaner and tougher, generally speaking, regardless of squadron. Love those J's and S's. Edited February 23, 2007 by Andrew D. the Jolly Rogers guy Quote Link to post Share on other sites
markojeras Posted February 23, 2007 Share Posted February 23, 2007 Me likey J nosey, short and clean (of chin gun, cameras and such) :) But I have one serious question about J model - those two symetrical uderwing 'doors' that are on Hase 1/48 F-4J moulded with wing undersurface in open position (showing nothing inside): 1. what this doos use for? 2. Please, tell me that that doors CAN be clesed on ground :) All the best! Marko Quote Link to post Share on other sites
silverkite211 Posted February 24, 2007 Share Posted February 24, 2007 (edited) Me likey J nosey, short and clean (of chin gun, cameras and such) :) But I have one serious question about J model - those two symetrical uderwing 'doors' that are on Hase 1/48 F-4J moulded with wing undersurface in open position (showing nothing inside): 1. what this doos use for? 2. Please, tell me that that doors CAN be clesed on ground :) All the best! Marko Those are auxillary inlet doors, when the aircraft is not moving, or moving at a slow airspeed, those doors open to allow more air to reach the engines. When the aircraft is powered down and hydralic pressure has bled off, those doors will be open, to one degree or another, the speedbrakes will drop open and the ailerons will droop. And, the B and J have different fincaps, and the burner cans are longer on the J. Edited February 24, 2007 by silverkite211 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kstater94 Posted February 24, 2007 Share Posted February 24, 2007 If you want to build a J, I'll trade you one of my J's for your B/N! ;) That would speed your conversion process up! B) Cheers! John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
otis252 Posted February 24, 2007 Share Posted February 24, 2007 Easy Kstater94, I offered to help first. Chuck Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kstater94 Posted February 24, 2007 Share Posted February 24, 2007 Sorry Chuck Got so excited that I missed that part of your post Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew D. the Jolly Rogers guy Posted February 24, 2007 Share Posted February 24, 2007 Sweet...always nice to have plenty of help offered! Also glad for the one J I've got in the stash.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mirrage Posted February 24, 2007 Author Share Posted February 24, 2007 (edited) In fact Otis252 you were 2nd and kstater94 3rd I had a pm yesterday from another member. A trade is the best I can do but I leave in Greece and any trade with foreigners is difficult for both sides. Edited February 24, 2007 by mirrage Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mirrage Posted February 24, 2007 Author Share Posted February 24, 2007 (edited) Does anyone have photos from the Ns painted as the Js (or almost as the Js).A link to the photos is better though I have no problem to give you my e-mail. Edited February 24, 2007 by mirrage Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GreyGhost Posted February 24, 2007 Share Posted February 24, 2007 Does anyone have photos from the Ns painted as the Js (or almost as the Js).A link to the photos is better though I have no prblem to give you my e-mail. Scroll down after clicking the link ... Clicky HTH Gregg Quote Link to post Share on other sites
G_Marcat_Italy Posted February 24, 2007 Share Posted February 24, 2007 I recently trade a kit I had for the Hasegawa 1/48 F-4B/N Sundownersthat I want to convert to F-4J Wow, you are projecting something of unusual! Usually (as made by me with the F-4H1 prototype) I have seen the modellers to start from the F-4J and to backdate it at the F-4B's standard to take advantage of the engraved panel lines on the F-4J. To level/sand off the large tyres bulges on the up & low of the F-4J's wings is a relatively simple task. I can't imagine to made the bulges. It's possible, but doing this You will destroy all the raised panel lines (or you will run seriously this risk of to do do this mistake). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Gene K Posted February 25, 2007 Share Posted February 25, 2007 Those are auxillary inlet doors, when the aircraft is not moving, or moving at a slow airspeed, those doors open to allow more air to reach the engines. When the aircraft is powered down and hydralic pressure has bled off, those doors will be open, to one degree or another, the speedbrakes will drop open and the ailerons will droop. Close, but not exactly.... The Aux Air Doors provide cooling air to the engine compartment (not into the engine). Air enters the doors and exits at the vents just above the start of the exhaust cans. They open anytime the gear handle (gear HANDLE) is put down..so...they will ALWAYS be open on the ground....and airborne while the gear is down. Yes, with hydraulic power off the airplane, you can push them closed and they will eventually sag. The doors will close when the gear handle is raised after takeoff, and remain closed until there's an engine compartment overpressure (they will then crack open to relieve the pressure). Gene K Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kap64 Posted February 26, 2007 Share Posted February 26, 2007 If you want to delve into resin, you can make a mould of that area of the wing and gear doors from a J kit and graft them onto your B/N. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew D. the Jolly Rogers guy Posted February 26, 2007 Share Posted February 26, 2007 If you want to delve into resin, you can make a mould of that area of the wing and gear doors from a J kit and graft them onto your B/N. True, but it sounds like an awful lot of resin....pretty pricey. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
markojeras Posted February 26, 2007 Share Posted February 26, 2007 Thank you for explanation about that under-wing inlet doors. I will most likely cut out molded ones and make thinner ones from plastic. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Gene K Posted February 26, 2007 Share Posted February 26, 2007 Thank you for explanation about that under-wing inlet doors. I will most likely cut out molded ones and make thinner ones from plastic. That's very easy to do with two pieces of sheet plastic, a larger thin and smaller thick. - and there are many reference on line, like right here at ARC walkaround . It's pretty dark up there, especially in 1/72, so if you don't have AMS, you may not want to worry too much about internal detail. Gene K Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew D. the Jolly Rogers guy Posted February 26, 2007 Share Posted February 26, 2007 Yeah, I wish all problems were that easy to correct. Simple fix. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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