David Walker Posted April 13, 2007 Share Posted April 13, 2007 Wow, that's really some great work. I'm very much enjoying watching your current project progress. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kaburaya Posted April 13, 2007 Share Posted April 13, 2007 Wow! Thanks for the inspiartion, how many years have you been scratch building for and how may have you built? Peter :D Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Medevac71 Posted April 13, 2007 Share Posted April 13, 2007 fascinating Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Skyking Posted April 20, 2007 Author Share Posted April 20, 2007 Thanks for the comments everyone. It's been a trying week of a lot of work but no progress, so they do help. how many years have you been scratch building for and how may have you built? Good question Peter, I've never really tallied them up. I've been gluing plastic together ever since I was a kid about 5 years old, so I guess you could say 45 years. Now of that 45, only about 20 are of anything to write home about, and scratchbuilding began in earnest about 1993. I wanted an Albatross D-III but there were no 48th scale kits out at the time, save the old Aurora, but it wasn't an accurate D-III, so I made my own, got bit by the bug and have been flogging wood and plastic ever since. This is my 6th or 7th I've started, and I have one that's languishing that I need to get the nerve up to finish, a Consolidated P2Y-3 flying boat I started in the mid 90's and had a few things go wrong with the wings, so it got shelved. I have been working on the T4M every night for the last week and in that time I have finally got the front and rear cockpit instrument panels done. It may not sound like a big deal, but the fact it took me 4 tries for the rear and 3 for the front tells it all. The first set I made was perfect, and I was very happy with them.... until I set them aside. I went to test fit them and I could not find them to save my skin. I have no idea where they went. I tore my bench apart looking, went through the trash can next to my bench, pulled every drawer out... nothing. They have vanished into thin air. Set number two looked like crap so I ripped the bezels off and tried again. Set number 3 was better, but I cut the rear panel too small and it wouldn't fit for beans, and I didn't pay attention to which side I punched my bezel holes and promptly made a mirror image of the panel. Set 4... finally!!! I got them laid out correctly and they fit, plus they weren't bass-ackwards either. This time I put them in a clear plastic box in my parts cabinet so they don't get lost again. I am not going through all that work again. One week and 4 sets later, here they are. The front cockpit has minimal instrumentation. Airspeed, Altimeter and compass and that's it. The rear has the above 3 plus engine instruments and a clock, and a bubble style turn and bank indicator. I used bezels from Copper State Models, gages from Reheat, and I punched out all the holes, laid the decals on a backer panel, then glued my punched instrument panel face over them, recessing them. A dab of Krystal Klear for a glass and voila... it's done. The backside of the rear instrument panel can be seen from the front cockpit, so I added round stock on the back for the instrument cases. I'll run some bits of wire for the harnesses and call it finished. I hope to finish all fabrication of the cage this weekend and begin painting. I'm going to use Alclad aluminum on the cage and a white/aluminum mixture for the interior fabric. I'll post a couple of shots when it's painted. Thanks for looking Cheers Mike Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ron Posted April 20, 2007 Share Posted April 20, 2007 Do you have cats? I made an cell of a hobby room because of so many stolen assembies!! Thumbs up on your determination with those inst. panels!! Everything looks great. I wish I had the patients to scratch like that!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Barneydhc82 Posted April 20, 2007 Share Posted April 20, 2007 Mike, your frame-work looks great and now you've got me interested in doing the same for the "first solo" aircraft almost 55 years ago...the Fleet 80 Canuck. Barney Quote Link to post Share on other sites
parche Posted April 21, 2007 Share Posted April 21, 2007 This build is absolutely awesome. I have been overwhelmed by the scratchbuilds that are going around at the moment. Hat's off to you for an awesome build. I can't wait to see it progress. Cheers, Dave Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Old Man Posted April 24, 2007 Share Posted April 24, 2007 This is coming along wonderfully, Mr. King! The level of detail is simply fantastic. The crew arrangements seem a little curious. Was this a pilot/co-pilot arrangement in front? Is the crew total three or four? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Aggressor Supporter Posted April 24, 2007 Share Posted April 24, 2007 Intriguing build. Looking good and keep it up! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mbittner Posted April 24, 2007 Share Posted April 24, 2007 Mike, Looking awesome, of course. Question, though. How do you create the framework that sits across the two fuselage halves? What do you use to get the right lengths? I've tried silly putty and clay, but not 100% happy with that. What's your trick? TIA!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Skyking Posted April 24, 2007 Author Share Posted April 24, 2007 Thanks for the comments everyone. I've got the cage painted, I'll post some shots either tonight or tomorrow when I get some of the components installed. Do you have cats? I made an cell of a hobby room because of so many stolen assembies!! No Ron I wish I did though. At least I'd have a good reason for its disappearance. I still have no clue what happened to them. The crew arrangements seem a little curious. Was this a pilot/co-pilot arrangement in front? Is the crew total three or four? Hi OldMan. It was a 3 man crew, with a single pilot in the center cockpit, the bombardier/torpedo aimer sat in the forward cockpit, and the Navigator/Radio Op/Gunner sat in the rear. The front cockpit had basic instrumentation so the bombardier could fly the torpedo run or provide relief on long flights, but other than that it was a single pilot airplane. Question, though. How do you create the framework that sits across the two fuselage halves? What do you use to get the right lengths? I've tried silly putty and clay, but not 100% happy with that. What's your trick? TIA!! Thanks Matt. In this case I had the wood master to make my measurements from, so it was easy. I just measured the outside of the master, and it correlated to the inside dimension of my fuselage halves. Normally though I use inside calipers to get inside measurements. I tape my fuselage halves together, then expand them to fit the inside walls. I then transfer that dimension to my plastic I am cutting. For bulkhead contours I've found that a length of solder works well. It's flexible enough to shape it to your profile, yet stiff enough to hold it while you trace the shape onto plastic. HTH. Cheers Mike Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Skyking Posted April 25, 2007 Author Share Posted April 25, 2007 Here's a couple of shots showing a few of the interior bits installed. The rudder pedals, control column and wheels, instrument panels are in place, and the aileron and elevator control cables are in place. I have to add a tie rod between the two elevator horns, and also add the rudder cables and horns. The seats can then be installed, and I'll make the throttle quadrant, add the radio gear and stowed Lewis guns for the rear compartment, plus a few other bits as I discover them. Then I can button it all up inside the fuselage, never to be seen again I have a feeling much will be visible thanks to the three large portholes on either side of the fuselage, otherwise I wouldn;t have gotten quite so carried away. I can start adding external details to the fuselage once it's together. I'm planning ahead a little to try to figure out how to replicate the plethora of louvers on the front cowl. That's going to be a bit of a challenge. View from the back. The Navigators desk is in place, and above that will go a shelf containing the radio gear and navigational aids. I am going to have the Lewis guns in the stowed position on either side of the gunners sub floor, along with spare ammo drums stored on the two racks that bow out from the sides. The seat will be in the folded down position as well. This side view shows the flotation bag compartments I added. Nothing more then 1/8 x 1/8 plastic square glued together and sanded to shape, then covered with .010 plastic to hide the seam. I used Alclad for the paint. So far so good. It's finally starting to look like something other than a collection of white plastic rod. I'll post a few more pictures later this week when I get the rest of the interior bits in place. Cheers Mike Quote Link to post Share on other sites
woodbeck3 Posted April 25, 2007 Share Posted April 25, 2007 I think you're brilliant Skyking. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Skyking Posted May 2, 2007 Author Share Posted May 2, 2007 Just about all the interior stuff I have to make is done. I have to add the rudder cables yet, and I have a couple of Lewis gun sets from Copper State Models to build and stowe on the racks, but there's not much left to do interior wise. The throttle quadrants are in, seats and belts installed, radio set, and to add a little interest to the centre section, I printed a sectional map of San Diego NAS and folded it up and placed it on the navigators station. Also there are his Analog Computer, and a right triangle for plotting courses. I wll also add a protractor and a set of dividers, just to add a little more interest. Once all this is done I have to work on the fuselage shell inner surfaces. I have to add some stringers and structure in there, then paint it, and I can then put the two halves together. Anyone have any suggestions on how I can replicate a telegraph key? I tried making a couple but they don't look quite right. They were too big and klunky looking. Thanks for taking the time to look. Cheers Mike Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Ken Middleton Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 Mike, after finally seeing your work in person, I am amazed at your skill for small things - truly spectacular! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ron Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 (edited) Man o man you do good work!! Nice touch with the map Edited May 2, 2007 by ron Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fishwelding Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 Wow! I just discovered this thread! Tremendous work! Good to see the old school Nav-Air subjects getting some light, too. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fishwelding Posted May 2, 2007 Share Posted May 2, 2007 Anyone have any suggestions on how I can replicate a telegraph key? I tried making a couple but they don't look quite right. They were too big and klunky looking. Don't they make photoetch or resin replacements for armored vehicle stowage box latches? In particular I'm thinking about a US M-60. I seem to recall one of the 1/35th scale kits coming with tiny plastic latches, too. Better yet, that sounds like something you might find in the aftermarket world of HO gauge railroad cars/locomotives, like a latch for a boxcar or refridgerator car door/hatch. I dunno, somehow it just came to mind. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Skyking Posted May 2, 2007 Author Share Posted May 2, 2007 Don't they make photoetch or resin replacements for armored vehicle stowage box latches? In particular I'm thinking about a US M-60. I seem to recall one of the 1/35th scale kits coming with tiny plastic latches, too. Better yet, that sounds like something you might find in the aftermarket world of HO gauge railroad cars/locomotives, like a latch for a boxcar or refridgerator car door/hatch. Man what a great idea FW. I will check out Grandt Line and see what I can come up with. Thanks for the tip. I never even thought of RR items. Cheers Mike Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Skyking Posted May 6, 2007 Author Share Posted May 6, 2007 Hey Fishwelding I wanted to let you know your idea paid off. I was able to get what I needed from an O scale RR item. Thanks a bunch. The interior of the fuselage halves will get painted tonight, then I have a few pieces of structure to add after they are dry, and I can close it up and begin the wings. Cheers Mike Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Old Man Posted May 6, 2007 Share Posted May 6, 2007 Great to see such progress, Mr. King! Beautiful work, and that map is the absolute topper.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fishwelding Posted May 6, 2007 Share Posted May 6, 2007 The RR folks have a seemingly endless supply of aftermarket stuff. I occasionally do work for a 'local' HO scale RR, mostly building structures and occasional rolling stock kits and I must say, for all of our craziness in detailing scale model airplanes, those people are worse! Now, for the P&W Hornet: will you have to scratchbuild that, or is that available in plastic/resin/white metal? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Skyking Posted May 6, 2007 Author Share Posted May 6, 2007 Back again...lol Great to see such progress, Mr. King! Thank you OldMan. It's challenging me to stretch my abilities more than I would normally do. I keep telling my wife I may have bit off more than I can chew on this one, as the more I do, the deeper I get and the more needs to be done. I hate to say it but AMS has really bitten me on this one. Now, for the P&W Hornet: will you have to scratchbuild that, or is that available in plastic/resin/white metal? Thanks FW. As far as the engine goes, I'm not sure yet. There's a beauty of an engine in my Classic Airframes P-6, but if I use it then I have nothing for my P-6 for later. I could copy it in resin, but for some reason I don't quite feel right about doing that. I could scratch one, but to be honest, I don't feel like doing it... So unless I can find a suitable plastic engine from a kit, I may have to use the resin engine from my P-6. If anyone has a Classic Airframes P-6 languishing in a semi-built stage and you don't think you will ever finish it, drop me a PM and we'll make a deal. Today I spent the better part of the afternoon working on more interior goodies. The more I looked at the back of the instrument panel, the more it bugged me that it looked too plain. So I took a deep breath, poked a sharp #11 blade between the panel and the tubular support and with a little :pray:gave a slight twist and off it popped with no damage. Whew. I used some fine wire and nylon thread for various bits and pieces of wiring, and metallic thread for the Tach drive cable. I also added the the radio set, running a couple of cables between the receiver and tuner, and also wired in the wireless telegraph key, and also made and set in place a set of head phones. Those two little items really added a lot to the center section. The telegraph key is my third attempt. The first one I made looked to klunky so I binned it, and thanks to a lead from FW I found a nifty little telegraph key from an O scale RR source. I painted it up and went to install it, when I got that merry little "toink" from my cross action tweezers snapping it off into oblivion. Oh well, back to the drawing board. This time I tried making my own again and found some bits of left over PE that filled the bill. A scrap of plastic, a seatbelt buckle, a strip of PE fret, and a piece of .005 punched out to a disk, made the telegraph key. The headsets are made from .005 and .010 plastic disks and wire, with twisted copper wire for cabling. I put the twin Lewis guns in the stowed position, with a couple of extra ammo drums stowed on the rack. This will allow me to leave the gun ring to a minimum, so it'll be easier to see inside the center section. I stuck the fuselage halves together just for grins, and fortunately, most everything is visible inside through the cockpit openings and the portholes on the sides. I'm glad that I spent the extra effort to do so much interior work. Here's look at the right side overall view. And here's a closeup of the wireless keyset and headphones, map, and flight computer. I don't mean to sound like I am bragging but I am really pleased with these little bits and how much character they add to the interior. Here's a closeup of the added instrument wiring. It adds a lot to a plain instrument panel backside. Here's the stowed Lewis guns and ammo drums. These came from Copper State Models and are gorgeous. Also the Navigators station shows to good effect here. Tonight I will be adding a bit more structure to the fuselage inners, then if I don't run out of time, get some of it painted. By mid-week I hope to have it buttoned together. Thanks for looking. Cheers Mike Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Old Man Posted May 7, 2007 Share Posted May 7, 2007 I am glad it looks like this will all be visible, Sir! It would be a shame if it were not. The internal structures you have made would justify making one half the fuselage clear plastic, or even ommitted entirely as a museum cut-away. I have quite run out of superlatives, Sir: if this is A.M.S., let it rage on.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Barneydhc82 Posted May 7, 2007 Share Posted May 7, 2007 Mike: What make and model do you need for the engine???? I have an Engine and Things catalogue in my stash somewhere and I could check it out for you. George's products are quite good and his product line is very extensive. Barney Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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