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illithid00

Pearl Harbor

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My friend Tia was asking me about Pearl Harbor the other day, and she asked how many aircraft the US got into the air to fight the Japanese on 7 Dec, 1941. Does anyone know? TIA

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I *think* it is six....three P-40's and three P-36's. They were credited with a total of 12 aerial victories, with the P-36's getting 3 and the P-40's getting the other 9.

And, strangely enough, part of the movie isn't as far-fetched as one might think, as two of the P-40 pilots did, in fact, jump into a car while under fire, I think, and raced to their airstrip and took off in a hurry....funny thing is, they flew back to Wheeler, which had already been attacked, after shooting down some enemies and actually landed amid the burning chaos to rearm.

Edited by Andrew D. the Jolly Rogers guy

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I saw something the other day on the Military Channel that said there was only ONE U.S. aerial victory at Pearl and I think they said the pilot who scored it was flying a bi-plane.

Not disputing anyones facts really. I'm just saying that what they stated in the show.

**** Ok I just went and tried to varify what I saw, went to Military Channel.com. The name of the show I saw was "Secrets of Pearl Harbor"

Edited by Expat Tomcat

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Interesting...that WOULD be a great "secret", especially with the publicity given to the pilots involved at the time, especially the two P-40 pilots who got the multiple kills....man, it's amazing how much contraditory info is out there on any given subject! :cheers:

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I know what you mean, I had heard that bit about the two P-40 pilots too. I don't know whats really correct, but was really rather taken aback by the that little bit of information on TV. It was contrary to everything I had heard prior to seeing it.

That show had alot of information about the midget submarines that attacked Pearl harbor on it. Very informative, but I don't know if their information was any more correct than what either of us has heard about the P-40's.

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I believe the two pilots that drove a car to there planes were Lt. Taylor and Lt. Welch. There planes were stationed at Haleiwa auxilary field. They were, and still are , credited with 6 kills.

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I saw something the other day on the Military Channel that said there was only ONE U.S. aerial victory at Pearl and I think they said the pilot who scored it was flying a bi-plane.

...

AFIK, the only US biplane to get airborne on 7 December was a JRS-1 twin engine amphibian which went looking for the Japanese fleet, its only armament was a sailor or two with an M1903 Springfield rifles. Fortunately for the crew, they went searching in the wrong direction.

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Aloha All,

The aircraft airborne during the whole day is given in "Ghosts of Pearl Harbor", FLIGHT JOURNAL, June 2007 issue...and includes the following info for aircraft airborne DURING the attack...

Ah, yes! We had some fighters in the air...a rare few:

Taylor got one VAL on his first flight and shared one VAL with Welch; then two more VALs on his second but got credit for only two.

Welch claimed two VALs on his first flight, but one was a share with Taylor, and two planes (one was a VAL) on his second mission and got credit for four.

John Dains got in the air next and about ten years ago we learned he shot down a VAL. He was killed on his third flight by Schofield Barracks fire (ala the scene in FROM HERE TO ETERNITY) as he was trying to land at nearby Wheeler Field.

Harry Brown and Bob Rogers attacked a VAL, both put in claims but the plane went down.

Brown joined up with Mike Moore to attack two planes, years later we find they were Zeros. Both Zeros never returned to their carriers.

George Whiteman got his wheels off the ground just as Zeros hit the airfield. He crashed at the end of the runway. Whiteman AFB, MO is in his memory.

Sam Bishop was able to get in the air immediately after Whiteman, with the attacking Zeros diverted by Whiteman. However, he did not make it far as the Zeros caught up with him. Wounded he crashed off shore and waded ashore.

Four P-36s [Lew Sanders, John Thacker, Gordon Sterling, Phil Rasmussen] got in the air from Wheeler and were vectored to Kaneohe, where they bounced SIX Zeros! Two MORE Zeros joined the fray! Gordon Sterling was lost and is STILL MIA. Read more about these P-36s at: http://www.flightjournal.com/ME2/dirmod.as...7AD26DF526DDD7E

John Webster attacked a pair of fighters with his P-40, but was wounded for the effort.

Fred Shifflet made a circle of Pearl Harbor to seek out enemy aircraft, flew over Hickam Field and was filled with AA fire. He deadsticked the P-40 back to Wheeler Field to land on flat tires.

William Haney got hit by Pearl Harbor fire on BOTH of his sorties and had to return to Wheeler each time with a dead engine.

Woodrow Willmot, Aaron Tyer, Francis Gabreski, and Henry Lawrence avoided Pearl Harbor fire, but never saw the enemy. Gabreski ended WWII as the highest European Theater of Operations ace.

A sortie of 25 fighter pilots got airborne at 0930 just after Wheeler was strafed. Names are sought.

Well, I outlined above the fighters. Add to that 18 SBDs from USS Enterprise that flew into war (six were lost, of which ground fire got one) and a dozen B-17s came in from California...(two were lost).

Then comes the movie TORA-TORA-TORA ...remember the lady instructor that joined up with a Japanese formation? ...she was depicting SEVERAL storys combined into one character. There were actually EIGHT light single engined civilian planes in the air, ALL but one came under attack...THREE were shot down [of the three, two are still missing].

Also coming from California to arrive during the attack was the PanAm Clipper ship ANZAC. Fortunately, they got news of the attack as they neared the Oahu coast and made it to Hilo, Hawaii. The Ambassador to the US from Burma [and his sectretary] was aboard.

At 0620 three PBYs got in the air to do anti-sub searching. One found a midget sub and helped USS Ward sink it. These were diverted to search for the Japanese carriers.

At 0700 four PBYs got in the air to do a "problem" with submarine USS Gudgeon off the island of Lanai. They were diverted to search for the Japanese carriers...one flew into a Japanese VAL formation for an air-to-air battle.

At 0915-0930, while USS Nevada was being hit by VALs, a PBY got into the waters off Ford Island and got airborne down the main channel toward the entrance with the intent to search for the Japanese carriers.

PBY pilot Ted Marshall got so mad at the loss of his PBY that he went to the old Luke Field side of Ford Island and got into a few aircraft until he found a TBD that operated. He followed and attacked a Japanese unit until the fuel guage said "return".

A B-18 was on Molokai. The crew were told to "return to their duty base" at Wheeler. They arrived over Oahu to be fired on by Ft Ruger fire, then Hickam fire, and landed at Wheeler just after a Japanese strafing attack.

Within three hundred miles of Oahu, USS Enterprise put up a four plane combat air patrol, and an inner air patrol of two bombers...then more planes.

the roster above is also given in: Stan Cohen: EAST WIND RAIN [Missoula, MT: Pictorial Histories Pub; 1981, revised 1991, corrected 1994, retitled as ATTACK ON PEARL HARBOR - A Pictorial History in 2000] page 97-98

Cheers,

David Aiken, a director: Pearl Harbor History Associates, Inc.

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Cheers, David! I'm assuming you're based in Hawaii, then? Should've looked you up last December when I was there for the 65th observances with the Arizona's survivors....

Moshi Moshi...

Konbanwa Andrew San,

Gomen nasai, shikata ganai... do not make error to use language to give home town.

Dai toa senso kokan senshi, Shinjuwan Sakusen sensei,

Kampai,

D. Aiken

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:salute: Fair enough....unfortunately, Japanese is not one of my languages....I assumed not based on language, but because of your salutation "David Aiken, a director: Pearl Harbor History Associates, Inc." Edited by Andrew D. the Jolly Rogers guy

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:salute: Fair enough....unfortunately, Japanese is not one of my languages....I assumed not based on language, but because of your salutation "David Aiken, a director: Pearl Harbor History Associates, Inc."

Howdy Andrew,

Pearl Harbor History Associates, Inc., a non-profit study group founded by members of the Pearl Harbor Survivors Association, seeks to carry the flag of "Keeping the Record Straight" by holding steadfast to the truth of the battle and dispel the myths that continue to crop up. Currently the PHHA is based in Stratford, CT, yet that means the current slate of officers (from California, Missouri, Montana, Virginia, CT, Texas, and Hawaii) have the HQ there. The vote is in and the HQ is to move to Oklahoma soon.

Knowledge of both Hawaiian and Japanese greatly helps with any deep study of the Pearl Harbor Attack. Hawaiian salutations help keep 'in the spirit of Aloha' as do greetings to Japanese researchers in their language. I extend to you the opportunity of a deeper study of Pearl Harbor at the largest WWII URL on the internet: http://www.pearlharbor-history.org/ The "Pearl Harbor Attacked" message board has had over 100,000 hits in one day (alas, that was 11 Sept 2001)!

Cheers,

David Aiken, a student of 7 Dec 1941

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An A6M2 crashed into the one right behind our house.

A great book on the subject is "The Way it Was: Pearl Harbor, The Original Photographs".

Aloha nui loa "lator...",

The A6M2 was piloted by PO1c Takeshi Hirano, Akagi. Hickam AFB now has cognizance over the land where "Ft Kam" once stood...and has placed a marker for the crash near an old Hawaiian Air Guard hangar where Building 52 once stood...site of the Zero crash. for more see my article "Oahu Island Zero (Hirano Petty Officer First Class Aircraft) Technical Report: Report of a Mysterious Hinomaru Fighter Crashed in Pearl Harbor", ***** (Japanese mag), Feb 2006...posted at: http://groups.msn.com/japanesemodelaircraf...bor.msnw?Page=6

Oh, check the acknowledgements within "The Way it Was: Pearl Harbor, The Original Photographs"...

Mahalo, Cheers,

David Aiken

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Fantastic information, Mr. Aiken! I'm totally in awe!

Thanks for sharing!

:)

Old Blind Dog

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Old Blind Dog

Aloha Blind Dog,

Glad this Nishkin Halupa A Pe Lachi could serve as guide and helper to a blind dog....

Cheers,

David Aiken

"Nishkin Halupa A Pe Lachi" is Choctaw for "Eagle eyed helper"

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My friend Tia was asking... how many aircraft the US got into the air to fight the Japanese on 7 Dec, 1941.

Howdy illith...

Have you counted up a total yet? ....surprised?

Cheers,

David

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Howdy illith...

Have you counted up a total yet? ....surprised?

Cheers,

David

From what I could find in your post, I found 53+ US aircraft in the air above Pearl Harbor at one point or another that morning. And yes, I'm definitely surprised! I'll have to send my friend the link to this thread for sure! Thanks for all the great info, and keep it coming, I'm sure it'll be interesting!

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Yeah, I kinda stopped counting after around 50...there might have been 70+ in your post.

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Hi everyone. I'm new to this forum and I was looking for the introduction thread so I can properly introduce myself to the members of this forum, but I can't seem to find it.

Anyway, to Illithid00: As I was browsing the net, I came across this site (http://www.aracnet.com/~histgaz/pearlharbor/7dec1941.html) and it says that there were 115 destroyers, 27 cruisers, 42 subs, seven battleships and 18 18 aircraft carriers.

Pearl Harbor Tours

Edited by Link7881

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Don't believe everything you read. On 7 December, 1941, there were eight battleships in the harbor, and no aircraft carriers. Total number of ships was, if I recall correctly, 96.

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Hi everyone. I'm new to this forum and I was looking for the introduction thread so I can properly introduce myself to the members of this forum, but I can't seem to find it.

Anyway, to Illithid00: As I was browsing the net, I came across this site (http://www.aracnet.com/~histgaz/pearlharbor/7dec1941.html) and it says that there were 115 destroyers, 27 cruisers, 42 subs, seven battleships and 18 18 aircraft carriers.

Pearl Harbor Tours

Hello and welcome to the ARC Forums.

It might have been wiser to introduce yourself without replying to a 22 month old thread ;) . Also the original posting was about the number of aircraft that the US got into the air that day and not the number of ships. Anyway as for you ship numbers, these were additional vessels ordered by the navy under the Two-Ocean Naval Expansion Act and were nowhere close to Oahu, or even service, during the attacks.

Cheers,

John

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