Aussie_superbug Posted July 21, 2008 Author Share Posted July 21, 2008 Just a small question wich is a bit off topic. It's about the cancellation of the Tomcat programm back in the 90's. I've heard many times that mister Cheney killd the Cat in favor of the SuperBug because he had actions or something like this by Boeing... if this is true, then the program cancellation was illegal? Did he really told to Grumman "if you don't close the production line then you'll close your business" or something like that ? Sorry i dont know about that one, in reference to Boeing, I meant Boeing Australia. Brendon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Samurai_Chris Posted July 21, 2008 Share Posted July 21, 2008 Some good news on the Aussie Rhino front ... >>> Clicky <<< Gregg Well, then the wheels are in motion, and although I had my issue, now can't wait to see the first one roll off the assembly line!.. I will be co-ordinating our trip home to co-inside with the arrival.. I still remember as a kid being able to read the markings on the under side of the F-111's as they flew (very low) over my house growing up.. Willowbank was a great place to grow up for an aircraft fan, and look forward to seeing the Super Bugs.. I still havn't seen the C-17, but have heard them flying over while video confrenceing with the olds on Skype... Amberley is definately not like the place I grew up anymore, but I guess that happens with everything... Chris Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cowie165 Posted July 21, 2008 Share Posted July 21, 2008 The Supers may not have the range that the Pigs had, but I promise you, you'll be getting a far more capable aircraft. One that isnt prone to breaking ever other flight. Funnily enough, your observation regarding serviceability is pretty darn accurate. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cowie165 Posted July 21, 2008 Share Posted July 21, 2008 And just a few random thoughts after an enjoyable read through this thread: Re: Manufacturing an Australian fighter/strike acft If we cannot introduce our own EWSP gear successfully, producing an entire aircraft is bit of an ask Compare SeaSprite to C-17 - we bought one off the shelf (and is in-service, working flat out) and recently dumped the other because it was expensive, late, and incomplete. Re: Buying the Rhino I'm pretty sure we're just leasing them, with an option to buy. Re: LHD Ships Apparently big bosses are musing over F-35C but if they are also starting to argue against building the air warfare destroyers (reportedly due to profileration of subs) then it becomes less likely. And you have to keep in mind the political statement you make when you buy F-35C to go on your shiny new helicopter/expeditionary ships - a country with carriers (even pseudo-carriers) makes for nervous neighbours. Really cool discussion going on here. Glad I found the thread! :P Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Aussie_superbug Posted July 21, 2008 Author Share Posted July 21, 2008 And just a few random thoughts after an enjoyable read through this thread:Re: Manufacturing an Australian fighter/strike acft If we cannot introduce our own EWSP gear successfully, producing an entire aircraft is bit of an ask Compare SeaSprite to C-17 - we bought one off the shelf (and is in-service, working flat out) and recently dumped the other because it was expensive, late, and incomplete. Re: Buying the Rhino I'm pretty sure we're just leasing them, with an option to buy. Re: LHD Ships Apparently big bosses are musing over F-35C but if they are also starting to argue against building the air warfare destroyers (reportedly due to profileration of subs) then it becomes less likely. And you have to keep in mind the political statement you make when you buy F-35C to go on your shiny new helicopter/expeditionary ships - a country with carriers (even pseudo-carriers) makes for nervous neighbours. Really cool discussion going on here. Glad I found the thread! :P I think they are looking into the F-35B STOVL, but rumors going around that they dont really want them as it means having two airfames in service with a limited pool of pilots and maintenance guys, but who knows....... i could be wrong Brendon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GreyGhost Posted July 21, 2008 Share Posted July 21, 2008 Boeing wasn't even a part of the F/A-18 program at that time ... Gregg Quote Link to post Share on other sites
cowie165 Posted July 22, 2008 Share Posted July 22, 2008 I think they are looking into the F-35B STOVL, but rumors going around that they dont really want them as it means having two airfames in service with a limited pool of pilots and maintenance guys, but who knows....... i could be wrongBrendon Whoops! Got my B & C mixed up there :) Wasn't the pipe dream to have air force pilots on board a navy ship designed to ferry the army around? That's all kinds of purple - with shades of Op Eagle Claw in 1980 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Aussie_superbug Posted July 23, 2008 Author Share Posted July 23, 2008 Whoops! Got my B & C mixed up there Wasn't the pipe dream to have air force pilots on board a navy ship designed to ferry the army around? That's all kinds of purple - with shades of Op Eagle Claw in 1980 I think it was, i can be too sure i really wasnt old enough then..... lol But I think the defence Chiefs have always wanted a JTF when it came to amphib ops, but like i said if they where to get the F-35B, the small amount of airframes and limited pool of flyers doesnt really make a good business case. Brendon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Aussie_superbug Posted July 27, 2008 Author Share Posted July 27, 2008 Nice one Trigger. love the work Brendon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Doppel Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 I agree! Very nice work Trigger however, the challenge is to put them in 1 and 6 Sqn markings as 3 Squadron which you have depicted won't ever be flying these. 3 Sqn is destined to receive the Lightning II (JSF) Regards Andrew Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Samurai_Chris Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 I agree! Very nice work Trigger however, the challenge is to put them in 1 and 6 Sqn markings as 3 Squadron which you have depicted won't ever be flying these. 3 Sqn is destined to receive the Lightning II (JSF)Regards Andrew This pic is awesome, and is what I am doing as my "what if". Although there is some talk as to it actually being the correct markings for when they are put into service at Amberley.. Chris Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Doppel Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 Geez, that pic looks like one I posted earlier I believe it's a one squadron Rhino? (LOL/TIC) Andrew Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Gambler Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 I agree! Very nice work Trigger however, the challenge is to put them in 1 and 6 Sqn markings as 3 Squadron which you have depicted won't ever be flying these. 3 Sqn is destined to receive the Lightning II (JSF)Regards Andrew Andrew, what about 77 and 75 Squadron, will they be getting any Super's or are they only destined for the F-111 Squadrons? Are the Hornet Squadrons at Williamtown still going to be flying the "A" models, or are any of them going to get some "F's"? I was looking forward to driving up there to check them out when we got them, but it looks as though i'll be out of luck if their not getting any at Williamtown. Cheers, Jeff. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Samurai_Chris Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 Geez, that pic looks like one I posted earlier I believe it's a one squadron Rhino? (LOL/TIC)Andrew Sorry Andrew, I wasn't claiming to own the pic, just posting it regarding the markings.. Chris Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Doppel Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 (edited) Jeff, The purpose of the Rhino is to replace the F111 as an interim strike aircraft until the JSF comes online in RAAF service. At this stage we are getting 24 F/A-18Fs to replace the F111 with talk of the purchase of some Growlers. The Rhinos will be allocated to 1 and 6 Squadrons only at this stage. The image of the Rhino above in 1 Sqn markings is almost confirmed and I can only assume that 6 Sqn will have a similar tail flash but with a Boomerang. The JSF when they come online will initially replace the 'Legacy' Hornets at 3, 75, 77 Squadrons and I can only assume 2OCU depending on how many we actually get. If we get 100 JSFs who knows what will happen to them all and whether the Rhinos will be retired/replaced with the JSF or kept on or whether another squadron will be re-formed. Hope this helps Andrew Edited July 27, 2008 by Andrew Doppel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Doppel Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 Sorry Andrew, I wasn't claiming to own the pic, just posting it regarding the markings..Chris Fishin's good this time of year! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
squezzer Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 sorry but i don't believe it takes just 6 flights for a legacy pilot to be certified on E/Fthe aircraft has many more maneuvres available to it than the legacy bird.I think they would take a little more time to be certified on.I could be wrong of course I'am almost sure that 6 flights are enough to be certified on the type. In , France, it took 5 hours to be certified on the Jaguar, which was certainly far more difficult to handle than the new generation jets. You have to keep in mind that "certified" means that you are able to take off, fly and land, not that you are combat ready Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Doppel Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 I'am almost sure that 6 flights are enough to be certified on the type. In , France, it took 5 hours to be certified on the Jaguar, which was certainly far more difficult to handle than the new generation jets. You have to keep in mind that "certified" means that you are able to take off, fly and land, not that you are combat ready Can't tell you how many conversion flights the RAAF does from one model to another due to the way we do things over here. A F111 pilot I know has just instructed on a conversion course and this went for three to five weeks but I think it included combat training (both day and night). And remember our F111s are now digital/wireless from the AUP upgrade. Regards Andrew Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Gambler Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 Jeff,The purpose of the Rhino is to replace the F111 as an interim strike aircraft until the JSF comes online in RAAF service. At this stage we are getting 24 F/A-18Fs to replace the F111 with talk of the purchase of some Growlers. The Rhinos will be allocated to 1 and 6 Squadrons only at this stage. The image of the Rhino above in 1 Sqn markings is almost confirmed and I can only assume that 6 Sqn will have a similar tail flash but with a Boomerang. The JSF when they come online will initially replace the 'Legacy' Hornets at 3, 75, 77 Squadrons and I can only assume 2OCU depending on how many we actually get. If we get 100 JSFs who knows what will happen to them all and whether the Rhinos will be retired/replaced with the JSF or kept on or whether another squadron will be re-formed. Hope this helps Andrew Thanks Andrew, Yep, i should have realised that myself, that as the PIG is the one they are replacing, there won't be any at Williamtown. ........was just hoping a couple would be sent this way. Oh well, looks like i've got a little longer trip then if i go and check them out! Cheers, Jeff. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Doppel Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 (edited) Don't worry Jeff, if you drive south of your border you'll get to see one soon at the Avalon Airshow. First one to be delivered at the end of next year I believe. I don't know whether they will be completely assembled in the States, it is quite possible that they may go through Boeing @ Avalon for final fitment of any Australian fitted equipment. This is speculation, so please don't take it for gospel. By the way, nice Hornet in your post. Did you build it? Here's one of mine. Regards Andrew Edited July 27, 2008 by Andrew Doppel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Samurai_Chris Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 (edited) Andrew, the tail on that bird looks like an Okinawan Lion? Chris Edited July 27, 2008 by Samurai_Chris Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Doppel Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 It is indeed the Japanese lion or comically referred to as the grumpy monkey of 77 Squadron! This is from their days in Japan and during the Korean War. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/index.html?curid=3573298 Andrew Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Gambler Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 (edited) Nice Hornet Andrew, looks great mate! Thanks mate, yep, the Hornet model in my sig is mine, you probably saw it when i built it and posted it on AMI, but here's a couple of pics again. Yes, i saw the Super Hornet Demo at Avalon last year and it was Awesome! Cheers, Jeff. Edited July 27, 2008 by Gambler Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Cagie Posted July 27, 2008 Share Posted July 27, 2008 Don't worry Jeff, if you drive south of your border you'll get to see one soon at the Avalon Airshow. First one to be delivered at the end of next year I believe. I don't know whether they will be completely assembled in the States, it is quite possible that they may go through Boeing @ Avalon for final fitment of any Australian fitted equipment. This is speculation, so please don't take it for gospel. By the way, nice Hornet in your post. Did you build it? Here's one of mine. Regards Andrew Andrew, Love the model mate.. and to top it off it is my fav sqn... 77 Sqn.. Grumpy Monkey Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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