Zactoman Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 There IS a difference between Su-27 and (old) Su-35 radomes - both in diameter and profile.So........ 'old' Su-35 has different radome, 'new' Su-35 does not - can we agree ??? I would agree that the old Su-35 has a different contour to its' nosecone but it is my understanding that it had the same diameter at the intersection of the forward fuselage.The drawings in the World Airpower Journal show the same diameter (not that I necessarily trust drawings). The old SOL Su-35 kit actually has a smaller diameter than the Academy Su-27 kit by about .050" (1.27mm)... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Berkut Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 (edited) MAKS 2007 But looking at the real bird at MAKS'07 and then looking at photos, when test flying begun, I got the feeling they changed the radome... The one at MAKS seemed longer than the "flying" one - later being the same shape as standard Su-27... IIRC Zmey observed the same thing... I don't have any good photos at this moment to compare, but just some food for thought... Yes, it is a different radome. The one at MAKS lacks the pitot tube, and have the white "stripes" (what are those btw? Static dischargers?) I would also say that Su-35 b/n 901 carries the usual Su-27 radome. While 902 carries the one seen on MAKS. (lacking pitot tube + stripes) If that is indeed the case, that means if a normal Su-27 radome can fit on Su-35 b/n 901, the size is the same. ;) PS: With 901 and 902, i am talking about the new Su-35's!!! Edited June 24, 2009 by Berkut Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MarkW Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 If the measured circumference difference is 3", that works out to less than 1" in diameter. Considering the "weighted film canister taped to a string while trying to not get caught" method is a valid way to measure, that 3" could be in the error range. As an aero engineer, I find it highly unlikely they would change the radome/fuselage interface. That could create a ton of aero problems, as well as just creating tooling for a unique front fuselage section to mate with the larger radome. Not saying it wasn't done, just saying highly unlikely unless Sukhoi has some unlimited budget to play with such things. In profile, there are differences but due to color and lighting, true silhouette shots are needed to understand them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
su27rules Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 I would agree that the old Su-35 has a different contour to its' nosecone but it is my understanding that it had the same diameter at the intersection of the forward fuselage. I agree whit this!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
zerosystem Posted June 24, 2009 Author Share Posted June 24, 2009 i agree aswell, and if you look at Design's drawing/illustration comparison look at the panel lines, this might seriously affect one's perspective as far as length and angle issues. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MiG31 Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 While I tend to have a disdain for following drawings versus photographs, I did find this drawing which compares the Su-27 with the Su-27M: This is not to say that the drawings are correct, but they do reflect what I've read and seen (in photos) of the differences between the two noses. Also note the changes in tail booms and vertical fins. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MarkW Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 (edited) Very interesting. Source? I thought the exhausts were different as well. Edited June 24, 2009 by MarkW Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MiG31 Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 I just tried finding it again to no avail. I had picked it up in November 2006 when I was working on a 1:72 Su-37, and I believe it was from the Key Publishing forum. It may have been from someone else's hosting, which would explain why I can't find it again. With that in mind, it's still difficult to rely on drawings for true-to-the-original references. Here are a couple of airliners.net photos to show what I mean: http://www.airliners.net/photo/Russia---Ai...u-37/0215909/L/ http://www.airliners.net/photo/Russia---Ai...u-27/1419617/L/ In particular, note the separation between the radome demarcation line and the rectangular antenna panel aft of it. Also note the distance between the front base of the windscreen and the radome. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
designfriemel Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 (edited) While I tend to have a disdain for following drawings versus photographs, I did find this drawing which compares the Su-27 with the Su-27M:This is not to say that the drawings are correct, but they do reflect what I've read and seen (in photos) of the differences between the two noses. Also note the changes in tail booms and vertical fins. ctrl+c, lads... well done. this drawing explaines quite a bit: the difference in diameter measured by Ken plus the different shape. Looks like they lengthened the whole front fuselage. thx for the elucidation Mig31 Edited June 24, 2009 by designfriemel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MiG31 Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 I thought the exhausts were different as well. It's my impression that the Su-27M used the same, or roughly the same, powerplant as the Su-27. The Su-37 used AL-31FPs, which explained how they appared different (TVC-capable, of course). It's also worth noting that there were significant changes made to the basic Su-27 airframe to produce the Su-27M. It was to be equipped with a new radar kit, which would explain the different radome diameters. I think the RusAF decided against the -27M on the grounds that it was a significant alteration from the base airframe, and thus more expensive. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Zactoman Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 If we are talking OLD Su-35 - then, yes, the radome diameter was bigger - I actually measured it.... the Su-35 radome is approx 3inches greater circumference than the Su-27.Sorry Ken, I missed this post. I didn't realize that you has actually measured them when I made my previous post.Interesting! I wouldn't have thought that they would have gone to all that trouble of re-tooling the entire forward fuselage. I would point out though that a 3" difference in circumference translates to a 1" difference in diameter, about .020" in 1/48. That's a few thick coats of paint... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Berkut Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 (edited) I know you can't trust on drawings, but i measured up the radome area on MiG-31's drawing and got this: Distance between the windshield and where radome begins: - Su-27; 0,9 cm (0.35 inches) - Su-35; 1,45 cm (0.57inches) Difference in length: 0,55 cm (0.216 inches) Length of the radome. Measured from the beginning of it, to the tip. (not counting the pitot tube on Su-27) - Su-27; 4,3 cm (1.69 inches) - Su-35; 4,7 cm (1.85 inches) Difference in length: 0,5 cm (0.197 inches) NOTICE: I don't know what scale the drawing are in, but they are not in 1/72. Bigger scale, maybe 1/48 or something between 1/72 and 1/48. And the inch numbers are not 100 % correct, because some numbers gets "lost" due to converting. Anyway, this shows that Su-35 is ~ 1 cm longer in the radome area in total, in god-knows-what-scale. Edited June 24, 2009 by Berkut Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Scipione Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 Oh man... I don't understood... is the SU-35BM's nose different from Su-27/Su-27K??? To me, it seems that the forward fuselage continues a bit more (the nose starts after, respect to the -27), and the nose is also a bit bigger. Or it's just an illusion, due to the camouflage? Now I got more confused than ever... However, I collected all the tech drawings available in a single zip; about 2 MB but it contains the collection of the T-10 Family. All the pages are almost in the same scale. Download from here: http://thenemesiswar.blogspot.com/p/downloads.html I need a Su-35Bm in 3D, so I modeled a Su-27 using blender, and now I have only to modify the tail and nose (and other minor particulars). However, I need the most accurate drawing available fort the Su-35Bm forward fuselage. Ok, and that's a gift (original, from Sukhoi) (Su-27) (found on eagle.ru): How I will draw the Su-35Bm nose, so???? xD Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sarathi S. Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 sorry for the confusion! just to clear things up a bit (rather for myself): just a su-33 cross-reference check: and finally a perspective comparison: seems to prove me wrong of course - no visible difference in diameter. rg martin Ah, Yellow 13. I know that aircraft well. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Petarvu Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) To add to the confusion latest Su-35 is designated Su-35S in Russia , not Su-35BM. Interesting thing is, from published photos of Su-35S in serial configuration(third and fourth prototype I believe, as second was lost)and old Su-35 (with canards)used as Su-35/T-50 engine testbed it is obvious that now it has larger intakes for new engines! Regarding the nose of Su-35S there were several threads on other forums based on (always questionable) photos and final verdict was that the length is almost identical with Su-35S radome being shorter. This was also mentioned here, Su-27 has smaller windsheeld -to-radome area compared to 35S I wasn't convinced that shape itself of the radome is the same since to my mk.1 eye Su-35S radome is more bulbous, although since it is shorter who knows.... I plan to scratchbuild 35S gray splinter prototype with regular intakes in 1/48 ...I expect to see more info on the nose in the future... P Edited February 17, 2012 by Petarvu Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Youngtiger1 Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Boy this is confusing...lol Why can't Russians keep things simple is beyond me. I once dated a Russin girl and let me tell you it sure wasn't your typical American girl. Anyway, back to the jets...can someone please post side-by-side pic to show the "old" Su-35 and "new" Su-35. TIA Mike Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Deino Posted February 18, 2012 Share Posted February 18, 2012 Just found at the Key-Forum ... 3rd serial Su-35C painted! http://russianplanes.net/ID66724 http://russianplanes.net/ID66723 http://russianplanes.net/ID66722 http://russianplanes.net/ID66721 Deino Quote Link to post Share on other sites
foxmulder_ms Posted February 19, 2012 Share Posted February 19, 2012 To add to the confusion latest Su-35 is designated Su-35S in Russia , not Su-35BM. Interesting thing is, from published photos of Su-35S in serial configuration(third and fourth prototype I believe, as second was lost)and old Su-35 (with canards)used as Su-35/T-50 engine testbed it is obvious that now it has larger intakes for new engines! Regarding the nose of Su-35S there were several threads on other forums based on (always questionable) photos and final verdict was that the length is almost identical with Su-35S radome being shorter. This was also mentioned here, Su-27 has smaller windsheeld -to-radome area compared to 35S I wasn't convinced that shape itself of the radome is the same since to my mk.1 eye Su-35S radome is more bulbous, although since it is shorter who knows.... I plan to scratchbuild 35S gray splinter prototype with regular intakes in 1/48 ...I expect to see more info on the nose in the future... P It looks more bulbous to me, too. However, it may be because it lacks a pitot tube... who knows.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Berkut Posted February 19, 2012 Share Posted February 19, 2012 Su-35S nose size is the same as Su-27. There are other differences than that in the nose area. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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