Late '80s A-10A

[Fishwelding]

For a late 1980s (through Desert Storm) A-10A, I gather the most common loadout for anti-armor would be Mavericks and Rockeyes, with possibly Mk 82 GPs (High Drag?). Is there any particular arrangement by which these weapons appear on the aircraft? That is, Mavericks on the outer pylons, bombs inboard? Are limitations on total ordnance load governed only by range and loiter time considerations? When did the sidewinder dual-rail come into use?

Edited November 15, 2009 by Fishwelding

[Collin]

For a late 1980s (through Desert Storm) A-10A, I gather the most common loadout for anti-armor would be Mavericks and Rockeyes, with possibly Mk 82 GPs (High Drag?). Is there any particular arrangement by which these weapons appear on the aircraft? That is, Mavericks on the outer pylons, bombs inboard? Are limitations on total ordnance load governed only by range and loiter time considerations? When did the sidewinder dual-rail come into use?

http://www.dstorm.eu/pages/loadout/a-10.html

r/

ATIS

[Fishwelding]

Excellent link! Thank you!

I wasn't previously aware LAU-88s made a comeback in time for Desert Storm.

[Fishwelding]

And a related question. The Revellogram A-10 kit, of course, contains that gregarious fellow we've all known for years: the Monogram '70s/80s Jet Guy with visor down. (I took to calling him "Aloysius" sometime around 1992.) Is his helmet (HGU-33?) still good for Desert Storm, or did the participating A-10 units replace those brain-buckets with newer items by then?

Edited November 15, 2009 by Fishwelding

[Benner]

just be aware, the a-10s in DS hardly ever carried the LAU88, and of all the pics of a-10 pilots in DS were of the helmet following the HGU33.

[Modelmkr]

just be aware, the a-10s in DS hardly ever carried the LAU88, and of all the pics of a-10 pilots in DS were of the helmet following the HGU33.

Reason being there were wiring problems with the use of the LAU88. So, it was used... just hardly as you say. That said, for someone wanting to model an A-10 with a pair (slant load) on each launcher (even rarer to see three on an LAU88 on an A-10) it is not unheard of. The loadout configurations I have suggest that the LAU88 was used in 25% of these configs. How often these specific configuratons were used is anyones guess.

Also, the ECM pod employed on the A-10 station 11 in the '80s and into DS was the ALQ-119 for US-based aircraft and the ALQ-131 shallow for Overseas-based aircraft. The A-10 did not use the ALQ-131 deep or ALQ-184 during DS. Pylon 11 was always fitted with a ECM pod as well as pylon 1 always mounting a pair of AIM-9s (this configuration could be reversed, but was not seen during DS).

Other "rules of thumb":

- Pylon 6 (centerline) was pretty much universally left empty;

- Pylons 2&10 and/or 5&7 were often (50% of time?) left empty or removed to save weight and reduce drag/ improve manouverability;

- When triple ejector racks (TERs used only on stations 4&8) were employed with only two peices of ordnance they were usually flat loaded;

- When loaded with ordnance (not including AGM-65s, AIM-9s, or ECM) the type was not 'normally' mixed, i.e. if Mk82s were loaded you would not see Mk20s or SUU munitions mixed on the same aircraft. It did happen, jusy not often.

- During DS, the 354th TFW used TERs. The 23rdTFW preferred single mounted weapons (no TERs).

All this was gathered from World Air Power Journal Vol. 16 (Spring 1994)

Hope this helps everyone in deciding a reasonably accurate loadout for their A-10s. I have typicall specific mission loadouts during DS, too (night ops, oil feeder line, oil trenches, ground war) if anyone wants them.

[Fishwelding]

I think my plan is two LAU-117/AGM-65s outboard of the landing gears, and four Mk. 20s inboard. The LAU-119 will come right out of the Monogram kit. Not the most exciting load out, but fairly typical. I'll probably scratch up a dual Aim-9 rig when I scratchbuild the LAU-117s.

[Benner]

Oh, specific ds load outs would be interesting, please elaborate

[Murph]

Reason being there were wiring problems with the use of the LAU88. So, it was used... just hardly as you say. That said, for someone wanting to model an A-10 with a pair (slant load) on each launcher (even rarer to see three on an LAU88 on an A-10) it is not unheard of. The loadout configurations I have suggest that the LAU88 was used in 25% of these configs. How often these specific configuratons were used is anyones guess.

Also, the ECM pod employed on the A-10 station 11 in the '80s and into DS was the ALQ-119 for US-based aircraft and the ALQ-131 shallow for Overseas-based aircraft. The A-10 did not use the ALQ-131 deep or ALQ-184 during DS. Pylon 11 was always fitted with a ECM pod as well as pylon 1 always mounting a pair of AIM-9s (this configuration could be reversed, but was not seen during DS).

Other "rules of thumb":

- Pylon 6 (centerline) was pretty much universally left empty;

- Pylons 2&10 and/or 5&7 were often (50% of time?) left empty or removed to save weight and reduce drag/ improve manouverability;

- When triple ejector racks (TERs used only on stations 4&8) were employed with only two peices of ordnance they were usually flat loaded;

- When loaded with ordnance (not including AGM-65s, AIM-9s, or ECM) the type was not 'normally' mixed, i.e. if Mk82s were loaded you would not see Mk20s or SUU munitions mixed on the same aircraft. It did happen, jusy not often.

- During DS, the 354th TFW used TERs. The 23rdTFW preferred single mounted weapons (no TERs).

All this was gathered from World Air Power Journal Vol. 16 (Spring 1994)

Hope this helps everyone in deciding a reasonably accurate loadout for their A-10s. I have typicall specific mission loadouts during DS, too (night ops, oil feeder line, oil trenches, ground war) if anyone wants them.

IIRC, some A-10s in Desert Storm carried mixed loads of Mavericks on day time missions. They planned to fire the TV guided versions first, and once the target area became obscured by the smoke from the previous targets burning use the IR guided versions.

Regards,

Murph

[Matt Roberts]

A quick question...what does the area of the wing look like when a pylon is left off? I doubt it'll have a big pair of holes in the wing!

I don't recall seeing the area in the book by Jake Melampy.

Matt

[Modelmkr]

Oh, specific ds load outs would be interesting, please elaborate

OK here goes:

All loadouts have station 1 with 2x AIM-9s; station 11 with ALQ-119; station 6 empty.

Night ops:

#1

Sta 2/10: 1x SUU-25

Sta 3/9: 1x AGM-65

Sta 4/8: 3x Mk. 82 (on TER)

Sta 5/7: empty

#2

Sta 2/10: 1x SUU-25

Sta 3/9: 2x AGM-65 (on LAU88; slant)

Sta 4/8: 3x Mk. 82 (on TER)

Sta 5/7: empty

#3

Sta 2/10: 1x SUU-25

Sta 3/9: 1x AGM-65

Sta 4/8: 3x SUU-30 (on TER)

Sta 5/7: empty

#4

Sta 2/10: 1x SUU-25

Sta 3/9: 2x AGM-65 (on LAU88; slant)

Sta 4/8: 1x SUU-30

Sta 5/7: 1x SUU-30

#5

Sta 2/10: 1x SUU-25

Sta 3/9: 1x AGM-65

Sta 4/8: 3x Mk. 20 (on TER)

Sta 5/7: empty

#6

Sta 2/10: 1x SUU-25

Sta 3/9: 2x AGM-65 (on LAU88; slant)

Sta 4/8: 3x Mk. 20 (on TER)

Sta 5/7: empty

Oil Feeder Line Ops:

Sta 2/10: empty

Sta 3/9: 1x AGM-65

Sta 4/8: 1x Mk. 84

Sta 5/7: empty

Oil Trench Ops:

Sta 2/10: 1x LAU-68

Sta 3/9: 1x LAU-68

Sta 4/8: 3x Mk. 82 (on TER)

Sta 5/7: empty

Ground War:

Sta 2/10: empty

Sta 3/9: 2x AGM-65 (on LAU88; slant)

Sta 4/8: empty

Sta 5/7: empty

These, again are taken from WAPJ Vol.16. I make no claims on their accurracy or if these are typical. I have 15 more loadouts without any specific mission assignment for A-10As and 3 designated for OA-10As. Gimmie some time and I'll post these up as well.

LAU-68s are 19 round rocket launchers.

SUU-25s are Illuminating flare dispensers (similar to LAU-68s, but with 4 tubes).

SUU-30s are cluster munition dispensers. Pictures here: SUU-30

Edited November 15, 2009 by Modelmkr

[Fishwelding]

As an aside, from previous searches I've run here and elsewhere, I gather that the SUU-30s included in the Monogram A-10 kit are inappropriate for the A-10. For what time frame or aircraft might these be appropriate? My ordinance spares box is rapidly filling with these things!

[Finn]

A quick question...what does the area of the wing look like when a pylon is left off? I doubt it'll have a big pair of holes in the wing!

I don't recall seeing the area in the book by Jake Melampy.

Matt

Here is a pic of an A-10, freshly painted, with some pylons removed:

http://www.flightglobal.com/airspace/photo...thunderbolt.jpg

i would think those in the field that had pylons removed would have a clean outline of the pylon on the otherwise weathered wing surface.

Jari

[Finn]

As an aside, from previous searches I've run here and elsewhere, I gather that the SUU-30s included in the Monogram A-10 kit are inappropriate for the A-10. For what time frame or aircraft might these be appropriate? My ordinance spares box is rapidly filling with these things!

The SUU-30s in the RM A-10 kit are suitable for early Vietnam era a/c.

Early SUU-30:

http://maic.jmu.edu/ordata/srdetaildesc.asp?ordid=727

Later SUU-30:

http://maic.jmu.edu/ordata/srdetaildesc.asp?ordid=1068

with some modification you could make the later version out of them.

Jari

[Matt Roberts]

Here is a pic of an A-10, freshly painted, with some pylons removed:

http://www.flightglobal.com/airspace/photo...thunderbolt.jpg

i would think those in the field that had pylons removed would have a clean outline of the pylon on the otherwise weathered wing surface.

Jari

Dang that one is clean...still probably has the new overhaul smell to it.

I know that on one of my Hawgs the pylons were located to a raised locator on the wing and the other has locating holes (R/M and Italeri) I'll have to look at my Hobbyboss one to see how that one attaches the pylons to the wing.

Thanks for the pic

Matt

Edited November 15, 2009 by Matt Roberts

[Modelmkr]

As promised here are the remainder of the loadouts (no specific missions assigned)

As before, all loadouts have station 1 with 2x AIM-9s; station 11 with ALQ-119; station 6 empty.

When stations 5&7 are removed it was "likely" that station 6 was removed as well.

Desesrt Storm A-10A loadouts:

#1

Sta 2/10: removed

Sta 3/9: 1x AGM-65

Sta 4/8: 2x Mk. 82 (on TER; flat)

Sta 5/7: removed

#2

Sta 2/10: 1x Mk 82

Sta 3/9: 1x AGM-65

Sta 4/8: 1x Mk. 82

Sta 5/7: 1x Mk. 82

#3

Sta 2/10: removed

Sta 3/9: 1x AGM-65

Sta 4/8: 3x Mk. 82 (on TER)

Sta 5/7: removed

#4

Sta 2/10: empty

Sta 3/9: 2x AGM-65 (on LAU88; slant)

Sta 4/8: 1x Mk. 82

Sta 5/7: 1x Mk. 82

#5

Sta 2/10: 1x Mk. 82

Sta 3/9: 3x AGM-65 (on LAU88)

Sta 4/8: 1x Mk. 82

Sta 5/7: 1x Mk. 82

#6

Sta 2/10: removed

Sta 3/9: 1x AGM-65

Sta 4/8: 2x SUU-30 (on TER; flat)

Sta 5/7: removed

#7

Sta 2/10: empty

Sta 3/9: 1x SUU-30

Sta 4/8: 1x SUU-30

Sta 5/7: 1x SUU-30

#8

Sta 2/10: empty

Sta 3/9: 1x AGM-65

Sta 4/8: 3x SUU-30 (on TER)

Sta 5/7: empty

#9

Sta 2/10: 1x SUU-30

Sta 3/9: 1x AGM-65

Sta 4/8: 1x SUU-30

Sta 5/7: 1x SUU-30

#10

Sta 2/10: empty

Sta 3/9: 1x AGM-65

Sta 4/8: 1x SUU-64 (Gator)

Sta 5/7: 1x SUU-64 (Gator)

#11

Sta 2/10: empty

Sta 3/9: 1x AGM-65

Sta 4/8: 1x SUU-65 (CEM & SFW)*

Sta 5/7: 1x SUU-65 (CEM & SFW)*

#12

Sta 2/10: removed

Sta 3/9: 1x AGM-65

Sta 4/8: 2x Mk. 20 (on TER; slant or flat)

Sta 5/7: removed

#13

Sta 2/10: empty

Sta 3/9: 1x Mk. 20

Sta 4/8: 1x Mk. 20

Sta 5/7: 1x Mk. 20

#14

Sta 2/10: 1x Mk. 20

Sta 3/9: 1x AGM-65

Sta 4/8: 2x Mk. 20 (on TER; flat)

Sta 5/7: 1x Mk. 20

Desesrt Storm OA-10A loadouts:

#1

Sta 2/10: 1x LAU-68

Sta 3/9: 1x LAU-68

Sta 4/8: empty

Sta 5/7: empty

#2

Sta 2/10: 1x LAU-68

Sta 3/9: empty

Sta 4/8: 1x Mk. 82

Sta 5/7: empty

#3

Sta 2/10: 1x LAU-68

Sta 3/9: 1x LAU-68

Sta 4/8: 1x Mk. 82

Sta 5/7: 1x mk. 82

Same disclaimers as before. All info sourced from WAPJ Vol. 16

* CEM= Combined Effects Munition; SFW= Sensor Fused Weapon

Note that all Mk. 82 bombs may be LDGP, Snakeye, or Air (last two only used in low threat enviroments).

[Fishwelding]

Some of those loadouts look very heavy. They must have anticipated plenty of tanker, no loiter, or a short trip overall.

[Modelmkr]

Some of those loadouts look very heavy. They must have anticipated plenty of tanker, no loiter, or a short trip overall.

Well, like I said, I make no claims as to their accuracy; these were pulled directly from Vol.16 of WAPJ. However given that the A-10 is capable of 14,341 lbs. of ordnance (with full fuel), these are all do-able. I gather from reading the article that these were taken directly from weapon load-out records from the various bases during DS, so some are likely direct flight missions (those with known target co-ordinates) so no loiter time would be required.

[Benner]

IIRC, some A-10s in Desert Storm carried mixed loads of Mavericks on day time missions. They planned to fire the TV guided versions first, and once the target area became obscured by the smoke from the previous targets burning use the IR guided versions.

Regards,

Murph

I definitely remember seeing video and reading of mixed Maverick loads. I hope to start my DS A-10 soon ..

[ElectroSoldier]

The cold war anti armour postulated loads were very different from those used in ODS remember, as the hogs would have forward deployed into West Germany to take on the Soviet tanks on the battlefield that was thought to have probably only been a few miles away