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Zmey Smirnoff

PAK FA

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50_pochti.jpg

If it looks anything like this, it will be one sexy looking airplane! The nose looks like the shark nose on the F-20 Tigershark. I love that nose shape like it can slice through air.

Edited by Aggressor Supporter

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Anyone knows when the first real flight will take place?

TIA

Terry

They are supposed to nail the flight date this week. Rumor say it will be 29'th. Place (Zhukovsky or Komsomolsk-na-Amure) isn't set, officially atleast. The runway is much longer on Zhukovsky, so we will see.

PS: "710" took off yesterday.

Edited by Berkut

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How far apart are those 2 locations? Would they have to do some sort of ground transportation to get the jet to either place?

Seems kind of late to not have it in position already.

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How far apart are those 2 locations? Would they have to do some sort of ground transportation to get the jet to either place?

Seems kind of late to not have it in position already.

Across whole Russia. Just take a look where Amure is.

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Ok, help me out here. Is the uncertainty due to where the prototype is being built? The prototype will be flown to one of those two locations on a cargo jet, then flown?

I guess I'm really confused. Has the primary test location base been established? I know they may have different ways of doing things, but I'd assume taxi tests would be occuring at the location they plan to fly from. And whatever sight they pick I'd assume is close to the Sukhoi facilities to support flight test. I can't see them picking a location geographically huge form where there'd be production support.

I don't understand the Russian system at all, and would appreciate any insight.

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Ok, help me out here. Is the uncertainty due to where the prototype is being built? The prototype will be flown to one of those two locations on a cargo jet, then flown?

I guess I'm really confused. Has the primary test location base been established? I know they may have different ways of doing things, but I'd assume taxi tests would be occuring at the location they plan to fly from. And whatever sight they pick I'd assume is close to the Sukhoi facilities to support flight test. I can't see them picking a location geographically huge form where there'd be production support.

I don't understand the Russian system at all, and would appreciate any insight.

The prototype will be either flown on Zhukovsky (the main aircraft base in Russia, outside Moscow) or Komsomolsk-na-Amure. (Which is also where the prototypes was tested and where it is currently now). The place where it will take off hasn't been officially set yet. Officially.

The taxi tests are taking place at Komsomolsk-na-Amure Sukhoi factory. The runway in Zhukovsky is longer, because Zhukovsky has been the main test area of Soviet/Russian aircrafts since 40's.

As to where the prototypes are build, i think there will be two main PAK-FA construction sites. If i am not mistaken, there is three build as of now. One for static tests, one for flight example and one general test example. I *think* all of them are build in Amure.

Edited by Berkut

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:yahoo:, Hi MarkW,

If you don't understand the Russian system at all it's vastly different from the US way of thinking. I'm thinking that security is far more important to the Russians than saving a bit of money and Komsomolsk-na-Amur is an isolated location away from the prying eyes of the foreign press. As I said in an earlier post, I doubt the PAK-FA prototype will be driven to Zhukovski uncovered (or covered) on the back of an open low loader, no matter where it was built, even if built in Moscow somewhere. If the runway at Komsomolsk-na-Amur is long enough to do high speed taxi tests and stop by the end of the runway it would undoubtedtly be long enough for the aircraft to get off the ground safely, and land back on if something went wrong.

It could be air refueled several times during its delivery flight to Zhukovsky (which may even be at supercruise speeds except for the actual refuelling link ups) and it wouldn't surprise me if the flight plan is to arrive there around midnight to maintain the strictest security possible. I've said numerous times over the past several years that the Russians do things differently from us. So what? Do they have to mimic us in everything? They have a totally different culture from us and in their own country they can do things anyway they like, especially now that their economy is improving and there is an increasing amount of money to spend on defence items, compared to what there was in the 1990s and early 2000s.

:cheers:,

Ross.

Edited for typo.

Edited by ross blackford

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Ok. I guess it just doesn't make sense in this case to fly the protoype a gajillion miles away from where it is being assembled (assuming it is assembled at the Komsomolsk-na-Amure factory) to do first flight at Zhukovsky, unless it has to have the long runway. I assume this is somewhat analogous the US Edwards Air Force base, except we have expanded that model and now can do the first flights at the contractor facility. Both the Raptor and the JSF first flights occured at the production site, if you don't count the protoyping fly offs a decade earlier. The obvious benefit of conducting it at the contractor facilities for a new aiframe would have to be outweighed by the longer runway, unless there is some politcal reason to ship it 7 time zones East.

And for the record, no I didn't ask about the flight date. You are confusing me with someone else.

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Yeah Ross, we never do things in secret here ... <cough> Area 51 <cough, cough > :thumbsup:

Gregg

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:D, Good one Gregg, I like it. You got me there. :thumbsup:. I was just trying to point out to Mark that what might not make any sense to us may make a lot of sense to the Russians for different reasons than we might think of. I was talking to a couple of young German lads yesterday who told me they don't have outdoor barbecues in Germany. When I asked if it was because of the difference in weather they said "No. It's just that we don't do it that way. We have our sausages and steaks but they are always cooked and eaten inside." That would have suited my Dad right down to the ground. He reckoned barbeques were quote "Eating with the flies" unquote, which made him a very unusual Australian. And yes, I like my barbies, except when a marauding kookaburra wings down out of a tree nearby and steals one of my sausages. Not only did he do that, he stood on my steak to get the sausage and when he'd flown back up into the tree and eaten my sausage he sat there and laughed at me. Cheeky bugger. :woo: :P

:thumbsup:,

Ross.

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Thanks for the help, Ross. FWIW, I wasn't passing judgmant, just trying to understand. I do believe there is more than one way to skin a cat, and as successful as Russia has been in developing aircraft suited to their requiremnts, I am quite sure I don't know what they do or why, but that it appears to work pretty darn well. Hopefully I can learn something.

But, as Dr. Strangelove taught us, you can be too secretive...

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Some news:

- They will decide the take-off place on Monday.

- According to a source, the plane lifted of the main wheels today and deployed the parachute. Ala 787 before the main flight. :cheers:

- According to same source, the plane is rather flat, as other sources have said. (Months ago it was said it is flat like toad.) Only around canopy it is thicker. Stabs are angled and whole surface turns. The nose looks downwards.

- During testflight pictures and video was taken...

That source isn't the same that confirmed taxi tests, so i am not sure how trustable this one is.

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;), Hi Mark. When I remember that Russia/Soviet Union had up till 1945 been invaded every 15 to 25 years or so for the previous 700 or so years I can understand their desire to keep military secrets under wraps for as long as possible. Australia and the US were directly attacked by the Japanese but not actually invaded by them, (although there is some evidence of Japanese reconnaisance patrols in Australia's far north west. It's thought they were looking for a secret airfield, but fortunately they never got to within 100 miles of its actual location.

I know it's hard, but try to think of how you'd feel if your country was as old as Russia and had had the same invasion experiences as they have had over the years. I think that if Australia were that old and had the same experiences then we would feel the same way. In fact, some Australians, our indigenous peoples do feel that way about the white invasion, the 222nd anniversary of which will be celebrated in 3 days time. We whiteys call it Australia Day. Some of our indigenous friends call it Invasion Day and many of them don't trust us white fellas, and for good enough reasons. That's all I want to say about that as I don't want to get into the politics of it all.

:cheers:,

Ross.

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I have been little bit slow with posting this news, just to see how much reaction the got, just in case they turned out to be fake.

The flight date is apparently set at 29'th. In Amure. Lets wait and see. :whistle:

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I have been little bit slow with posting this news, just to see how much reaction the got, just in case they turned out to be fake.

The flight date is apparently set at 29'th. In Amure. Lets wait and see. :woot.gif:

Oh great! 29th is my birthday!!!!!!!!!!

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You lucky one ... maybe with a slight delay they can catch my birthday on 30. !!! :thumbsup:

Deino

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Actually, as of now, it seems it will take off on 28'th. So you are out of luck both. :D

Reporter "Pilot" (click) says that if the take off will be successful, the video and pictures will be given to media on same/next day. Media itself isn't invited to the take off. Sukhoi will film it themself, and the hand over. Same with as with Su-35 take off.

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Media itself isn't invited to the take off. Sukhoi will film it themself, and the hand over. Same with as with Su-35 take off.

Hehe, probably a good idea......they probably learned from us Swedes, remember what happened on the first flight of the Gripen when media was invited?

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Hehe, probably a good idea......they probably learned from us Swedes, remember what happened on the first flight of the Gripen when media was invited?

Oh wow, that was really on the first flight? Did the pilot survive?

NVM: Found out that he survived.

Edited by Berkut

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Is there such a thing as "happy hour" in Russia? I'd imagine the Sukhoi team will go for one after the maiden flight.

Terry

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Oh wow, that was really on the first flight? Did the pilot survive?

NVM: Found out that he survived.

No it wasn´t the maiden flight...just the first flight open to media. The maiden flight was made in december 1988..the crash happened in february -89 and was the sixth flight with Gripen.

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No it wasn´t the maiden flight...just the first flight open to media. The maiden flight was made in december 1988..the crash happened in february -89 and was the sixth flight with Gripen.

I remember when that happened ... Was a very scary looking crash ...

Gregg

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