chuck540z3 Posted March 17, 2012 Share Posted March 17, 2012 Marcel One of the things I like to see in these WIP threads is a close-up, because that's about the only way to determine if the modeling step, in this case painting, was good or not. This pic says you NAILED it! I love the detail and I'm looking forward to more progress. Chuck Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Marcel111 Posted March 18, 2012 Author Share Posted March 18, 2012 Thx Mareku, thx Chuck! Here's a quick update: I'm pretty much done with the base paint job and ready to clear coat, wash, decal etc. This is how the flaps turned out: I have continued the mild weathering process. Here is out it looks on the underside: This only represents paint discoloring. Fluid streaks etc will come much later. As you can see the Zacto centerline pylons are on. Aso note that gray-colored area on the underside. "56" has this area gray, I haven't seen that ony any other Flankers. Overall bottom shot, now with all the little white panels colored: Top shot: Thx for looking, Marcel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sukhoi Su-27 Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Great job so far! I`m also building 2 Ukrainian flankers right now and this topic comes as good reference for my builds. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mario krijan Posted March 18, 2012 Share Posted March 18, 2012 Fantastic work!!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rogier77 Posted March 19, 2012 Share Posted March 19, 2012 Sorry for my late reply Your paint-job is very good. I mean D*MM good. I think this camo-sheme is one of the hardest to airbrush on your plane. Great work!!!! Greetings Rogiér van den Berg Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tonal Posted March 20, 2012 Share Posted March 20, 2012 Extremely beautiful Flanker Marcel!!! Tonal Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ricardo72 Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 Really good job Marcel!!!! fantastic Flanker, one cuestion, for the Dark Gey, waht color you use? thanks for the help, and good work again Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Marcel111 Posted March 23, 2012 Author Share Posted March 23, 2012 (edited) Thanks for the support, guys! Ricardo, the gray I used was simple Modelmaster 2036 Dark Gray. It matches perfectly with the color template I created (described in a previous post). FYI the blue colors of the above pics look slightly more vivid than they really are. I set my camera to "Museum" when taking these pics (for good lighting and focus) but it seems to intensify the colors. Marcel Edited March 23, 2012 by Marcel111 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chuck540z3 Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 Hey Marcel, I bet you are dying to rip that masking tape off the exhaust like a band-aide to see how it will all come together in an amazing combo of blue shades and metal. Me too! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Marcel111 Posted March 23, 2012 Author Share Posted March 23, 2012 Hey Marcel, I bet you are dying to rip that masking tape off the exhaust like a band-aide to see how it will all come together in an amazing combo of blue shades and metal. Me too! Chuck, you bet! Cannot wait until it all comes alive! Right now I'm laying down coats of Future but I'm seeming to need more coats than usual to get a good glossy finish, even though I'm really soaking the model. Seems the stuff is thinner than usual. Of course the nice part is that it dries so quickly so I can reapply in half an hour. Chuck, how many coats do you typically put down before washing/decalling? Marcel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chuck540z3 Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 (edited) Chuck, you bet! Cannot wait until it all comes alive! Right now I'm laying down coats of Future but I'm seeming to need more coats than usual to get a good glossy finish, even though I'm really soaking the model. Seems the stuff is thinner than usual. Of course the nice part is that it dries so quickly so I can reapply in half an hour. Chuck, how many coats do you typically put down before washing/decalling? Marcel Usually only 2 coats, but I bet I put it on thicker than most. I have a space heater next to my spray booth and I always make sure the surface I'm spraying is horizontal so it won't run. I give the surface a real wet coat to the point that it almost wants to run, then I put it near the warm air blowing from the space heater, which makes the Future "set". When I'm sure the surface won't run, I turn the model 90 degrees and then do that surface, etc. I also use about 10% Windex in the mix, because I find it sprays better and lays down flatter. I also make sure the paint is sanded down with 2000 grit sandpaper and wiped clean before I start. A slightly rough paint surface = a slightly rough Future surface. As you know when you're decaling, you can't have a smooth enough surface! One other thing: Since my Future coats are fairly thick, I make sure I place the model in a position so that nothing is touching the Future when it dries and cures for 2-3 days. Tough to do when you're spraying the entire model, but upside down with the cockpit area and tail as anchor points usually works great. Edited March 23, 2012 by chuck540z3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Marcel111 Posted March 24, 2012 Author Share Posted March 24, 2012 Thx Chuck! Usually only 2 coats, but I bet I put it on thicker than most. I have a space heater next to my spray booth and I always make sure the surface I'm spraying is horizontal so it won't run. I give the surface a real wet coat to the point that it almost wants to run, then I put it near the warm air blowing from the space heater, which makes the Future "set". When I'm sure the surface won't run, I turn the model 90 degrees and then do that surface, etc. I also use about 10% Windex in the mix, because I find it sprays better and lays down flatter. Sounds like you have a good, sophisticated setup. I'm still really getting set up over here... I also make sure the paint is sanded down with 2000 grit sandpaper and wiped clean before I start. A slightly rough paint surface = a slightly rough Future surface. As you know when you're decaling, you can't have a smooth enough surface! I think this is why things are a little rougher than usual. I laid down the darker blue and gray coats very thin, since the camo pattern is hard-edge I was concerned about building up a step at the masking line, plus I was also concerned about the paint running underneath the masking tape if laid down too wet. Long story short, I didn't want to sand much before gloss coating. BTW, I am most concerend about the wash being "too dirty" if the surface is not glossy enough. Since started using Future as a decal setting solution, I have never had any silvering. Anyway, I have started washing the pylons and it's all working great. Thx goodness form Promodeller! One other thing: Since my Future coats are fairly thick, I make sure I place the model in a position so that nothing is touching the Future when it dries and cures for 2-3 days. Tough to do when you're spraying the entire model, but upside down with the cockpit area and tail as anchor points usually works great. Point taken. I have quite a few dust spots on my Flanker post the gloss coats. But they should be easy to sand off later. Marcel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Marcel111 Posted March 28, 2012 Author Share Posted March 28, 2012 Hi guys, This is where I am with my Flanker: Bottom side weathering and wash is done. However, I’m in two minds about the outcome and would really appreciate your thoughts. Is it too much of a good thing i.e. does the wash come out too strong? I don’t usually get this strong of an effect, I think that due to the panel lines not exactly being “finely engraved†on this model, the wash looks much more aggressive than it usually would. Also, the paint on the top is not all that weather-bleached, so the underside wash should correspond to that look. Here goes… and again, let me know what you think, good or bad. And now in some different lighting: Closer shot: Closer still: The wing: Cheers, Marcel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chuck540z3 Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 (edited) Not knowing what one of these eastern birds should look like underneath, I'd say that everything looks just fine, especially the wings where almost all detail is just rivets. Maybe the heavy panel lines forward of the intakes need to be toned down, based upon this pic: http://www.airliners.net/photo/Russia---Air/Sukhoi-Su-27-%28Su-27S%29/1680424/L/ I could go crazy with salt weathering under there! :P You could easily just give this area a highly thinned "mist-coat" if you want to knock it down a touch, but I think it looks terrific. What type of wash did you use? Edited March 28, 2012 by chuck540z3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Marcel111 Posted March 29, 2012 Author Share Posted March 29, 2012 Not knowing what one of these eastern birds should look like underneath, I'd say that everything looks just fine, especially the wings where almost all detail is just rivets. Maybe the heavy panel lines forward of the intakes need to be toned down, based upon this pic:http://www.airliners...S%29/1680424/L/ I could go crazy with salt weathering under there! You could easily just give this area a highly thinned "mist-coat" if you want to knock it down a touch, but I think it looks terrific. What type of wash did you use? Thanks Chuck! Wow, that’s a really weather-beaten Flanker. Note how most of the discoloration is paint fading… panel lines are still not that prominent. IMO it’s not realistic to make the panel lines stand out if the paint doesn’t look faded and appropriately blotchy. I’ll follow your suggestion and give the front a light blue mist to tone down the panel lines a little. I use Promodeller wash. Specifically, I used “Dark Dirt†on the underside and am finding it too brown. I used “Dark Dirt†on my Hornet and didn’t think it too brown then, not sure if the product has changed somewhat or if the brown tone is just more contrasted against the blue aircraft color. For the top, I have mixed “Light Dirt†with Black which results in a neutral grayâ€â€it looks spot on and I will always be using this mix going forward. Marcel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
chuck540z3 Posted March 29, 2012 Share Posted March 29, 2012 Thanks Chuck! Wow, that’s a really weather-beaten Flanker. Note how most of the discoloration is paint fading… panel lines are still not that prominent. IMO it’s not realistic to make the panel lines stand out if the paint doesn’t look faded and appropriately blotchy. I’ll follow your suggestion and give the front a light blue mist to tone down the panel lines a little. I use Promodeller wash. Specifically, I used “Dark Dirt†on the underside and am finding it too brown. I used “Dark Dirt†on my Hornet and didn’t think it too brown then, not sure if the product has changed somewhat or if the brown tone is just more contrasted against the blue aircraft color. For the top, I have mixed “Light Dirt†with Black which results in a neutral grayâ€â€it looks spot on and I will always be using this mix going forward. Marcel Great job! I also use ProModeler wash, mostly because my luck with solvent based washes have always resulted in paint erosion somewhere. I think solvent/artist oil washes do a better job because they really get into some nice tiny spots and stay there, but when you have to rub the wash off, there's ALWAYS a thin spot where the Future isn't thick enough, allowing the solvent to erode your nice new paint job. At least that's my experience. With the ProModeler stuff you never have to worry about any of that. For the panel lines and rivets, I now use only Black. If you want these areas to "pop", the dark dirt and other colors just aren't dark enough for me. Tip: If the Promodeler wash won't come off very easy, it's because you have some subtle roughness in the Future coat that is grabbing the wash. Use a soft rag with some Windex and it will come right off. You can't soak the rag or dig too much or you'll remove a lot of the Future, but when I hear of other modelers having a tough time getting ProModeler washes to come off, I know that this is the answer. If you are using it on an enamel finish, you can use some solvent to get the same results, but be very light or you'll dig through the paint. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
geedubelyer Posted March 31, 2012 Share Posted March 31, 2012 Hi Marcel, Your Flanker is getting better with each update. Thanks Chuck! Wow, that’s a really weather-beaten Flanker. Note how most of the discoloration is paint fading… panel lines are still not that prominent. IMO it’s not realistic to make the panel lines stand out if the paint doesn’t look faded and appropriately blotchy. I’ll follow your suggestion and give the front a light blue mist to tone down the panel lines a little. Marcel Generally, I'd agree with the highlighted part of your quote but there are exceptions. This is one area where reference is the key. There are probably as many opinions on this subjrect as there are modellers and since you'll be the one who is likely to see the finished article most, it makes ense to finish the jet the way you like it. There are definately places where a wash is realistic. Regularly opened access panels often have sharply defined lines around them but panel lines on the airframe are often less prominent. It would generally depend on whether you are striving for a totally "realistic" or prefer a more "artistic" rendition. FWIW, I think your model looks great! Cheers Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Marcel111 Posted March 31, 2012 Author Share Posted March 31, 2012 For the panel lines and rivets, I now use only Black. If you want these areas to "pop", the dark dirt and other colors just aren't dark enough for me. Chuck, yep, I think I'll take that route on future Tamiya and Academy kits. On this one, the panel lines are just too fat so I want to have things toned down a little. There are definately places where a wash is realistic. Regularly opened access panels often have sharply defined lines around them but panel lines on the airframe are often less prominent. It would generally depend on whether you are striving for a totally "realistic" or prefer a more "artistic" rendition. FWIW, I think your model looks great! Thx Guy. Don't get me wrong, I think you absolutely have to wash, it's just a matter of how much contrast there is, what type of airplane you're modelling and what the rest of the weathering looks like. Needless to say, your washes are spot on, since your models look exactly like the real thing when you take pics of them. So here is the top side, washed. I like the way this came out. I kept things pretty clean towards the front and then got progressivey more dirty (i.e. left on more wash residue) towards the rear... which is how I've seen it on real Flankers. Close-up: Marcel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rogier77 Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Very very nice paint job. I realy nice Ukrian Flanker your building. I had some problems with the wings on my bird. so i cut the lose and did a refit. I also find some problems with the Zacto nose. But i will not give up this build. I hope to post a little update this weekend. I am going to the Air Tatoo this summer in Fairford. So i hope to see some Flankers there. For know i will watching your Flanker Gr Rogier van den Berg Quote Link to post Share on other sites
tonal Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 It's really great to see your update Marcel on this beautifully built Flanker, everything you've set out to do speaks for its self. It gives me a great reference tool to draw on for my own future builds with eight in my stash. Your work is inspiring to say the least. Tonal Quote Link to post Share on other sites
twhite80 Posted April 4, 2012 Share Posted April 4, 2012 Pretty sweet effort here. I just love these big 1/32 Flankers. To see them in person is pretty cool. I have the UB in the closet and every time I see a Flanker done this well I just want to break it out and get started! I still have to find the space to put it though. Keep it up. This is a great thread. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Aigore Posted April 4, 2012 Share Posted April 4, 2012 Awesome paintjob!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Marcel111 Posted April 7, 2012 Author Share Posted April 7, 2012 (edited) Thx for all the encouragement, very much appreciated. Rogier, looking forward to seeing more progress on your Flanker. Our second daughter was born last week, so I obviously have very different priorities right now. Nonetheless, I had some days off work and that did enable me to get some work done. The topside is fairly flat, whereas I sprayed the bottom side slightly more satin, since the original paint seems to have been pretty glossy but weathers quickly. The decals from Linden Hill are great! Note that on Ukraine "56" there is hardy any stencilling on the top surface of the aircraft but extensive stencilling on the sides and bottom. It's as if nobody wanted to get on a ladder and get on top of the aircraft when it was stencilling time after the new paint scheme was applied. I also didn't see any stencilling on the missile pylons of "56", which is just as well, since the Linden Hill sheet doesn't feature pylon stencilling and the Trumpeter decals are useless. A close-up of the wing. I actually took this shot since I was going to ask for advice on how to fix the crinkle in the center of that roundel. However, since it is not visible in this 1:1 shot, I may just leave it, fixing it is probably not worth the risk. In this pic there is still some wash residue visible on the circumference of the roundel... I have since touched that up Close up of the underside. Note that I dry-brushed the yellow placards with light blue, else they stand out way to much IMO. Thx for looking, Marcel Edited April 7, 2012 by Marcel111 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JesniF-16 Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Seriously stunning work Marcel111... Your splinter scheme paintwork sets the standard very unreachable for most And how can you possibly add the pitot tube and all the antennas without breaking them off??? :jaw-dropping: /Jesse Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Malaquias Posted April 7, 2012 Share Posted April 7, 2012 Stunning! Simply Stunning! Magnificent work! I wish I had half of your talent... :D Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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