How do you airbrush Model Master Acryl?

[CorsairMan]

I ran out of my fav interior green from Gunze and the only thing I can find locally is Model Master Acryl interior green.

I am using an Iwata HP-B+ and I was trying to use a very thinned mix to do shadows in the cockpit. I thinned it with the Acryl thinner. I used approximately 2:1 thinner to paint.

That just didn't work at all - I would get a nice thin line and then nothing then I would have to open the needle up and get a blotch and then a thin line for a bit and then nothing.

Thinking the brush was clogged I cleaned it

No difference

Thinking the mix was 'too thin' I made it about 1:1 thinner to paint

No difference.

I cleaned the brush again

Then, as an experiment I used some Gunze, very thin.... and it worked beautifully.

So - I am doing something wrong with the paint. Should I thin it with water or alcohol?

Anyone?

[ThatJeffGuy]

Go to Wallacks and ask them for some Liquitex Flow-aid...it's a retarder and will help with the clogging. It's a known issue with

MM acrylics.

[Bob Beary]

You can also use Future to thin the Acryl. It also cuts down on tip dry and increases the bond strength of the Acryl. Experiment to get the right ratio. In general, the darker the paint the more Future you can add.

As mentioned, retarder will also help.

Bob

[CorsairMan]

I work pretty close to Wallacks so I will drop by.

I never would have thought to thin with future. Interesting idea. I'll give that a try too.

[Jamie Cheslo]

Here's another possibility for you. I have always thinned my MM Acryls with Tamiya thinner. I use the "skim milk consistency" and have never had a problem with the tip clogging. Incidentally, my airbrush is a Badger 150. HTH.

[gotarheelz14]

I have always had extremely mixed results when using MM. I find them to be extremely unpredictable and just prefer the qualities of Gunze and Tamiya overall.

I will say thought that I sprayed some MM Acryl the other day with some mixed brew thinner that I made, Isopropyl 91% with about 15% Winsor & Newton retarder, and it worked perfectly.

I simply have given up with MM acryl. I pour it on occasionally to see how the Acryl gods are doing that day and if my offer is to their liking good, if its not, on to Tamiya and Gunze again.

[CorsairMan]

Go to Wallacks and ask them for some Liquitex Flow-aid...it's a retarder and will help with the clogging. It's a known issue with

MM acrylics.

I got some of this stuff - but there is no guideline for use. Do you put in a coule drops into the mix? Do you have to dilute it before mixing?

[singeri]

Here's another possibility for you. I have always thinned my MM Acryls with Tamiya thinner. I use the "skim milk consistency" and have never had a problem with the tip clogging. Incidentally, my airbrush is a Badger 150. HTH.

I also use Tamiya X-20A thinner with MM Acryl's. Works about 90% of the time...... I pretty much go with a 1:1 mix and look for the "skim milk consistency" as well.

[ThatJeffGuy]

I got some of this stuff - but there is no guideline for use. Do you put in a coule drops into the mix? Do you have to dilute it before mixing?

You're supposed to dilute it I think. I originally got the tip from Floyd Werner's DVD and he simply added a drop to his paint cup

before spraying. I've heard some people say you're supposed to use 1-2 drops for an entire bottle....but I don't like the idea of

'contaminating' the bottle contents.

[deadmeat]

I use MM Acrylc about 70% of the time and have few issues. I think even at 1:1 thinner to paint you may be going too thin though. If I use the Testors brand of thinner I usually don't have to use too much to get a good spray. I would say get a piece of plasticard, prime it and start with unthinned paint working your way up to 1:1 to dial it in. It really is good paint!

[Miccara]

I've always struggled with M&M acrylics (although many do not). Recently I've discovered I have much better luck with Tamiya paint, generally mixing it 50/50 with rubbing alcohol and a few drops of retarder.

I have had some good results with M&M acrylics lately, by mixing it with Cutex nail polish remover (and a few drop of retarder although have done it many times without the retarder).

[TXCajun]

If I may offer a few points:

- Simply having the mix it too thin wouldn't cause spraying problems. If it did, then spraying pure thinner would do so as well. You don't say what pressure you are using. I find that my Iwata HP-CS doesn't like higher pressures (20-25) as much as lower pressures. When I spray, I am thinning the paint down to the consistency of skim milk and spraying at 8-10 psi.

- My Iwata seems to be very finicky about being clean. There are times when I think I have cleaned it well, and yet I still have spraying problems. This is only corrected when I tear it down completely and clean first in my ultrasonic jewelry cleaner and then with small swabs & pipe cleaners soaked in lacquer thinner. I then re-assemble, re-lubricate, and spray a bit of lacquer thinner through it to flush out any remaining debris. After this level of cleaning, it sprays fine.

- Having said this, I have to admit that I don't use Acrylics any more due to issues I had trying to spray them. I found MM acrylics much more prone to clog my airbrush than enamels. Since switching exclusively to enamels, I don't have the problems I had before, but others have had great success.

[cksh]

Go to Wallacks and ask them for some Liquitex Flow-aid...it's a retarder and will help with the clogging. It's a known issue with

MM acrylics.

I love liquitex. I used it with isopropyl to thin MM acryl and was able to get extremely thin lines with no clogging.

Now I use liquitex whenever I use acrylics. Just have to make sure not to use too much.

[CorsairMan]

I love liquitex. I used it with isopropyl to thin MM acryl and was able to get extremely thin lines with no clogging.

Now I use liquitex whenever I use acrylics. Just have to make sure not to use too much.

Now that is what I am talking about. Just a drop in a cup of mixed paint will do? I will try that tonight.

[zeus60]

I've always struggled with M&M acrylics (although many do not). Recently I've discovered I have much better luck with Tamiya paint, generally mixing it 50/50 with rubbing alcohol and a few drops of retarder.

I have had some good results with M&M acrylics lately, by mixing it with Cutex nail polish remover (and a few drop of retarder although have done it many times without the retarder).

I am assuming that is acetone-free nail polish remover. Is that the case?

[Isaac]

Great thread. What is a good ratio for flo-aid to alcohol?

[Miccara]

I am assuming that is acetone-free nail polish remover. Is that the case?

Nope, with acetone.

[cook7997]

Now that is what I am talking about. Just a drop in a cup of mixed paint will do? I will try that tonight.

I use a gravity feed dual-action airbrush with a 7cc cup. I usually only fill it up half way, so about 3.5 cc. I put about 3-4 drops of flow-aid in and it seems to work well. I find that when I only put 1-2 drops in, my tip will clog up on me. But then again, I like to take my time when I paint and a lot of times the wife or kids interupt. Hope this helps.

Cameron

[CorsairMan]

Well here are the results (and the results are not good)

I tried using the MM Acryl, with the MM Acryl thinner and 3 drops of flo-aid. No effect. The fine lines stop after a half inch or so.

I then tried thinning with 91% iso alcohol and 4 drops of flo-aid. It was initially better and I would say an improvement. But still intermittant clogging. I am thinning to skim milk consistency.

I then sprayed some Tamiya flat black - it went on in continuous hairlines.

MM, as soon as the interior is done, so are you.

[RichardL]

So far MM Acryl is spraying great for me, even without retarder. It sprays just as well as Gunze acrylics. I use 6:4 paint to MM Acryl thinner spraying at 18 psi through my Paasche Talon gravity feed. To me, MM Acryl seems to have finer pigment than Tamiya.

[doose]

I haven't had any problems with MM thinned with H2O out of my Iwata HP C+. I thin it to skim milk and no problems. I will try thin lines and see what happens, I have been spraying larger areas. Also, I am spraying at around 10-12psi.

Thanks for the thread.

[David Hingtgen]

I add Liquitex Flo-Aid to darn near every acrylic paint I own, from MM to cheap craft paint to Pollyscale. Straight to the bottle. I start off with like 3-5 drops for a 1/2 oz bottle, and maybe up to 15 drops for a 1oz bottle that "really needs it". It helps with hand-brushing even more than air-brushing.

[FlyingSnowmew]

I add Liquitex Flo-Aid to darn near every acrylic paint I own, from MM to cheap craft paint to Pollyscale. Straight to the bottle. I start off with like 3-5 drops for a 1/2 oz bottle, and maybe up to 15 drops for a 1oz bottle that "really needs it". It helps with hand-brushing even more than air-brushing.

Don't use it with Gunze. It will cause them to never dry. Just turns into gunk.

Works great with everything else!

Edited April 28, 2010 by Uncia Uncia

[David Hingtgen]

I have so little gunze I don't think I've tried it with it. Good thing I haven't I guess!

As for never drying---I think I had that happen recently on one of my trains that I used some craft paint on. Paint itself brushes fine, has good jar-life, but just won't get totally dry. (it's a PERFECT match, so I had to use it---it's technically dried, but still feels "tacky" and will lose gloss if handled much----maybe in a couple years it'll totally dry---I once had a very thick layer of gloss black enamel take the better part of a decade to get bone-dry)

First time I've experienced that though. I actually suspect using MM acryl thinner, more than the flow aid, as I used far more of the former.

Edited April 28, 2010 by David Hingtgen

[matrixone]

The paint might be only part of the problem, the Iwata HP-B is an excellent detail airbrush and I have found that to get the most out of it the paint must be thinned just right...and thats with enamel paints. MM Acryl might not work with an HP-B, if you can try and use an Iwata HP-C or Revolution BR if you want to stick with MM Acryl paints, the Badger 100 will also work well with MM Acryl paint.

HTH

Matrixone