1/32 MiG-23 upgrades

[fulcrum1]

I think this may be the kit and aftermarket that sways me over to 32nd scale:( Beautiful work!

[Floggerman]

Hmmm.... wonder what their thinking was? Kinda ballsy, don't you agree?

It simply met international standards (also civil!), so where's the problem?

[carrey]

Hello Zac and everyone,

Creating the patterns for the splitter plates has proven to be a real challenge (for my eyes).

I began by creating accurate drawings in Illustrator.

I machined the side profile in a chunk of plastic and spray mounted a printout of the drawings.

Then came the challenging part, the holes.

You can transfer mirrored printout onto polystirene by softly damping the paper with dissolver/dilutant (turned over so the printed drawing touches the plastic) with wet cotton swab and when paper becomes transparent - carefully removing it, leaving plastic sheet with original printed drawing on it. Experiment with different paper and dissolver for optimum results (another method: cover plastic with tamiya extra thin, print mirrored drawing on gloss paper like magazine's, put drawing on plastic, damp paper with pinen). Works good on metal sheets as well. How-to technology is © from http://www.panzer35.ru/forum/31-1587-1 and http://www.diorama.ru/forum/viewtopic.php?t=14479

Holes - why not drill them with milling machine (CNC milling on demand, anybody?)? Another way to obtain precise grid is to poke holes along guidance ruler with predrilled 1/2 holes, something like --u-u-u-u-u-u--.

PS: Just finished out-of-the-box czech MiG-23ML "Tiger"... Took me 2 weeks, kind of complicated kit. Sadly, customer asked for assembly and painting only, therefore no modifications and scrutinity on rivets etc. The gun is separate (to show the gun and ammo box on display), as are all the weapons and pylons (not pictured here); engine is mounted on cart (yes, I know I'm wrong with positioning, mishap). Decals are mostly useless (I didn't succeed in pulling them over multicurved parts, none of known "decal solutions" helped), so I took roundels, tiger head and numbers only.

Small gallery here: http://www.mediafire.com/?73ar9xtihst2p

...I wish Zactoman will release this baby and ladder in 1/32 as resin/photoetch add-on some day, the Model of the Year 2010 (I doubt Trumpeter or someone else will make something better (in all aspects, I mean) this year) definately miss her.

Edited November 8, 2010 by terrysumner

[Firecaptain]

Chris,

Will you only be issuing the back plates with only instructions for self improvement of the outer parts?

Will this be a before or after the new year release?

Thanks..

...still patiently waiting for that UB canopy fix.........

[Zactoman]

Thanks for all the encouraging comments!

You can transfer mirrored printout onto polystirene by softly damping the paper with dissolver/dilutant...

Holes - why not drill them with milling machine (CNC milling on demand, anybody?)? Another way to obtain precise grid is to poke holes along guidance ruler with predrilled 1/2 holes, something like --u-u-u-u-u-u--.

Thanks for the suggestions.

I am aware of the transfer method (I used this on my F-100 FOD cover lettering and MiG-29 tire stencil) but decided against it for this project for a couple of reasons.

With over 1400 holes to be poked the part gets a lot of handling and the transfer might have been worn away before finishing.

The other reason is that the transferred ink tends to be slightly blurred.

These holes are approx. .005" diameter and even slightly blurred would have been a big problem.

CNC would have been nice but I don't own a CNC. Subcontracting would have been expensive and time consuming and a quality gamble. I've seen some nice machining work but also experienced lots of shoddy work. More often than not sub-contracting has been a disappointing head-ache.

Pre-drilled half holes? I'm guessing you mean using something like a straight edge with notches or small saw blade and repositioning it for each row.

A couple of problems with this. First is finding or making a straight edge with the exact hole spacing. Next problem is repositioning it exactly for each row. Final problem is that the part has an angle on it and the pattern is on both surfaces so a rigid straight edge would be difficult to use.

The only other good solution I could come up with would have been to have the pattern done in photo-etch and either using it as a template to poke the holes or trying to incorporate it into the pattern.

The problem with this is mostly cost.

Trust me, I didn't enjoy doing the holes and would have much prefered an easier method... :wacko:

More on improving the intake parts.

The blades on the inside need to be reshaped but they also need to be relocated so I decided to include replacements.

[Zactoman]

Will you only be issuing the back plates with only instructions for self improvement of the outer parts?

Will this be a before or after the new year release?

Yes, the correction kit will include the 2 splitter plates, 4 replacement blades and some strip styrene.

The instructions will include tips on improving the kit intake parts (as will photos on my website).

I'd really like to offer complete replacements for the intakes but have too many other projects on my workbench that need to get done (including the family Flanker canopies!).

Edit: This should be ready for release very soon. I'm hoping to have the patterns finished and in molds in just a few days.

I'll then need to do instructions for them (as well as for the pylon set and the APU-60).

Edited November 8, 2010 by Zactoman

[loftycomfort]

... but have too many other projects on my workbench that need to get done (including the family Flanker canopies!).

My heart skips a beat everytime I hear you say "family Flanker canopies".

Terry

[carrey]

Oops, I didn't know this is a family forum, hope not to be mistaken so badly again...

I am aware of the transfer method (I used this on my F-100 FOD cover lettering and MiG-29 tire stencil) but decided against it for this project for a couple of reasons.

With over 1400 holes to be poked the part gets a lot of handling and the transfer might have been worn away before finishing.

The other reason is that the transferred ink tends to be slightly blurred.

These holes are approx. .005" diameter and even slightly blurred would have been a big problem.

Does laserjet transfer blur as well as inkjet? I didn't try myself yet, but I assume that laser toner burns into slightly dissolved plastic, but ink only glues to surface and blurs because of dilutant fluid. But, if glueing printout works - let it work.

CNC would have been nice but I don't own a CNC. Subcontracting would have been expensive and time consuming and a quality gamble. I've seen some nice machining work but also experienced lots of shoddy work. More often than not sub-contracting has been a disappointing head-ache.

I see. You told you machined some parts, so I thought you might have some 3-axis precise tool... I am very happy with mine Proxxon MF 70, helped me many times (one revolution = 1mm movement on every axis, so precise 1mm/0.5mm/0.25mm/0.125mm steps are easily done by hand, for more precision must watch the scales). By the way, micro lathe PD 230 is also helpfull, for example 17mm long ship 5" gun barrell (scale 1/192):

Pre-drilled half holes? I'm guessing you mean using something like a straight edge with notches or small saw blade and repositioning it for each row.

A couple of problems with this. First is finding or making a straight edge with the exact hole spacing. Next problem is repositioning it exactly for each row. Final problem is that the part has an angle on it and the pattern is on both surfaces so a rigid straight edge would be difficult to use.

The only other good solution I could come up with would have been to have the pattern done in photo-etch and either using it as a template to poke the holes or trying to incorporate it into the pattern.

The problem with this is mostly cost.

Trust me, I didn't enjoy doing the holes and would have much prefered an easier method...

Yes, notches I mean. You'll need just one straight edge, setsquare will give you another one, repeat for rectangle. Drawing a line of dots along each edge will provide starting points for rows (vertical edges - for reposition of rows). Straight edge with precise notch spacing can be made by photoetching. I'd choose selfmade universal template like a set of straight angles with different stepping of notches:

If photoetching could be more user-friendly and available - it's the ultimative solution, can't wait when we all be able to buy some superkit of modern jet airplane consisting of metal structure parts and photoetched panels to assemble.

Speaking of MiG-23 add-ons, what about braking chute? More precise engine aggregates? Cockpit instrument panels? UB-32-57 and B8M1 rocket pods (those in kit can't be glued accurately)?

Sorry to waste your precious time. Take care of your eyes and hands!

[MarcB]

Hello,

Another nice upgrade would be a new exhaust.On the Mig-23, at rest, the upper and lower petals of the exhaust "sag" down a lot.

Sorry can't find an online pic to illustrate the subject.

Marc B

[Flankerman]

Hello,

Another nice upgrade would be a new exhaust.On the Mig-23, at rest, the upper and lower petals of the exhaust "sag" down a lot.

Sorry can't find an online pic to illustrate the subject.

Marc B

Taken recently in Ukraine.......

Ken

[haneto]

Incredible craftmanship as always,Chris!

Another inspiration for me to build one kit because of its aftermarket goods.

Are you planning to make a new windshield?

The Trumpy one looks quite odd,especially from front view.

Keep up the art pls!

Cheers,

Yufei

[Two Mikes]

MUST HAVE!!

Thanks for doing these Chris. I can't wait to order!

Cheers

Mike

[Firecaptain]

Mike....got your Mig-23 cockpit......nice work!

[Floggerman]

Hello Zac and everyone,

You can transfer mirrored printout onto polystirene by softly damping the paper with dissolver/dilutant (turned over so the printed drawing touches the plastic) with wet cotton swab and when paper becomes transparent - carefully removing it, leaving plastic sheet with original printed drawing on it. Experiment with different paper and dissolver for optimum results (another method: cover plastic with tamiya extra thin, print mirrored drawing on gloss paper like magazine's, put drawing on plastic, damp paper with pinen). Works good on metal sheets as well. How-to technology is © from http://www.panzer35.ru/forum/31-1587-1 and http://www.diorama.ru/forum/viewtopic.php?t=14479

Holes - why not drill them with milling machine (CNC milling on demand, anybody?)? Another way to obtain precise grid is to poke holes along guidance ruler with predrilled 1/2 holes, something like --u-u-u-u-u-u--.

PS: Just finished out-of-the-box czech MiG-23ML "Tiger"... Took me 2 weeks, kind of complicated kit. Sadly, customer asked for assembly and painting only, therefore no modifications and scrutinity on rivets etc. The gun is separate (to show the gun and ammo box on display), as are all the weapons and pylons (not pictured here); engine is mounted on cart (yes, I know I'm wrong with positioning, mishap). Decals are mostly useless (I didn't succeed in pulling them over multicurved parts, none of known "decal solutions" helped), so I took roundels, tiger head and numbers only.

Small gallery here: http://www.mediafire.com/?73ar9xtihst2p

...I wish Zactoman will release this baby and ladder in 1/32 as resin/photoetch add-on some day, the Model of the Year 2010 (I doubt Trumpeter or someone else will make something better (in all aspects, I mean) this year) definately miss her.

not bad, but why did you use the wrong (K-36) seat? The correct (KM-1) is also included! Don't follow the instruction, it's wrong!

[puffer]

Zacto, very much looking forward to these Mig-23 upgrades, thanks for doing this!

And I LOVE your in-progress threads, your techniques are fascinating to see in photos, very impressive and educational!

Aaron

[carrey]

Sorry, Floggerman, K-36 seat as per instructions, had no time to investigate, if czechs changed KM-1 to K-36 or not on their airfleet (I expected such an upgrade, otherwise I see no reason for Trumpeter did so in instructions). In any case, seat is not glued, so easily can be exchanged on demand. 8)

Nevertheless now I have opportunity to make small vignette with KM-1 only. 8) If Trumpeter and/or retailers drop prices, I will buy this kit and do it slowly and properly, with all the scratch modifications that Zac shows us so kindly. I'm still very hoping for MiG-27K Kajra, the best (the most advanced) airplane of the Flogger family.

Edited November 11, 2010 by carrey

[Floggerman]

Sorry, Floggerman, K-36 seat as per instructions, had no time to investigate, if czechs changed KM-1 to K-36 or not on their airfleet (I expected such an upgrade, otherwise I see no reason for Trumpeter did so in instructions). In any case, seat is not glued, so easily can be exchanged on demand. 8)

Nevertheless now I have opportunity to make small vignette with KM-1 only. 8) If Trumpeter and/or retailers drop prices, I will buy this kit and do it slowly and properly, with all the scratch modifications that Zac shows us so kindly. I'm still very hoping for MiG-27K Kajra, the best (the most advanced) airplane of the Flogger family.

No Flogger (in service) was ever equipped with K-36 seat. No idea, what kind of "research" Trumpy did...

I paid 64,99 EUR for my ML and would be happy to avoid additional costs to build a correct model - but this is another (endless) story...

[Mstor]

Just saw this over at Luckymodel, Aires Mig-23 cockpit set:

http://www.luckymodel.com/scale.aspx?item_no=AI%202134

Mark

[Zactoman]

More on fixing up the kit intakes...

Back-tracking, fixing the top corner radius.

Step 1 - Cut

Step 2 - Remove a little material and splice a scrap of plastic in place. Build up the inside and outside of the spliced area and fill the remaining cut with superglue.

Step 3 - File and sand the inside radius to match the lower corner radius.

Step 4 - File and sand the outer radius. Note that the radius gets smaller towards the rear.

Edited November 13, 2010 by Zactoman

[Zactoman]

The fit on the stock intakes isn't great. Note the big step on the outer surface.

To fix this I added a strip of .020" styrene on the inside edges towards the rear. I then sanded them until the intake fit better.

I glued the splitter plate in the new position and filled the remaining voids.

Next step is to file and sand the filler back to a square edge.

You could call it quits and glue the thing together at this point but with a little more work you can make more improvements.

Edited November 13, 2010 by Zactoman

[Zactoman]

I filed and sanded the inside edge. Note that it goes from a square corner at the front with a gradually increasing radius. The radius then ends and the remaing surface is flush with the surface of the fuselage part.

The underside gets a similar treatment with a slightly larger radius.

For the more ambitious:

Remove some material from the platform behind the intake.

Remove even more material from the lower intake.

:wacko:

[Booga]

Excellent job on the intakes... I did mine two weeks ago and I wish I had seen your tutorial before.

[janman]

Great! Just awesome! This is The Guide for modeling Trumpeter Flogger.

You have an exceptional eye for details, Chris!

[Jennings]

Any chance of a set of complete intakes rather than just the splitter plates??

J

[Zactoman]

Any chance of a set of complete intakes rather than just the splitter plates??

Perhaps in the future but not right away.

I'd actually really like to do them but would want to start from scratch rather than modify the kit parts. This would mean months of work preparing the patterns.

I have too many other projects on the list waiting to be done.

Hopefully the suggestions I've made for modifying the kit intakes will be helpful to those who care about accuracy and are anxious to build the kit.

The modifications I've shown aren't too difficult and hopefully fun for the builder (I enjoyed re-shaping the parts).

This should be my final installment for modifying the intakes.

By previously correcting the upper corner and adding a proper radius to the outer edge a gap is now present where the front wing root attaches.

I filled the gap and added putty to the upper surface of the intake.

File, sand and rescribe.

I am using Tamiya light cure putty.

I REALLY like this stuff! It is expensive but has some big advantages over other putties.

It can be cured and ready to sand in minutes.

It files and sands like a hard plastic without chipping and can be sanded and polished to a smooth glossy surface.

It scribes just like plastic! This is what I like best about it.

A few tips about using it:

Rough the surface (or cross-hatch with a blade) as you would with any putty just to ensure that it has a better grip.

Knead the tube occasionally but don't worry if there is a little clear juice present when applying.

Apply thin layers. Thick layers won't cure inside and will cause big problems. I usually fill deeper areas with superglue and baking soda and then apply a layer of the light cure putty over the top, making sure that the final layer is thick/deep enough that when scribing I won't go through to the harder superglue surface underneath.

I hold the part close to a coiled fluorescent bulb, usually for a minute or less to cure it. The surface will still be slimy but if it doesn't take a fingernail dent then it's ready to go.

Wipe the slime off the surface with rubbing alcohol (the instructions recommend using Tamiya lacquer thinner but the alcohol work great and is much cheaper). Be sure to wipe the slime off when building up layers too, not just on the final layer before sanding.

File and sand just like regular putty.

End of product endorsement...

Want another challenging accuracy modification suggestion?

Check out this great picture on the Hunavia website. (Hunavia can be very temperamental and slow loading. Keep trying and use 'right click/open in a new window' often.)

Another good candidate for Tamiya Light Cure Putty!

I would recommend shaping and gluing a thin piece of plastic to define the very rear portion and then applying putty to build the surface up.