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GRAIL007

Balkan Rat and 439 Tiger meet joint build

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So to save some time building for this group build I decided to build the Has CF-18 and HobbyBoss F/A-18 together. Has kit will represent a Balkan Rat bird, and the HB kit will represent the 439 Tiger Meet bird.

Some pics:

Has. Hornet all laid out

CF-18models001.jpg

Another work bench pic, notice the Revell F-14 that is on hold as I await some new scribing templates

CF-18models003.jpg

HB kit spread out and I put together all the weapons, glued as much as I could

CF-18models026.jpg

First problem is the Legend cockpit shelf is warped. Broke it trying to bend it.

CF-18models013.jpg

That is not going to work, its warped, broken, and too narrow. Will transfer all little resin pieces over to the kit piece.

CF-18models022.jpg

The kit piece fits much better

CF-18models016.jpg

Thats all for now.

Edited by GRAIL007

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Good start

Man that HB kit look just like the hasegawa one ! Is it as nice from up close too ??

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Mark

Good recovery on the rear panel resin. Strange how it was so badly warped.

ALF

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So after doing that xmas thing, I am back with some progress:

I figured out the final configuration for the jets, the 439 bird is going to be in a ready to takeoff config. Canopy closed, flaps down, rudders toed in, and horizontal stabs 12 degree down, with open exhaust. I didn't have open exhaust for the hornet so it was Sprue brothers to the rescue, should be here in a couple weeks at the most. The loadout will be 3 ver with 500lb on stations 2,5 and 8, with the drop tanks (with tiger stripes) on stations 3 and 7. Thanks ALF for the info and the pics!

The Balkan rat will carry 2x LGB, and will be in a parked config, canopy open screens off.

Some onto the pics:

Cutting the Has hornet to fit the Aires cockpit.

DEC23modelpics015.jpg

Fitting said cockpit, this takes a while:

DEC23modelpics018.jpg

Needs a trim, the resin piece is too wide.

DEC23modelpics012.jpg

Fits better now:

DEC23modelpics016.jpg

Aires cockpit primed:

dec29159.jpg

Thats it for now!

Edited by GRAIL007

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Good start

Man that HB kit look just like the hasegawa one ! Is it as nice from up close too ??

Both kits are pretty good, but the Hobby Boss doesn't have some of the features of the Hasegawa kit:

No chaff dispensers on the HB kit, on the Has. kit they are metal etch, no such thing on the HB kit they aren't even depicted.

The HB kit's searchlight lense is in the kit, but it is smaller than the HAS's searchlight lense

There are no clear plastic pieces for the red/green position lights under the wings in the HB kit, even though there are places for them on the plastic

The HB kit's Hud projector lense is square, it should be round like on the HAS kit

Some picks:

the cockpit front panels: Has kit piece on the right, has more detail and is raised, HB kit's is more flat.

dec29142.jpg

Metal etch is done for the HB kit, (using the HAS kit panel, because of the more realistic depth)

dec29164.jpg

Searchlight for the Balkan Rat is done, I had to make an enclosure to hold the light and also angled the light forward and up. Maybe a bit exagerated but I wanted for people to see the effect.

dec29155.jpg

HUD projector on the HB kit replaced by the resin one from the Legend cockpit set.

dec29161.jpg

Thats it for now, thanks for looking.

cheers

Mark

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Nice Enzo poster.

The MFDs/Instruments on the completed panel, are those photo etch or decals? Looks sharp!

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Nice Enzo poster.

The MFDs/Instruments on the completed panel, are those photo etch or decals? Looks sharp!

You have a very good eye to pick out the Enzo poster with only a little bit of the car actually showing. The Panel is photo etch, I'm thinking though the bottom MFD is probably too colourful, but with a closed canopy it will be harder to see anyway.

cheers

Mark

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You have a very good eye to pick out the Enzo poster with only a little bit of the car actually showing. The Panel is photo etch, I'm thinking though the bottom MFD is probably too colourful, but with a closed canopy it will be harder to see anyway.

cheers

Mark

Mark

The bottom MFD (the HSI) is not too colourful. Normally, it has a moving map on it, which is full of colour. The latest display hardware has a full-colour moving map that covers the whole display area. Here is what it looks like over Nellis (Las Vegas is the purple colour at the top).

IMGP5419.jpg

IMGP5433.jpg

Here is a cockpit shot over the Bagotville area. The sim is undergoing maintenance - that's why the side panel is missing.

IMGP5554.jpg

Looking nice - I like the way you're taming the resin.

ALF

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Mark

The bottom MFD (the HSI) is not too colourful. Normally, it has a moving map on it, which is full of colour. The latest display hardware has a full-colour moving map that covers the whole display area. Here is what it looks like over Nellis (Las Vegas is the purple colour at the top).

IMGP5419.jpg

Looking nice - I like the way you're taming the resin.

ALF

So did the 439 Tiger Meet bird have colour MFD?

Talking about resin here is an in progress shot of the Balkan Rat instrument panel, most of the buttons are done, colouring the MFDs comes next.

CF-18model31DEc008.jpg

So ALF when did they switch from the old style exhaust pedals (Left) to the newer style? (Right)

CF-18model31DEc011.jpg

Thanks for looking!

Mark

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So did the 439 Tiger Meet bird have colour MFD?

Talking about resin here is an in progress shot of the Balkan Rat instrument panel, most of the buttons are done, colouring the MFDs comes next.

CF-18model31DEc008.jpg

So ALF when did they switch from the old style exhaust pedals (Left) to the newer style? (Right)

CF-18model31DEc011.jpg

Thanks for looking!

Mark

Mark

Sorry, I got confused between your builds and Ken Middleton's. He is doing a CF-18AM (post ECP 583), which has the full-colour displays.

The 439 bird would have had the old-style moving map, which we used to call the 'fish bowl'. It was a circular shape, and only visible from the proper pilot eye point. Its colours tended to be washed out, because it was a bunch of microfilm that was mechanically scanned, and the main maps (i.e. the ones most commonly displayed, like the airfields at Bagotville, Cold Lake, and Baden) were often quite washed out. You can see that this pic (taken in the old simulator, just off ideal pilot eye point) shows the round shape of where the moving map is, and shows well just how dim and difficult to see it could be off angle.

SimMIP.jpg

This close-up shows what it looks like at the proper eye point (taken on the ground at Bagotville, facing South on the ramp).

P1090590.jpg

The FLIR display looks like this in the legacy CF-18 (i.e. Balkan Rat):

SimFLIRRDDI.jpg

For screens off, there are some techniques that look pretty good. One I use on the large Academy kit is to paint the background plastic black, then use green permanent marker on the glass, to give an impression of a green CRT shut off. I've also seen some good ones with flaky shiny stuff glued in place. With the one you have, you may want to try a silver background, coloured over with clear dark green (say magic marker) to make it look wavy and dark green. It's similar to what I do to make nav lights when the kit has them moulded in opaque plastic.

The exhaust petal switchover happened in the early 90s. The 439 colour bird could have had either or a mix of both, based on the era. The Balkan Rat most likely would have had the newer style (overlapping).

Sorry to confuse the issue with the moving maps!

ALF

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Mark

Sorry, I got confused between your builds and Ken Middleton's. He is doing a CF-18AM (post ECP 583), which has the full-colour displays.

The 439 bird would have had the old-style moving map, which we used to call the 'fish bowl'. It was a circular shape, and only visible from the proper pilot eye point. Its colours tended to be washed out,

For screens off, there are some techniques that look pretty good. One I use on the large Academy kit is to paint the background plastic black, then use green permanent marker on the glass, to give an impression of a green CRT shut off. I've also seen some good ones with flaky shiny stuff glued in place. With the one you have, you may want to try a silver background, coloured over with clear dark green (say magic marker) to make it look wavy and dark green. It's similar to what I do to make nav lights when the kit has them moulded in opaque plastic.

The exhaust petal switchover happened in the early 90s. The 439 colour bird could have had either or a mix of both, based on the era. The Balkan Rat most likely would have had the newer style (overlapping).

Sorry to confuse the issue with the moving maps!

ALF

Hi ALF,

I have a set of open exhaust coming for the 439 bird and they are the newer style, so it is possible for them to have been used. Thats good to know.

I've been working on the resin cockpit with the screens off, and what I use is a silver paint with thinned down Tamiya Clear Green to give that effect. Will post pics soon, I think it looks pretty good. I'm off to do some New Year's stuff, back in a bit!

cheers

Mark

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You have a very good eye to pick out the Enzo poster with only a little bit of the car actually showing. The Panel is photo etch, I'm thinking though the bottom MFD is probably too colourful, but with a closed canopy it will be harder to see anyway.

cheers

Mark

Hey Mark thanks, what can I say, cars and planes are my two favorite means of man-machine interface!

The Balkan Rat could pose some interesting opportunities for adding character to the jet. Cant remember the source, but I recall several jets came back with mangled refueling probes, or the probe door gone, thanks to the short hose at the end of the boom on the KC-135. Several jets picked up probe 'kill' markings on the right side. I think some jets even sported probe doors finished only in primer untill such time as they could be painted. Doing the door in green primer could add a neat element to the build.

If anyone has more concrete info, please chip in.

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Hey Mark thanks, what can I say, cars and planes are my two favorite means of man-machine interface!

The Balkan Rat could pose some interesting opportunities for adding character to the jet. Cant remember the source, but I recall several jets came back with mangled refueling probes, or the probe door gone, thanks to the short hose at the end of the boom on the KC-135. Several jets picked up probe 'kill' markings on the right side. I think some jets even sported probe doors finished only in primer untill such time as they could be painted. Doing the door in green primer could add a neat element to the build.

If anyone has more concrete info, please chip in.

I love Maranello cars as much as Canadian Planes too.

I did my 1/48 Balkan Rat as fuselage number 188795. According to the Leading Edge instruction sheet, they did say to paint the IFR door in primer green, which I did.

12.jpg

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Here is an update, I have been working on the cockpits for a bit, one of the most tedious projects because of the small scale. With the use of a very big magnifying glass detailing the cockpits is much easier. Another first for me was the full resin cockpit I put into the hornets, the Aires cockpit was more of a challenge because of the tight fit and it also has the full cowling as resin. The other resin cockpit which is a Legend cockpit is the cockpit tub and instrument panel so it is a bit easier to fit.

Some pics:

The ejection seats with some colour and some drybrushing, decals and finishing to come. The cockpit tub behind is the HB one that I am not using.

6JanModelpics001.jpg

The Aires ejection seat with Eduard photo-etch, but the grey colour of the photo-etch doesn't match the rest of the seat. Will need to blend it in.

6JanModelpics003.jpg

Blended leaving the warning sign detail

6JanModelpics005.jpg

Took a big step, I finally glued the resin cockpit into the Has. kit and glued the fuselage halves together. This took plenty of dry-fitting, shaving, sanding, etc. But the cockpit is nicely fit in, metal etch strips will make up the cockpit sills.

6JanModelpics012.jpg

Thats for looking!

-Mark

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Mark

Nice work on the cockpits. I like the Aires seat - and you did well to tone down that lighter gray to closer to the black of the seat. I also like the displays - they look quite realistic in their shut-off state.

ALF

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Mark

Nice work on the cockpits. I like the Aires seat - and you did well to tone down that lighter gray to closer to the black of the seat. I also like the displays - they look quite realistic in their shut-off state.

ALF

Thanks ALF! Now I have another question for you or those that know. What colour of flightsuits were we wearing in 1992? I was thinking probably the blue, correct? What colour were the gloves, harness, and t-shirts?

I had painted the pilot for the Tigermeet bird green, but then I was thinking that wasn't right we had blue flightsuits.

Thanks for the help!

Edited by GRAIL007

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Thanks ALF! Now I have another question for you or those that know. What colour of flightsuits were we wearing in 1992? I was thinking probably the blue, correct? What colour were the gloves, harness, and t-shirts?

I had painted the pilot for the Tigermeet bird green, but then I was thinking that wasn't right we had blue flightsuits.

Thanks for the help!

Mark

Finally, and easy question... In 92, most guys had the dark blue flight suits. Some still had some older tan ones, and some might even have a dark green one hanging around - but they were rare by then. I'd go with dark blue.

Gloves were transitioning to the ugly lime green colour (probably to discourage people stealing them to wear when driving their Honda Civics...). There were still lots of dark brown ones around in '92. My choice would be brown.

Harness colours are well covered here on ARC:

http://www.aircraftresourcecenter.com/tnt1...ford/tnt100.htm

For the survival vest, I can't remember when we ditched the orange Mae West and went to the green one, but I think in '92 we still had the orange one with yellow maritime lanyard like this older shot:

2cf18slnd.jpg

I think they still used the orange Mae West in '92.

Finally, a 439'er would have worn a yellow t-shirt, sometimes turtleneck, and sometimes low collar.

ALF

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Mark

I think they still used the orange Mae West in '92.

Finally, a 439'er would have worn a yellow t-shirt, sometimes turtleneck, and sometimes low collar.

ALF

So the final colours will be Orange Mae West, yellow T, Dark blue flight suit, and brown gloves. I was planning to add the pilot later in the build but because it is so tight in the cockpit I have to add him now. So it is a mad rush to finish all the cockpit stuff for the 439 bird. I've never added the pilot to the plane so its another lesson or two in building model aircraft. Its taken a ton of time to fit him in with the resin cockpit and photoetch. But I need to get it done because the Aires open nozzles are here, which means I can start putting the HB fuselage together. The HAS. one is already together and I would like to build boths planes together for comparison purposes.

6JanModelpics016.jpg

cheers

Mark

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Great work Mark. They're coming along nicely. I have a HB kit in the stash so I'll be checking in for updates on you progress. I've already built a Hasegawa Hornet and I was impressed. I have a partially built Revell "Blue Angels" Hornet and it's fighting me quite a bit. Building that one in stops and starts.

Nice yo have a resident Canadian Hornet expert in our midst, isn't it? A veritable treasure trove of information, he is.

Nice photo, sir ALF. Self portrait?

Mike

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Just like pretty much every Canadian kid dreaming of being a fighter pilot in the past 20 years could tell you, thats an image from from John McQuarrie's book "Canadian Fighter Pilot". I went through it cover to cover once or twice in my youth.... :lol:

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Great work Mark. They're coming along nicely. I have a HB kit in the stash so I'll be checking in for updates on you progress. I've already built a Hasegawa Hornet and I was impressed. I have a partially built Revell "Blue Angels" Hornet and it's fighting me quite a bit. Building that one in stops and starts.

Nice yo have a resident Canadian Hornet expert in our midst, isn't it? A veritable treasure trove of information, he is.

Nice photo, sir ALF. Self portrait?

Mike

Mike

Glad to be of assistance. I especially enjoy it when people put my hints to good use - kind of modeling vicariously, if you will. That pic is not a self-portrait. Nerd is definitely right about one thing - the pic I posted is from the photo session that ended up in Canadian Fighter Pilot on page 88 and 89. Looking closely, though, it isn't one of those (it was taken moments before the small one on page 89). I don't know how it found its way into my pictures folder - maybe the author shared some pics with DND, and I picked it up from there? Hopefully it isn't bothering anyone that I've posted it here - I can remove it now that it has served its purpose if anyone insists.

That book is a classic! I love leafing through it. I recognize lots of faces, and some photos like the large one on page 101 (a bunch of 421 pilots whooping it up on the patio at the Mess in Baden) bring back such happy memories that I feel pangs of regret that Baden and its Mess are gone forever...

ALF

Edited by ALF18

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Thanks ALF! Now I have another question for you or those that know. What colour of flightsuits were we wearing in 1992? I was thinking probably the blue, correct? What colour were the gloves, harness, and t-shirts?

I had painted the pilot for the Tigermeet bird green, but then I was thinking that wasn't right we had blue flightsuits.

Thanks for the help!

On page 68-69 of 'Wings of Change' by Steve Will-- 'Swill'-- there is a pic of Tiger 188764, and the pilot is wearing a tan suit--plain as day.

On page 103 of same book--pilot is in the cockpit of '764' in a green suit, and page 44-45 pilot of Tiger 188769 appears to wear a blue suit(could be green??).

Page 121 is a squadron shot of aircrew with '764 and Fang the mascot--18 green suits, 9 blue suits, and one olive (British) style suit.

So, take your pic, I guess in '92 there was still a good number of green and tan suits still used.

Cheers, Tony

Edited by Snowbird3a

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Nice book suggestions guys, found Canadian Fighter Pilot on Amazon pretty cheap, no luck with "Wings of Change" though. I remember flipping through Canadian Fighter Pilot when I was younger, but I don't even remember where!

So here is one of the pictures of the Tiger Meet jet I am using, so I went with the blue flight suit, orange Mae West, and brown gloves.

CF-18A_188764_439sqwwwTheWallpapersorg.jpg

Will post pics of the pilot soon, I was almost done and ready to glue the cockpit into the jet when I decided to test fit the canopy. So it ends up that the hasegawa pilot is huge! I couldn't close the canopy, so out came the glued in seat/pilot and hack off a layer from the bottom of the seat. It fits now, but it too a lot of time to fix.

Well better to fix it now than later, when the fuselage is glued together!

cheers

Mark

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