Shawn M Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 i had much higher hopes for that video then what it panned out to be Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PGB Posted February 16, 2011 Share Posted February 16, 2011 The wall-mounted ammunition box and feed, as roughly represented in the Monogram kit, were fitted from Boeing Block B-17G-1-BO through to the middle of Block 105-BO. Quite how the Vega and Douglas blocks correspond to the Boeing ones I can't recall I'm afraid. All the reference photos I've seen with the gun-mounted boxes on the radio-room gun were on B-17Fs. Hope that helps, PB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kostucha Posted February 16, 2011 Author Share Posted February 16, 2011 Certainly does PB! And welcome to ARC! Hope you enjoy it here. Cheers, Mark. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Prop Duster Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Mark you could just stick anything in and call it anything and it would look and sound believable on this project. I have to keep reminding myself this is a diorama of a aircraft under re-construction not just the AC. Revell must be crying in their beer that their new model is so outclassed--------- too bad he he he Quote Link to post Share on other sites
100th BG Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 Hi Mark, couple of little things for ya. On the right side of the radio room were two oxygen regulators, with their associated gauges. Each of those postions would also have a suit heat outlet and an interphone box. The ammo box Monogram provides for the radio gun was standard from the mid F production through the G's. Didn't matter if the gun was ring mounted or mounted through the window. Wiht that little bit of weathering, the structure looks soooo REAL! that is really great!!! Keep going... ;) . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
100th BG Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 Too late to do you any good, but here is a bomb rack from the Memphis Belle. The shackles attached to the bomb and the shackle hung on the hooks. The shackle would have a couple of levers that fit in the arms on the release unit. One armed the bomb (by retaining the arming wire) and the other released it. Everything you ever wnated to know and then some about shackles: A-4 release: Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kostucha Posted February 19, 2011 Author Share Posted February 19, 2011 That's some GREAT info Karl! Thank you very much! Oddly enough I would have thought that the heated flight suit electrical outlet would have been on the left side (same as the table for the Radio Operator) or would there have been two (one on each side?), same with the oxygen regulator. It's no issue to add these details, and I certainly would like to if they indeed were there. Cheers! Mark. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
100th BG Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 There was an oxygen regulator, suit heat outlet, and interphone box on the left side for the radio operator and then there were two of each on the right side as well. In the earlier airplanes, there were a couple of seats there (like in the photos Steve has of the E) and so each person needed all of the connections to the airplane systems. The seats were there from the factory through at least the early F's (like the Belle) but they were removed in combat. I am not sure at this point if they were ever in the G's. (I left them out of the Revell G I am working on.) I do know they do not appear in the G Parts manual or Pilot's manual. The extra regulators and such were handy in case someone was wounded, or they just wanted to hang out there before they actually got into combat. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kostucha Posted February 19, 2011 Author Share Posted February 19, 2011 (edited) SUPERB!!! THANKS!!! This delay in building this week since the last update (for a number of reasons) turned out to be a great thing. The week has been long - my first course graduated, very proud of them - a few other minor things like packing everything into the open corner where I build models to install a new water heater, etc... So, the plan to build up the remainder of the items that Karl has so generously provided the information for will be built in tonight. What's left: 2 x oxygen regulators 2 x oxygen hoses 2 x oxygen lines 2 x interphone boxs 2 x suit heat outlets + applicable electrical wires. Now it's just a matter of hopefully finding some good reference pictures of the setup. If not, I'll use my best guess as to how I think it would be set up. Although this picture that Karl put up helps a great amount: Should be able to have it all finished and done tonight. Cheers! Mark. Edited February 19, 2011 by Kostucha Quote Link to post Share on other sites
100th BG Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 This shows one of the regulators in the radio compartment. Don't forget, where there is a regulator, there are two instruments, one showing pressure and one showing flow. Also in this photo are the heat controls. This is for the hot air system that did not appear until late in production and would not have been on LMM. The Tokyo tank controls would have been on LMM, but there were two different types. One had the controls as shown (and mounted slightly different on the left side) and the other style had them mounted in the bombay. I have no way to determine which style was on LMM, so we can just say they were in the bombay :( ! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kostucha Posted February 19, 2011 Author Share Posted February 19, 2011 Superb. None of this requires the bulkhead to be in place to get it done. That's what I like to see... hahaha... Oh, I'm going to have fun tonight. Cheers! Mark. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
100th BG Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 (edited) Here are a couple of picture from the G dash 1 showing the area around the radio operators table. And there are those pesky Tokyo tank valves again! In the first picture it shows a command radio dynamotor mounted above the table. This is a late G. In the earlier airplanes, like LMM, it was mounted on the right side of the floor up against (nearly) bulkhead 5. Here is a picture of the unit, although I think I can come up with something better: Here is a view of the radio operators area from the F. Other than the fabric lining, the ash tray, and I think that overhead light, this would be the type of equipment in an early G: In the above picture is a regulator for the constant flow oxygen system used in early airplanes like the Belle. Very different from the demand regulators in later birds. It is interesting to note in this picture that the rubber matting is not installed. There are no absolutes! Edited February 19, 2011 by 100th BG Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kostucha Posted February 19, 2011 Author Share Posted February 19, 2011 Karl, Thanks! I'm going to be making the Tokyo Tank Shutoff Valves inside the radio room, as the bomb bay is already done. Wow, a whole heck of a lot more than I was expecting to have to do, but I'm certainly looking forward to it. Boy oh boy there is A LOT missing from AM sets... especially considering that there is a bigger than usual window... of all the sections to view the various rooms in the B-17, the Radio Room is the easiest to see. Even though the nose has the big plexiglass window, it's right at the front, leaving things in depth (such as the items around the Navigators table) difficult to see, and so on and so forth... the Radio Operators room has a huge plexiglass window right at the top giving a great view of everything, especially if you're doing one with a sliding/removed plexiglass window. C'est la vie.. given that the door on Bulkhead No. 6 is opened, along with the plexiglass window, the door on bulkhead No. 5 and the bomb bay, a lot (if not all) of the radio room will be visible... so, this section is going to be a blast to do. Thanks Karl for all your help! Mark. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kostucha Posted February 19, 2011 Author Share Posted February 19, 2011 With regards to the bomb racks, I'll still make the other outter one the same and possibly the inner ones, however, I'll be working on making the right parts for the 'F'. I think it's been set in stone that I'll be doing the 1/48 B-17F... and certainly one from the Bloody 100th... just a matter of when. As for this build... its still a "lesson learned" project, in that sure, I'm trying to make as much accurate progress on this build, but, things are still being learned (for example, the cockpit sidewalls for one)... Anywho, I'm going to get some stuff together, and get myself prepped to tackle the missing items on the radio room wall and hopefully wrap up the Starboard side tonight. Cheers! Mark. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
100th BG Posted February 19, 2011 Share Posted February 19, 2011 (edited) Well, if you want to put the Tokyo tank valves in the bombay, they appear to be a little easier to make. They were on either side of the bulkhead 5 door: Of course, you wouldn't want to take the easy way out, would you :P ! Edited February 19, 2011 by 100th BG Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kostucha Posted February 19, 2011 Author Share Posted February 19, 2011 Karl, you know me better than that! Hahahaha. It's nice to finally have definite options with something though. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Shawn M Posted February 20, 2011 Share Posted February 20, 2011 Im amazed and the ref. material popping up in this thread. The build is exquisite as well! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kid Charlemagne Posted February 20, 2011 Share Posted February 20, 2011 I can't wait until it's done! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kostucha Posted February 20, 2011 Author Share Posted February 20, 2011 Shawn, I'm blown away at the information being provided by so many folks, Karl, Stephen, and many others have made my life a whole lot easier, and hopefully this helps others as well! KC, Neither can I! Neither can I... Well, work on giving the starboard side of the radio room a little more started and went well. Work tonight started with this: All the back parts for the two oxygen systems (scratch built), interphone boxes (eduard extra PE pieces), suit heater selector boxes (eduard extra PE pieces), the Tokyo Tank controls (scratch built), and all the electrical lines, oxygen lines, etc (scratch built) started with the backing pieces: I managed to get a couple extra oxygen regulator pieces as well (the round black piece with the red tab) from leftovers of Eduard PE sets... made life a lot easier: The ammo box itself was an Eduard piece, but all the mounting/support pieces are made from scrap PE fret... thin easy to work with metal: The upper cables for the life raft system are built in only to this point. Once the upper pieces of the plexiglass window and frame (for the small piece of plexiglass) are in, the rest of it will be put in complete with the mounting plate and pull levers: Just a fun shot from above through the upper window opening (that will be fully open): The radio room as it is now: And all the work complete* waiting for the next step... port side!!: *The only thing that may be left to add are two oxygen hoses. I'm waiting to find out if they were in there or not, as they are spare regulators on that side, I'm not sure if they would have had them. If they did, I might do 1 of 2 things: 1. Mount them in (much the same as in the nose and in the cockpit), or 2. "Unhook" them and either leave them on the radio room floor, or on the 'table' outside the fuselage on the diorama base that has some other bits from the radio room itself. We'll see... Anywho, it does look a bit more busy now, which asthetically and to the model builders eye I'm happy about. As mentioned, the next step is the port side... that's going to be a bit tricky, as the first thing to be done will likely be the bulkhead alignment, and then mounting the bulkheads to the port side fuselage half and continue to build the port side just as the starboard side - front to back. However, this side has a heck of a lot more little bits to add in (Navigator side, and Radio Operator as well). Fun as always! Cheers, Mark. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
B-17 guy Posted February 20, 2011 Share Posted February 20, 2011 Damn.....it's look like the real deal in there almost! One thing I though of when looking at your pics, are you going to be able to get your wing attatchments into the fuselage? I was very upset when I had a hard time with that with my last 2 forts. You may want to check that before you close up the fuselage and run into that problem. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kostucha Posted February 20, 2011 Author Share Posted February 20, 2011 Damn.....it's look like the real deal in there almost! One thing I though of when looking at your pics, are you going to be able to get your wing attatchments into the fuselage? I was very upset when I had a hard time with that with my last 2 forts. You may want to check that before you close up the fuselage and run into that problem. Thank you very much! I learned a lot dealing with the framing and more specifically how I glue it. The joint between the pieces of plastic and the fuselage itself isn't as crisp as it should be. Reasons for that... impatience, the wrong way of applying the glue, and mainly, not lining up the runners properly. These things wouldn't be so bad if the interior colour was painted OD or another flat green, but the silver really brings it out. These are all lessons I'll be using when making the other half of the radio room, as well as the aft section of fuselage. I do appreciate your compliments though, thanks! As for the wing joint - as the wings & fuselage are going to be supported by not only the 2 MLG wheels, but jack stands throughout, I opted not to give two hoots about the wing joint setup (of pushing in and sliding forward. Rather, the wing joint is going to be sanded down to where the tabs will slip in, and not pass through the openings in the fuselage, as well as using a generious amount of both thick and thin CA glue will be what's keeping them onto the fuselage. I've dealt with issues with it in the past, and said "nope!" not dealing with that system this time. However, thanks for the heads up, and yes, anytime you do want to use the full tabs that are molded (a really sound design for the kit being make OOB or with a closed bomb-bay), always test fit those suckers. Cheers! Mark. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Army_Air_Force Posted February 20, 2011 Share Posted February 20, 2011 We're almost 1/3 of the way through the group build, and while your B-17 is looking really good, you've still got a long way to go making accessories, so no time for slacking just yet! Just think of how good the next one will be with everything you've discovered building this one. Perhaps when you do your 100th BG B-17F, I'll be ready to do my 100th Fort, "Hang The Expense"? Since mine will be a cutaway, I'm following your detailing and making notes of the errors you've found so hopefully I won't get caught out. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
100th BG Posted February 20, 2011 Share Posted February 20, 2011 WOW, all I can say is I am amazed and impressed by your progress. That looks fantastic! I'm only sorry I will never get to see it in person... And yes, the regulaors would have a section of hose attached. A section of hose was clamped to the regulator and then there was a connection for the crewmans hose on the other end (did that make sense?). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kostucha Posted February 20, 2011 Author Share Posted February 20, 2011 We're almost 1/3 of the way through the group build, and while your B-17 is looking really good, you've still got a long way to go making accessories, so no time for slacking just yet! Just think of how good the next one will be with everything you've discovered building this one. Perhaps when you do your 100th BG B-17F, I'll be ready to do my 100th Fort, "Hang The Expense"? Since mine will be a cutaway, I'm following your detailing and making notes of the errors you've found so hopefully I won't get caught out. Who knows! Hopefully eh? Well, if this build can help you or anyone else, than that makes me really happy knowing posting things as a build-in-progress is worth while. I know that the other fuselage half will take me into at least March, however, given that the rest of the forward section of the bomber (such as the MLG wells, and the engine details) wont take nearly as long, and that the tail gun is about 95% complete, the major thing to make is the aft fuselage section - but it's short, cylindrical (for the most part) and wont have nearly all the details the forward half does. Most of the work will be done around the tail wheel... shouldn't take long at all to make that half. It'll be a sudden rush near the end, I know it will... but, then again, 6 months isn't such a long period of time. WOW, all I can say is I am amazed and impressed by your progress. That looks fantastic! I'm only sorry I will never get to see it in person... And yes, the regulaors would have a section of hose attached. A section of hose was clamped to the regulator and then there was a connection for the crewmans hose on the other end (did that make sense?). Karl thank you very much! Who knows if you will or wont... my travelling circus show goes all over the place, and really, your stompin' grounds aren't that far away. As for the info on the hoses, that's excellent! I know what I'll be makin' tonight! Once those hoses are done, aside from the details that need to wait until the bulkheads and fuselage halves are in place, the only thing that needs to be done is the installation of the windows and the cheek gun assembly. I'll be waiting as long as I can before doing that (it will be a delicate process so the longer I can wait out, the better my chances are of not damaging anything. Anywho, hopefully some progress shots this afternoon, not tonight... Thanks again everyone, Cheers, Mark. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Kostucha Posted February 20, 2011 Author Share Posted February 20, 2011 The hoses... I start out using 0.75mm solder as a core, and then wrap around the thin copper wire I used from a burned out electric motor: I make sure that I wrap the wire around the solder as tight as possible, even though it's fairly difficult to get the right look when bent (as the copper wire spreads out quite a bit on a sharp bend), it will help ensure that the bends are nice and smooth: I use a set length of 2 cm for every section of hose. I'm not sure if that's 100% accurate or not, looking through reference pictures and using a string on my screen to reference the length, 2 cm in 1/48 comes out fairly close (comes out to about a scale 36-37 inch long piece of hose... Karl, Steve, am I close?). Annywho, making it a set 2 cm long hose would make life easy throughout the bomber as each length of hose will be the same: Having a bit of fun, and some imagination, I started to shape the unpainted hose lengths to match up with the area around them. Doing each hose by itself will allow for each one to look a little different, as I ensure to make it conform as much as the real one would to various shapes of frame and items mounted to the frame that the hose would run over top of: Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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