Phil marchese Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 There is a lot of confusion about the Ford S curve, a term Al Blue used in his great 70's publication, The B-24 Liberator. I've become an " Accidental Historian" of the B-24, preferring the B-25 to the Liberator,. However, by default, I've been heavily involved with keeping an eye the B24Bestweb site over the past dozen years, trying to get the Best "better." Soon after the BBW formed its research team, I sent them a tool to help them avoid the more common mistakes that appeared all to frequently. It is still linked to BBW at the nose turret radio button but not maintained. Since I fear the whole B-24 development story is about to get a whole lot messier, lets get the S curve down to its simple four basics. the full ID tool is at http://www.7thbg.org/B24Recco3chg.htm The S Curve The Ford assembly pool consisted of Ford Willow Run who both manufactured and assembled the B-24; and two assemblers of Ford kits (KDs). Those were Douglas Tulsa (DT) and a shared produciton line at the famous CONVAIR, Fort Worth plant (CF). The manufacturing feature nicknamed the S curve ( nose turret fairing) appears on only those planes manufactures by Ford, regardless of which of the three(3) plants did the final assembly. The full production introduction of the S curve began with the H series of the B-24 model bomber. As such, H-FO, H-DT and H-CF have the S- Curve. Next came the J-401-CF and the blocks J-1 and J-5 at FO and DT. The distingusihing H nose disappeared with the J series. A simplfied 3 piece lower nose glazing replace the five piece unique to the H series. That five (5) piece lower nose is the hallmark of an H-series B-24. The full S curve remained during this simplification. The B-24H through the J-5 often had a modification to add one bomb scan window to each side, usually as a verically orientated trapizod. Thus the combat H often had a 7 piece lower nose. The J-10- FO and DT ( CF was out of the pool by then) incorporated the bomb scan windows as triangular panels intergral to the lower nose. The full S curve was still in use. With the advent of the Ford B-24L series ( DT was also deleted as a pool source); the full S curve ceased. With the same intergral bomb scan windows as the latter J, the lower portiion of the S curve under the nose and forward of the landing gear doors was deleted as vistigal. Thus the B-24 L and M had only partial S-curves. When the famous Ford bay navigator's window of elongated shape appeared at block L-15, another part of the middle of the S curve gets paneled over leaving mostly the upper half as readily visiable. This continued through both major configurations of the Ford B-24M: Block 1-15 with the traditional cockpit canopy; and the block 20 to 30-FO with the V windscreen and over-head escape hatches. In Summanry: 1. The H had the full S curve and the five piece lower nose. This is exclusive to the H series. 2. The J series continued with the full S curve but with a much simplified lower nose glazing. 3. The L and M series dispensed with the lowest portion of the S curve, so not longer was there a full S curve. 4. With the bay navigator's window at L-15 thru the end of the M series, the panel framing of that window covers the middle portion of the S curve, making it a little less distingushable, yet the uppet potion is still a FORD hallmark. 5. Neither the N-FO , nor the L/M-CO; nor any other production version of the B-24 from any other source had the S curve. One, two, three, four...simple. Phil Marchese All rights reserved, 2000 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Steve N Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Great info..thanks! SN Quote Link to post Share on other sites
luke Posted January 15, 2011 Share Posted January 15, 2011 tagged! thanks. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Phil marchese Posted January 18, 2011 Author Share Posted January 18, 2011 (edited) http://www.b24bestweb.com/lrw-beaufortbelle1.htm A radar weather ship of 655 Sq based on an early L-FO befoe the bay window. Note the simplified lowe nose glazing as compared to the H series and the the intergral bomb scan window which are in the position of the modified & piece H bomb scans, not the anhled pices of the factory H series 5 piece nose. Careful examiniation will disclose the absence of the last lip of the S curve than on the J-10/20 still when half ways back into the area before the nose gear bay. http://www.b24bestweb.com/lrw-beaufortbelle4.htm The 98 series project number applies to planes in support to the 20th AF, HQ. AAF. Note the factory block 10 has been " one upped" to reflect a modification, i.e. block 11. PCM All Rights Reserved 1987;1999. Provided for indivdual, non-profit reserch use only. (sorry but I been advice to continue using this statement- it does not limit the modeler's personal use under normal conditions.) Edited January 18, 2011 by Phil marchese Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Phil marchese Posted January 18, 2011 Author Share Posted January 18, 2011 (edited) http://www.b24bestweb.com/594-v2.htm The simplified early J-FO, still with full S curve and the added ( modified) trapazoid bomb scan window in the S curve paneling. It is not the rear portion of the side glazing. PCM All rights Reserved 1999 Edited January 18, 2011 by Phil marchese Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Phil marchese Posted January 28, 2011 Author Share Posted January 28, 2011 Though presented as an M-series by the webmaster and contributor, from what is in the picture, it can be either a late production L-FO ( -15/20) or an early production M series (1-15-FO). In a few cases these modification were made to earlier L airframes or repairs to J-FO. The key factors are the integrated bomb scan windows after the first fuselage station; and the lack of the lowes portion of the former S curve. Note how the bay window framing covers the mid section of the S curve. PCM 2000, all rights reserved. http://www.b24bestweb.com/sugarbaby-v2.htm Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dixieflyer Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 Phil, As always, some really, really great info. Sadly, the links on the page containing your matrix do not work. Still, I will great utilize this one day if I ever get a chance to dig into my stash of Liberators. Warren Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Phil marchese Posted January 29, 2011 Author Share Posted January 29, 2011 Phil, As always, some really, really great info. Sadly, the links on the page containing your matrix do not work. Still, I will great utilize this one day if I ever get a chance to dig into my stash of Liberators. Warren Warren, Thanks, The hosting websites are beyond my controls, so I can't maintain the links. The good news is the a/c nicknames are there and can be found using the alphabetical index. Not as compact or complete as designed, but usable. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dixieflyer Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 Phil, Yep, I realize only too well that is beyond your control, but I'm still thankful for your work. On another note, I want to thank you for being so forthcoming with information, not only on this forum, but in correspondence in the past too. Warren Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Phil marchese Posted April 11, 2012 Author Share Posted April 11, 2012 Back to top per request Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Alvis 3.1 Posted April 11, 2012 Share Posted April 11, 2012 Awesome! Alvis 3.1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Phil marchese Posted April 11, 2012 Author Share Posted April 11, 2012 Thanks for permission to revive this post. Phil Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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