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C-130 A, B, E, H

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I plan on making lots of C-130's in the 72 scale, mostly newer models H's and J's, but for my first few, I would like to build an A, B, E, and H. I am starting with a C-130E in modern gray camo from the idaho ANG. I am using the Italeri kit with the Flight Path nacelles, but I would like to know for future reference what the main external differences between the B, E, and H models. I know the A has short nacelles, and 3 bladed props, but I really know nothing about the others. Any help would be great!

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Also, if anyone could suggest any reference books, that would be great as well!

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I plan on making lots of C-130's in the 72 scale, mostly newer models H's and J's, but for my first few, I would like to build an A, B, E, and H. I am starting with a C-130E in modern gray camo from the idaho ANG. I am using the Italeri kit with the Flight Path nacelles, but I would like to know for future reference what the main external differences between the B, E, and H models. I know the A has short nacelles, and 3 bladed props, but I really know nothing about the others. Any help would be great!

OF,

Have you seen this review of the Flightpath resin engine nacelles?

http://www.cybermodeler.com/hobby/details/fp/detail_fp_72107.shtml

Tom

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I have, and its very helpful, but what other external differences are there between the B, E and H?

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The engine nacelles on the A are different from all others. The Italeri kit's nacelles *forward of the firewall* are correct for the A, but not the aft part attached to the wing (it's correct for later models). Doing an A is actually fairly involved. The B, E, and early H are *basically* similar except for the side cargo door, some windows, and the small wing tanks on the B.

There are gobs of little details, but the basic shape of the airframe didn't change much up thru the early H/K.

Edited by Jennings

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The C-130B didn't have any wingtanks...the A model had the small wingtanks outboard of the engines and the first few E models had the side door that was eliminated completely and later they added the SKE (station keeping equipment) dome on top the forward fuselage. It was used for formation flying to keep everybody clear of each other. :thumbsup:

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All of the photos I've looked at of the E show look like they have cables leading from the fuselage to the tail, those cables don't seem to be there on the H models, is that right?

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Fraid you are wrong...kinda.

It gets complicated like most things when you are talking about a legacy aircraft like the C-130 with so many mods and de-mods.

I will just talk about the "H" model.

The H is a C-130E with -15 engines. (T-56A-15 has the first two stages of the turbine cooled, relative term, so they can run hotter which equals more power. There are a few other little differences but it is transparent to the model builder. And has the HF antenna wires.

The C-130H-1 has the HF antenna you are talking about (the two long wires) and an Aux Power Unit on the left side with a different shape air intake along with different shape air intakes for the air conditioner/pressurization system on the right side.

The C-130H-2 or 2.5 has upgraded avionics and a few bleed air differences but no HF antennas and the same APU and AC/Press systems.

The C-130H-3 has a different electrical system and avionics system and no HF antenna and the same APU and AC/Press systems. A very simple way of identifying. I think and I could be very wrong with this statement but I believe all the H-3's have LIRCM pods on the rear of the fuselage and might have ALR-69 systems. But like I said, I could be wrong. All of them have SKE domes on the top and bottom.

A google search w/ pictures has about all the info you need. I could go on and on.

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In a somewhat related question, namely C-130E/H engines. The 1/72 Flightpath resin engines go for almost 12 Pounds Sterling. Heritage Aviation has 4x 1/72 C-130 engines (RAF fit) for half that price.

http://www.heritageaviationmodelsltd.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=20_36&product_id=126

Two questions.

One: Anyone have a review of the Heritage Aviation engines (advertised as a replacement for the 1/72 Airfix/Italeri/Testors C-130) and any idea why the price difference between them and Flightpath?

Two: What do they mean by "RAF fit"?

Scott

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Two: What do they mean by "RAF fit"?

Most likely, the British Hercules variants have small differences compared to other C-130's.

Cheers,

Andre

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Think he just wants to point out they can be used for a RAF Hercules. On the Heritage site it does say the engines are for the Airfix kit btw. C-130 engines

Edited by Koen L

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Just a quick point ref the engines;

When Italeri engineered their kit they made the engine mounting stubs the same length. Since the out board engines are past the wing taper they are further rearward than the inboards. If you check pics (try Airliners.net) and plans (good ones) you will see that the props are all in line, therefore you will need to add a plug to the out board engine mount to bring that prop in line with the inboards.

I found a couple of good pics on Airliners of Herc side views at the engines that show this clearly.

HTH

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Think he just wants to point out they can be used for a RAF Hercules. On the Heritage site it does say the engines are for the Airfix kit btw. C-130 engines

Thanks for the reply. I think I can see a set arriving on my workbench in the not-to-distant future. :thumbsup:

FWIW: The stated Airfix Hercules and the old Testors C-130E are both reboxed Italeri C-130E/H kits ... so they'll all work with the resin.

Scott

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Just a quick point ref the engines;

When Italeri engineered their kit they made the engine mounting stubs the same length. Since the out board engines are past the wing taper they are further rearward than the inboards. If you check pics (try Airliners.net) and plans (good ones) you will see that the props are all in line, therefore you will need to add a plug to the out board engine mount to bring that prop in line with the inboards.

I found a couple of good pics on Airliners of Herc side views at the engines that show this clearly.

HTH

Good point! I'll keep that in mind when I start work on my Herc. I somehow got the feeling that word of caution also applies to any resin engine offering, beit Flightpath or Heritage Aviation.

Scott

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And just to add to it, a few variations:

Copy2ofscan0012.jpg

scan0019-7.jpg

scan0048-5.jpg

scan0052-5.jpg

scan0204.jpg

scan0207.jpg

scan0068.jpg

scan0029-5.jpg

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Here ais a list of various differences with the early C-130 models. I'll start with the C-130A. Photos are from different source. Most of the old ones are from Japanese photographers that I met at Yokota AB, some are USAF photos and a few are mine.

Start with the early C-130A.

C-130A roman (APS-42 radar) versus pinocchio nose. (APN-59 radar)

Clamshell nose gear doors versus single nose gear door. 53 and 54 year models with the roman nose had this feature. Later single door retrofitted to most but not all early C-130As.

Step versus (56 year models and earlier including retrofitted noses) faired pinocchio nose. (57 models and later)

Forward cargo and extra fuselage window.

Upper fuselage windows.( 56 year and earlier)

Lack of wing tanks or retrofitted smaller 450 gal outer wing tanks (C-130A) versus no wing tanks (C-130B) and larger 1350 gal center wing tanks. (C-130E and later models)

Single covers for GTC (C-130A) versus split flap cover for intake and open exhaust for GTC. (C-130B and later)

(C-130A ) T57-A9 engines set further into the wings with Aero Products three blade props versus (C-130B up to 71 year C-130Hs) T57A-7s set further forward with Hamilton Standard four blade Props. C-130A engine fairing extend up to the flaps (inner engines) and into the flaps. (outer engines) C-130B and later have fairings ending well before the flaps.

Two dagger fuel drains on T56A-9 engines. Single dagger drain on later T56A-7 and -15 engines.

Fuel dump drain nubs on outer wings on C-130A models only.

Short fuselage tail versus longer beaver tail. Holds a crash position indicator. Retrofitted to mainly C-130Es in the late 60s/early 70s and introduced on the production line until replaced on 74 year C-130Hs, by a small whip antenna slightly before the tail on upper fuselage. Retrofitted to earlier C-130s with the beaver tail.

Some photographs to explain the above.

The difference with the C-130A and the other models is that the first C-130A had the APS-42 radar in the short nose, also called the 'roman nose'. They also had the clamshell nose gear door. 53 and 54 year models had the roman nose. That means it is split in half and opens on each side of the nose gear, not slides to the rear like later C-130A and all of the rest of the C-130s.

Roman nose but with the later nose gear door. Slides behind the nose gear. Prototype for RC-130A program, 1375 MCS, 1370 PMW, later 1 ACGS in1968.

c130a-1.jpg

JC-130A out of Hanscom AFB. Roman nose. 3245 Test Sqdn, later to 4950 TS, Wright-Patt. More of the same aircraft follows.

JC-130A3133nose12.jpg

You can see the clamshell nose door a bit better here. 53-3133

jc130a3133.2.jpg

jc130a3133.3.jpg

jc103a3133.1.jpg

Later many butt not all of the early roman nose C-130A were retrofitted with the later 'pinocchio' nose. These as well as 55 and 56 models had the later radar nose but lacked the slight fairing where the top of the radome meets the fuselage nose, leading to a noticeable step. C-130A Blind Bat.

CBBnose1.jpg

57 year C-130A models and all later straight C-130 had the fairing which gave the nose a curved appearance. WC-130E 54WRS.

WC-130E61-2360nose.jpg

The C-130A, C-130B and 61 year C-130Es all had the forward cargo door and only the C-130A had an extra window. Serious accidents where the door opened in flight caused the doors to be permanently closed. C-130D. 139 TAS, NYANG.

c130c.jpg

More later.

Best wishes,

Grant

Edited by gmat

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Previous to the 1957 year C-130A, the C-130A had a series of windows on the upper fuselage, two before the wing and one aft. They also had an extra window above the cockpit. These were removed from the 57 year C-130A and later C-130s. Until about 59/60, the C-130As did not have the 450 gal wing tanks. 463 TCW, Dyess AFB, taken at Hickam AFB.

C130A.jpg

Note extra window. 815 TCS, Tachikawa AB?

c130a.jpg

57 year model, note lack of upper windows. 21st TCS, Naha AB Okinawa.

C-130A57-483markings1.jpg

21 TAS Naha AB. Outer wing tanks.

C-130A21TAS.jpg

C-130A Blind Bat with outer wing 450 gal fuel tanks. 374 TAW, Naha AB, Okinawa, taken at Yokota AB.

C130AYJ.jpg

C-130A. Single door for intake and exhaust for GTC. 815 TCS, Naha AB.

c130a815-1.jpg

C-130B and later. Split door for intake and open exhaust for GTC. JC-130B, 6594 TG, Hickam AFB.

c103dgtc.jpg

Note two dagger fuel drains under engine.

rc130a.jpg

C-130E showing engines with single fuel drain pipes.

c130E.jpg

More to come.

Best wishes,

Grant

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Notice two drains on outer wing. Taken at Yokota AB. From Naha or Tachikawa AB.

c130aoba-1.jpg

Close up of pinup on above aircraft. Akemi Oba.

c130aoba.jpg

Don't have a good photo showing the later flush drain holes on C-130B and later aircraft. But if if you strain your eyes, you might be able to see that there are no nub on the far wing. 815 WRS, 64- 14861, test of replacement vertical height radar replacement for APN-42. Note fairing under the fuselage. None chosen and the APN-42 remained in service.

wc130h14866.apn42test.jpg

Short tail versus beaver tail.

JC-130B. For some reoson, the JC-130B never had the beaver tail mod.

JC-130B.jpg

HC-130P 6594 TG, Hickan Hawaii. The 6594 Test Group at Hickam was unique in it did not have a squadron to fly the aircraft. The earlier 6593 TS which flew the JC-119J and initially operated the JC-130Bs was later replaced by the 6594 TG and the test squadron went on to control the land based radars to support the operation.

HC-130P.jpg

More later.

Best wishes,

Grant

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C-130A T56A-9 engines. C-130D ski bird, but the same as a C-130A model.

C-130D-4.jpg

C-130D-7.jpg

C-130D-6.jpg

c103dengineA.jpg

Same C-130E photo posted earlier. Note the engine nacelles end before the flap. Also the fairing behind the exhaust is shorter and joins the wing at a steeper angle.

c130E.jpg

Although the panel lines are similar for the C-130A T56A-9 and later -7/-15 engines, it is set further into the wing for the -9 engines.

RC-130A.

rc130a.jpg

C-130D.

C-130D-5.jpg

Not the best, but you can see the panel lines and the small flap on top of the engine nacelle is further forward compared to the engines above. C-130B-II, 6091 RS, Yokota AB. ELINT Pod on outer wing.

4C-130B-II.jpg

Also the distance of the red prop warning line on the fuselage from the forward part of the landing gear housing is a good indicator of how much the engines were move forward.

RC-130A, note red line closer to the housing. Compare with photo above (C-130B-II) and below (C-130E)

c130a-1.jpg

61 year C-130E still has the forward cargo door but no extra window.

c130e123711.jpg

Best wishes,

Grant

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Closeup of three blade prop. C-130D.

C-130.jpg

Later four blade props. USCG HC-130H, Hickam AFB Open House.

USCG.jpg

That is about it for the C-130A.

Best wishes,

Grant

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After the many detail differences on the C-130A, the changes to the later models are few until the 1974 C-130Hs. Some call them Super Hs, others call them H-1s. I'm old school from the 80s and call them super Hs.

C-130Bs had no wing tanks, T56A-7 engines with four blade Hamilton Standard props with rounded tips. Engines moved further forward on the wings. They still had the forward cargo door with only three fuselage windows. They were produced with the short fuselage tail tip. I believe many were retrofitted with the beaver tail.

C-130B.

c130b-1.jpg

C-130A.

c130a-10.jpg

C-130E. Long range strategic cargo version produced for MATS and also later for TAC. MAC C-130Es later turned over to TAC. USN procured and operated two squadrons of C-130Es for MATS, later turned over to TAC. Distinguished by the larger 1350 gal wing tanks. 61 year models retained the forward cargo door with three windows. 62 year models and later dispensed with the forward cargo door.

61 year model C-130E. Shows forward cargo door. Either 41ATS or 76 ATS, 1608 ATW, Charleston AFB.

c130e123711.jpg

C-130E-I (Rivit Swap) later known as MC-130E. No cargo door. 64 year model. 1198th SOS (Heavy Chain) out of Norton AFB.

c130e-112641_.2.jpg

Later during the early 80s a black radome was added to the upper fuselage. It was the SKE radar for maintaining formation during night or adverse weather while air dropping cargo or paratroops. Note black radome on the upper fuselage. MAC aircraft loaned to the 40950 TW and modified with additions to the fuselage and tail.

c130e7769.irwr.jpg

Note two triangular antennas on the belly, one on each side. Either one or two were fitted on C-130Es during the Viet Nam War from the late 60s.

The 71 year C-130Hs were outwardly indistinguishable from the C-130Es. They had the uprated T56A-15 engines, which are NOT outwardly different from the T56A-7 used earlier. Some have called them super Es.

These are the main differences between the C-130A/B/E and early H models.

Best wishes,

Grant

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If it helps, I mastered a basic C-130A conversion set in 1/72 and 1/48 scale and sent the masters to Contrails resin. Right now Michael is showing just the props for sale (look in the military section) but he has the complete master set, just email him and see if will produce the full conversion set. The set contains the props, external aux tanks with pylons and extra windows. It does not address the nacelle issues so you would have to go to Flight path for that.

Edited by drhornii

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If it helps, I mastered a basic C-130A conversion set in 1/72 and 1/48 scale and sent the masters to Contrails resin. Right now Michael is showing just the props for sale (look in the military section) but he has the complete master set, just email him and see if will produce the full conversion set. The set contains the props, external aux tanks with pylons and extra windows. It does not address the nacelle issues so you would have to go to Flight path for that.

So, you didn't address the rear portion of the nacelle? It appears that the Flightpath set doesn't cover that either.

Randie

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