rokket Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 Not yet (my model is in the loooong "to build" queue), but I can mock up with tape. I hopefully will be cutting the newones this weekend..or soon anyway! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
crowe-t Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 Not yet (my model is in the loooong "to build" queue), but I can mock up with tape. I hopefully will be cutting the newones this weekend..or soon anyway! I'd like to see the mock up. Do your windows go over the kit's clear plastic window parts? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted January 7, 2013 Author Share Posted January 7, 2013 I'd definately be interesting in these as well! They look great. I had a similar idea, but my idea was to make the individual windows out of clear resin with the frames pre-attached. The problem with my idea was you'd have to re-work the opening before you could glue them in and that is just as hard as trying to rebuild them anyway and you'd still have to mask and paint. Your solution looks like it would be much easier. Please do post a mock up once you get a chance. Bill Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rokket Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 crowe-t: the windows totally replace the kit clear. niart17: interesting idea using clear resin. These windows will require a tad of tweaking in the opening, but assembly is just a sandwich with dots of white glue, and then glue on the edges. I've cut the new design today (more accurate "masks"), and painted, its drying. Hopefully I'll assemble one tomorrow and be able to shoot a mockup Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 (edited) Well, I took the plunge. I'm going to try out the Shapeway service and try to print out some parts to see how it goes. For my first part, I am just going to try something simple. The ETAR or external tank attachment ring. It's not a terribly hard part to scratch build, but it's pretty intergral to the structure. We'll see how it goes. This is a shot of the model I submitted, should have it printed and sent out to me in a couple of weeks. I didn't put the lift ring on it, figured I'd see how this goes before I start playing with really detail models. Wish me luck. Bill Edited February 20, 2013 by niart17 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
crowe-t Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 Bill, I'm looking forward to seeing how the external tank attachment ring(ETAR) prints out. I'm not too familiar with 3D printing. What material(s) does it use to print? Mike. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 The material I'm trying these in is the same as Habu2's LEM nozzles. It's called Frosted Detail Plastic and they describe it as a "UV cured acrylic polymer". They offer a lot of different materials but this seemed like a happy median between expense and quality. I've been interested in this process for a while now, and REALLY look forward to the day that home 3d printers are affordable. If these come out ok, I may design some more parts and who knows, maybe even offer some stuff for sale. Bill Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted February 22, 2013 Author Share Posted February 22, 2013 :whistle:/> Bill Quote Link to post Share on other sites
K2Pete Posted February 22, 2013 Share Posted February 22, 2013 I've been interested in this process for a while now, and REALLY look forward to the day that home 3d printers are affordable. Your 3D models look terrific Billy! And I'm with you, but I'm also very curious to see the quality of the 'printed' piece and just how much clean up (like around the exterior venting lines) will, if any, will be involved. Keep us posted lad! Petey Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted February 22, 2013 Author Share Posted February 22, 2013 Your 3D models look terrific Billy! And I'm with you, but I'm also very curious to see the quality of the 'printed' piece and just how much clean up (like around the exterior venting lines) will, if any, will be involved. Keep us posted lad! Petey Will do. Like I said, this is all new to me so I'm not sure what the possiblities are. I might try to print these out in their white strong flexible material, which sounds like it's similar characteristics as the old Horizon nylon models. It is supposed to hold it's shape pretty well and can replicate a reasonable detail level. I know some of the rail road and war gaming guys have used it successfully so I think it would be good enough. These files printed in their frosted detail get to be a little too high cost. I'll keep you guys posted. Bill Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vehicle Posted February 23, 2013 Share Posted February 23, 2013 Will you be making any accurate landing gear and tires for the model? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted February 23, 2013 Author Share Posted February 23, 2013 Will you be making any accurate landing gear and tires for the model? I'm not sure what all I am going to design for it. I can see maybe the wheels would be a good candidate, but not sure how well the landing gear itself would do. Plus, it may be cost prohibitive. I am looking at making the top and the bottom skirts of the SRB's. MAYBE even the ET intertank area with corrected ribbing. Again, all of this is dependant on how well this material handles and how much it would cost to print them. Bill Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vehicle Posted February 23, 2013 Share Posted February 23, 2013 The Intertank ribbing for the Monogram kit is ok, save for the Thrust panels where the SRBs attach need to be changed if you plan to make the SLWET. You will need to add the loop for the tow cable to hook into on the SRB/ ET ring. http://pcdn.500px.net/5237376/1777fc4f27246eabe83979e08d7226d247b8d47a/4.jpg You see it in this photo line up with the "Loaded" marking on the booster. This photo of the ET of STS-51L does show the foam at the base of the intertank is thicker on the orbiter side than on the aft side. The Monogram ET has the entire area the thickness of the orbiter side. The SLWET has the foam at the itnertank base even all the way around. http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-3drxa_1TU8w/Tdzm1xll3DI/AAAAAAAABnM/DT-vfjCuGDU/s1600/space_shuttle_13.jpg Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted February 23, 2013 Author Share Posted February 23, 2013 The Intertank ribbing for the Monogram kit is ok, save for the Thrust panels where the SRBs attach need to be changed if you plan to make the SLWET. You will need to add the loop for the tow cable to hook into on the SRB/ ET ring. http://pcdn.500px.net/5237376/1777fc4f27246eabe83979e08d7226d247b8d47a/4.jpg You see it in this photo line up with the "Loaded" marking on the booster. This photo of the ET of STS-51L does show the foam at the base of the intertank is thicker on the orbiter side than on the aft side. The Monogram ET has the entire area the thickness of the orbiter side. The SLWET has the foam at the itnertank base even all the way around. http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-3drxa_1TU8w/Tdzm1xll3DI/AAAAAAAABnM/DT-vfjCuGDU/s1600/space_shuttle_13.jpg Not sure I'm following what you mean about the foam being thicker on the orbiter side. I don't see anything different. Maybe point it out? As for the tow ring on ETAR, I did put the recessed area for the hook, I just didn't add the actual hook. I think I can find something in my spare parts that will look close and it might look better than trying to add it to the 3d printed part. For the intertank, it's not that Monogram's is horribly wrong, but there are a few minor things that could be added that might work on a printed part. There is no access door and other small attacment points on the kit's tank. And then of course like you say, the biggest thing is the lack of ribbing on the thurst panels. It's not really bad, but if a part can be made cheap enough, it may be worth it. Assuming that part could withstand the stress of supporting the whole structure. Plus, it would envolve cutting out the whole intertank section of a rather expensive kit...So I'm still unsure about that. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vehicle Posted February 23, 2013 Share Posted February 23, 2013 This photo of STS-51. You notice the foam at the base of the ribbed intertank is thicker on the orbiter side compared to the side away from the orbiter. http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa234/crowe-t/Space%20Shuttle%20Pics/GPN-2000-001347.jpg The Monogram kit has this area of the ET just like the orbiter side of the Intertank with the thicker foam cover. The SLWET doesn't look like that as the previous link showed. Well the Monogram orbiter PBD hinges would fit. there are four of them per side the doors hinge into so they can open. Those would fit for the tow ring. You could use styrene rod of equal diameter and drill it out to make the ring or make a rubber/ resin molded copy from the orbiter PBD hinge. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted February 23, 2013 Author Share Posted February 23, 2013 This photo of STS-51. You notice the foam at the base of the ribbed intertank is thicker on the orbiter side compared to the side away from the orbiter. http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa234/crowe-t/Space%20Shuttle%20Pics/GPN-2000-001347.jpg The Monogram kit has this area of the ET just like the orbiter side of the Intertank with the thicker foam cover. The SLWET doesn't look like that as the previous link showed... Wow, I'd never noticed that before. It's VERY subtle. I looked back at some shots I have in my reference files and sure enough. It's hard to tell, do you know if there is a definate point where it gets thicker or does it just taper to a thicker coating? I assume that's done for better protection on the orbiter side? Sorry, I'm not up to all the acronyms as much as I should be, but what are the PBD hinges? Bill Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vehicle Posted February 23, 2013 Share Posted February 23, 2013 Yeah, I guess it was done for protection. *shrugs* I do know compare it to the SLWET, this area is now all thin and even on both sides. The front and back of the ET look like the aft side of the 51L ET. Payload Bay Door hinges. you can see o nthis person's model the solid hinge and the hollowed out hinge the door attaches to behind it. http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l31/JMChladek/Shuttle%20STS-117/117wip-7.jpg You can use the hollowed out hinge to replicate the ETAR tow ring. I am with my models as My stack models have the hinges cut off as the hinges get in the way with the AFRSI blanket details. The solid ones can be used for the modified system tunnel on the SRBs. http://www.axmpaperspacescalemodels.com/images/stack4.gif You see in this photo a part of the modification of a half circular piece next to what is part of the main system tunnel. http://farm5.staticflickr.com/4066/5141794576_7bfef53185_o.jpg http://www.swarpa.net/~danforth/photos/ksc/top_of_srb.jpg http://georgesrockets.com/GRP/Scale/ShuttleData/ET_Photos/STS-36_Feb90_ET-33_BI036.jpg http://georgesrockets.com/GRP/Scale/ShuttleData/MSFC/9402819_STS-62.jpg Right booster has the device face the orbiter side, the left booster is the opposite. compare with the original SRB design. http://georgesrockets.com/GRP/Scale/ShuttleData/StackCloseups/SRB_Nose_Scan.jpg More reference photos at http://georgesrockets.com/GRP/Scale/ShuttleData/SRB.html Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Youngtiger1 Posted February 24, 2013 Share Posted February 24, 2013 Wow, those windows look super. I just viewed you site but didn't see the windows for sale yet. So, put me down for few ;)/> Mike Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted February 24, 2013 Author Share Posted February 24, 2013 Wow, those windows look super. I just viewed you site but didn't see the windows for sale yet. So, put me down for few ;)/>/> Mike Sorry Mike, I'm not the one making the windows (wish I'd thought of it). Those are made by Rokket and yes, they do look very nice. I suggest maybe shooting him an PM to see about getting you some. There is one other build here (Hotdogs here http://s362974870.onlinehome.us/forums/air/index.php?showtopic=261297&st=20) that is using them so you may keep an eye on his build as well to see how they come out. Bill Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted February 24, 2013 Author Share Posted February 24, 2013 Moving on to building a little, I decided I wasn't happy with the RCS units on the monogram kit so I used a set from the Revell shuttle. Not sure if they are totally accurate but they looked better to me. It required a little aligning but I think I got them close. Still have to fill in the seams and smooth out but it's getting there. Bill Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vehicle Posted February 25, 2013 Share Posted February 25, 2013 Why did you cut off the rudder panel? The Monogram kit has the orbiter body flap attached with the SME panel. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted February 25, 2013 Author Share Posted February 25, 2013 Well, A couple of reasons. One reason is I rebuilt the aft heat shield and engine mounts and that's the part that the rudder is attached to on the kit. Monograms is not that bad, but there are a few things that bothered me about it even though nobody will see it very much (I know it's there.) The Monogram panel is just one big curved piece where on the actual shuttle it's broken into multiple angled panels (Revell got that right as well). Also there are some raised sections below the OMS Pods on Monograms kit that are not actually there on the shuttle. The rudder is a really simple shape to rebuild so I wasn't so worried about taking that off and redoing it perhaps with a better looking hinge area. It also allows for easier painting and decaling when I get to that point. Bill P.s. Vehicle, did you ever work out your ET tank color issue? I would love to see some progress shots of your model. Can never have too many resources to learn from. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hotdog Posted February 25, 2013 Share Posted February 25, 2013 The Monogram panel is just one big curved piece where on the actual shuttle it's broken into multiple angled panels (Revell got that right as well). Also there are some raised sections below the OMS Pods on Monograms kit that are not actually there on the shuttle. The rudder is a really simple shape to rebuild so I wasn't so worried about taking that off and redoing it perhaps with a better looking hinge area. This is good to know since I have never built the Revell 1/72 shuttle. Kinda makes me wish I had ordered the Revell kit to bash with my Monogram. It's not too late, I just have a hard time justifying the extra cost as I have already invested a lot so far. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vehicle Posted February 25, 2013 Share Posted February 25, 2013 MY ET looks great. I just need to make new bipod ramps before adding the bipod strut. :) I used thick plastic on my older STS-109/107 stack to make the bipod foam ramps. This new kit I'm thinking of maybe making them from putty or maybe resin casting the Columbia set. What do you think is best? Your decals here look cool. Say if I print them will they be in 1/72 scale? http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s154/niart17/shutonclear.jpg I'd change the circular decals for the bottom of the ET to a yellow color for the SLWET or a Daylight orange color for the older LWET. The alternative is to paint these on. I had to on my models as at the time I never knew this was made a decal. Will you be adding the USA/ Flag and flags to go with United States, as well as the NASA worm and meatball logos to this? Here is a video with great close ups of the stack. I noticed in the video there are some writing at the ends of the heater straps on the SRBs. Pause at 23:07 in this vid and you'll see a close up of one of the heater straps with the writing. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted February 25, 2013 Author Share Posted February 25, 2013 MY ET looks great. I just need to make new bipod ramps before adding the bipod strut. :)/> I used thick plastic on my older STS-109/107 stack to make the bipod foam ramps. This new kit I'm thinking of maybe making them from putty or maybe resin casting the Columbia set. What do you think is best? It's hard to say, post some pics in a build thread and I'm sure there would be some great suggestions as to how to approach it. That's one of the best things about this site. There are always different ways of approaching a subject, and sometimes it just takes a different set of eyes looking at a problem to come up with a good solution. I'd suggest using this forum to it's fullest potential and post up a build thread so you can ask questions as you run across barriers. Everyone here is really really helpful and almost always willing to go out of their way to help. As for the decals, I don't think printing them off the .jpg from my photobucket album will come out right, either size or quality. If you want to send me your e-mail address I can shoot you a .pdf copy (or illustrator file if you have access to the program) and you can print them (or make any changes you see fit) Yeah, on the SRB's there are a lot of little stencil markings that I've been trying to find resources for what they say, though it's probably not legible in 1/72 scale. There are ones just over the top of the bands plus a few running up and down by the wiring trough. If I can't find out exactly what they say by the time I'm ready to decal them, I'll probably just make something that looks like it. For the bottom of the ET tank, those circles seem to vary in color almost as much as the tank itself. I'm pretty sure this exact conversation took place back on page 6 of this thread with MarkD, along with the question about the worm logo. I don't think I'll be adding the old logo since this is mainly designed for STS-135. But ya never know. Anyway, critiques, comments and suggestions are still always welcome. Thanks, Bill Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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