HOLMES Posted September 18, 2011 Share Posted September 18, 2011 (edited) Edited September 18, 2011 by HOLMES Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Les / Creative Edge Photo Posted September 18, 2011 Share Posted September 18, 2011 Very sad indeed. I'm going to an airshow next weekend. Needless to say, this year's string of airshow related accidents is weighing a bit on my mind. I know accidents are always a possibility, but this year has so much worse for them. You'll be fine... Just go and enjoy it. The car drive to it and back from it is many HUNDREDS of times more risky than any potential risk to a performer crashing. In fact the odds of you choking on a burger, hot dog and/or fries is going to be significantly higher too. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
HOLMES Posted September 18, 2011 Share Posted September 18, 2011 This is todays latest update.NEWS STATES THAT THE TAIL PART OF THE PLANE FELL OFF http://news.aol.co.uk/world-news/story/tail-part-fell-off-crash-plane/1927503/?icid=maing-grid7%7Cuk%7Cdl1%7Csec1_Ink3%7C78446 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
vince14 Posted September 18, 2011 Share Posted September 18, 2011 This is todays latest update.NEWS STATES THAT THE TAIL PART OF THE PLANE FELL OFF http://news.aol.co.uk/world-news/story/tail-part-fell-off-crash-plane/1927503/?icid=maing-grid7%7Cuk%7Cdl1%7Csec1_Ink3%7C78446 As we've seen in the pics posted in the thread earlier, it looks like the port trim tab departed the aircraft before it crashed. Vince Quote Link to post Share on other sites
zerosystem Posted September 18, 2011 Share Posted September 18, 2011 how much of a typical reno racer is original? i keep hearing vintage ww2 fighter and its getting a little old for me. same was actually said on the news of the t-28... though on one local station actually had an 'aviation expert' who was a 60-70 year old pilot who pointed right to the trim tab. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Weebles Posted September 18, 2011 Share Posted September 18, 2011 You'll be fine... Just go and enjoy it. The car drive to it and back from it is many HUNDREDS of times more risky than any potential risk to a performer crashing. In fact the odds of you choking on a burger, hot dog and/or fries is going to be significantly higher too. That's not really a true statement. Yes, commercial aviation (flying on an airline) is statistically safer. As a pilot like many of us here I'm constantly being presented with statistics on GA safety and accidents by the AOPA, Aviation Safety, FAA, and others. General Aviation is not safer than driving down the highway. Aerobatics and racing are even more dangerous even though these pilots are generally more experienced and well trained. That said these events are very well thought out and generally safe. As we saw in the T-28 accident yesterday nobody but the pilot was killed or injured. A few years back in my own back yard an F-86 doing a loop drove straight into the ground killing the pilot but that was it. It is very rare, especially in North America that anyone is injured at an airshow event like we saw here at Reno. These men and women know the risk, and while I hurt for their loss I understand their passion and feel so fortunate that they share it with us. Dave Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MaRiO FDZ Posted September 18, 2011 Share Posted September 18, 2011 how much of a typical reno racer is original? i keep hearing vintage ww2 fighter and its getting a little old for me. same was actually said on the news of the t-28... though on one local station actually had an 'aviation expert' who was a 60-70 year old pilot who pointed right to the trim tab. Practically only the name... Regarding the age, If a plane is unpressurized, you keep an eye for Corrosion and fly it within the envelope, you can practically make them fly forever. However, Like my old man says: "Metal things do not give you their word." Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MaRiO FDZ Posted September 18, 2011 Share Posted September 18, 2011 These men and women know the risk, and while I hurt for their loss I understand their passion and feel so fortunate that they share it with us. Dave True. You as a Pilot you know the risk of strapping into your seat. A person that lives near an airport (or goes to an airshow) knows that there are risks. Agree, I hurt for their loss, but I understand why they were there. Take Care Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Alvis 3.1 Posted September 18, 2011 Share Posted September 18, 2011 This just in: Government steps in to remove internet idiots from annoying those who get annoyed. The immediate solution is to wrap their keyboards in bubble wrap. :) I'll be content to wait for the NTSB/FAA investigation results. I won't change my plans or activities due to an accident. It was a terrible tragedy, and if there is anything that can be reasonably done to prevent it in the furure, then it should be looked at. While everyone going to races like Reno may be aware of the risks associated with such activities, I doubt any of them would like to see more accidents like this either. While seeing the races cancelled or curtailed sucks, it sucks more to get injured or killed. In the meantime, I'm not planning on letting some anonymous dingii online get me all het up. Alvis 3.1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
zerosystem Posted September 18, 2011 Share Posted September 18, 2011 This just in: Government steps in to remove internet idiots from annoying those who get annoyed. The immediate solution is to wrap their keyboards in bubble wrap. :) I'll be content to wait for the NTSB/FAA investigation results. I won't change my plans or activities due to an accident. It was a terrible tragedy, and if there is anything that can be reasonably done to prevent it in the furure, then it should be looked at. While everyone going to races like Reno may be aware of the risks associated with such activities, I doubt any of them would like to see more accidents like this either. While seeing the races cancelled or curtailed sucks, it sucks more to get injured or killed. In the meantime, I'm not planning on letting some anonymous dingii online get me all het up. Alvis 3.1 i'm far more concerned for the safety of myself, my friends and my family traveling trough the big dig tunnels than i am taking any of them to an airshow. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
11bee Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 i'm far more concerned for the safety of myself, my friends and my family traveling trough the big dig tunnels than i am taking any of them to an airshow. Word... Every time I drive through them I wonder if I will get through in one piece. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
redwoodmodels Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 Practically only the name... Regarding the age, If a plane is unpressurized, you keep an eye for Corrosion and fly it within the envelope, you can practically make them fly forever. However, Like my old man says: "Metal things do not give you their word." And a lot of the time, when they do talk, it takes us a while to learn to listen. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_Havilland_Comet Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GreyGhost Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 (edited) >>> Article <<< >>> Article 2 <<< Gregg Edited September 19, 2011 by GreyGhost Quote Link to post Share on other sites
drhornii Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 It could be flutter, that could explain the trim tab coming off and the mayday earlier on. I know a test pilot that bailed out when rudder flutter ended up working it's way up and took an aileron off in a T-34. He made two swings on the parachute before hitting the earth a few feet away from the plane. He showed me his Caterpillar club ring which prompted the story... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Flying Pancake Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 New video of the crash with a good angle. http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/nationnow/2011/09/reno-air-crash-new-video.html Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bigasshammm Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Every new video worse than the last. Amazing the death toll isn't much higher. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Weebles Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 I just read on the Flying web site that telemetry indicated that the aircraft made an 11G pull up prior to the crash. That's a difficult force for a young man to take. Max G's for a fighter pilot with a G suit is 9 to 12 G's. The article said that this happened before to another modified P-51 but in that case the aircraft didn't nose in and the pilot recovered from his black out. I recently pulled 4 G's in an aerobatic glider. Can't imagine taking 11 G's especially without being ready for it. Dave Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jay Chladek Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Other thing to keep in mind to is many pilots who are set up to take such gees are usually preparing for it with their gee strain manuever (the straining on toilet when constipated method). But, if somebody is unprepared and the bird goes right into an 11 gee pull up... almost instantaneous blackout. So I'm thinking he felt a control "funny" called a mayday, then the trim tab let go and put the plane into its climb and we see the rest. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Bigasshammm Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Other thing to keep in mind to is many pilots who are set up to take such gees are usually preparing for it with their gee strain manuever (the straining on toilet when constipated method). But, if somebody is unprepared and the bird goes right into an 11 gee pull up... almost instantaneous blackout. So I'm thinking he felt a control "funny" called a mayday, then the trim tab let go and put the plane into its climb and we see the rest. Agreed I see no way he was conscious when it went in. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Micro Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 (edited) The last I read said the NTSB could find no evidence of a "mayday" call by the pilot. http://edition.cnn.com/2011/09/19/us/nevada-plane-crash-2/ He might not have ever known what happened. Edited September 21, 2011 by Micro Quote Link to post Share on other sites
11bee Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Other thing to keep in mind to is many pilots who are set up to take such gees are usually preparing for it with their gee strain manuever (the straining on toilet when constipated method). But, if somebody is unprepared and the bird goes right into an 11 gee pull up... almost instantaneous blackout. So I'm thinking he felt a control "funny" called a mayday, then the trim tab let go and put the plane into its climb and we see the rest. Could a P-51 even handle that high of a G load without coming apart? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Two Mikes Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Could a P-51 even handle that high of a G load without coming apart? It was instantaneous, not sustained. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Weebles Posted September 22, 2011 Share Posted September 22, 2011 It was instantaneous, not sustained. The article I read said that it happened before. In the previous event the pilot went into a high G climb but the aircraft continued its climb and the pilot came out of it, was able to recover the aircraft and land safely. Even instantaneously it's amazing that the aircraft stayed together. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Micro Posted September 22, 2011 Share Posted September 22, 2011 When I first heard about the trim tab I immediately thought about an incident that happened to me in a simulator once. We had been given a runaway trim situation and for about 2 minutes while we ran the checklist I was having to hold the yoke forward with brute strength. My hands were sweaty and as I attemted to adjust my grip the yoke slipped out of my hand. That thing slammed back with a force that caused the entire sim to shake as it pitched up. If a pilot just had a normal grip on the stick and did not expect an instantaneous movement of the stick to that degree, I just don't see how they could even keep a hold of it. The whole thing gives me the chills. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
oldHooker Posted September 25, 2011 Share Posted September 25, 2011 Terrible, terrible situation... There's one question I haven't seen addressed here, or on any other media outlet, and that is why didn't the fuel ignite upon impact? I can never recall a high speed impact like that without a resulting fireball. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.