One-Oh-Four Posted February 16, 2012 Share Posted February 16, 2012 Hi guys, I have the HobbyBoss 1/48 F-105G Thunderchief. Can you help me with the parts that really need to be replaced / accuratized? I'm not talking about extra effort needed in building because of the flaps, rear fuselage with engine and open radome etc. I already know of the following items: - Chord vertical tail too small - Ejection seats are in "firing mode" - Canopy curves not quite enough - Cockpit tub a bit too slim for the fuselage - Standard ARM and Shrikes not exactly right - Fins for centerline tank swept back instead of straight? - Shape of the nose which is straighter than on all photos (as is Monogram's) Are there any other shape issues? I know that Aires/Quickboost have a ventral fin but does it need replacing? I'm asking for this so I won't overlook anything. I hate to have the kit built for 3/4 and find out only then.... Thanks! Erik B. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Otto Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 I have always liked the Monogram kit. For as much the Chinese kit costs and all those things to fix? I was going to buy one but now that I know this I will STAY with the Monogram. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Otto Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 I was just comparing pictures of the Hobby Boss kit and the Monogram kit and the nose and tail on the Hobby Boss really looks scruey. It is about as bad as the Academy MiG-21MF. They both look more like a caricature of their respective airplanes instead of maquettes. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dehowie Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Otto don't get that wound up in the Monogram kit as it also has issues and is far if not further than the HB kit from a totally accurate Thud. One of he biggest issues with the Mono kit is the nose..I mean the entire nose. There are a couple of replacements available. As a perfect example of forum rubbish changing people's perceptions you above assume the Mono kit is correct..mistake. And from that you assume the HB kit is completely in accurate..second mistake. To say he HB kit is a characterture is idiculous at best and based off comparing it to a known inaccurate kit. Where he myth that Monogram kits are completely 100% accurate comes from as most of the kits have issues from small to large. The Mono kit suffers from poor nose poor canopies etc as well as HB. The HB has typically inaccurate weapons. It has lovely surface detail and there are several great builds now on the net.. To me I can get the HB kit for cheaper than Monogram so it's a no brainer if it's the reverse to you think about what's important to you and how much I've you have for rescibing etc. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jester292 Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 I'm not aware of anything you haven't listed about the Hobby Boss kit. I will say this: to my untrained eye, the Hobby Boss F-105 nose looks further off than the Monogram F-105 nose. True that neither are perfect. If you can find the HB kit at a decent price, it's worth it just to avoid the headache of the fit issues of the Monogram kit, which seems to be hit or miss, really. Some fit pretty well, and others are just horrid. Good luck with your build. Aaron (who prefers the Monogram kit because the HB kit is WAY too expensive in the US!) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
One-Oh-Four Posted February 17, 2012 Author Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) I have always liked the Monogram kit. For as much the Chinese kit costs and all those things to fix? I was going to buy one but now that I know this I will STAY with the Monogram. As has been said, the Monogram isn't the Holy Grail either. -In my opinion the front end of the windshield isn't exactly correct. Photo is of Louis Chang's model from the Gallery. It's NOT about the quality of the build, which is outstanding, just about the shape of the front end of the windshield as supplied by Revell-Monogram And the real deal: Sadly enough, this is also the case on the HB Thud... - Monogram ejection seats feature the parachute packs and although detailed, the detail is quite soft. - Monogram's rear cockpit is way too short as noted by AMS' Harold here on the boards. - Although no accuracy issue; there's only one underwing tank and one Standard ARM included thereby limiting the OOB load options (it also means you have only one fuel-type- and one weapon-type inner pylon... - Nose cone is straight like an F-104 radome instead of the front 1/4 length straight and then gently curving to the rear. I'm not aware of anything you haven't listed about the Hobby Boss kit. I will say this: to my untrained eye, the Hobby Boss F-105 nose looks further off than the Monogram F-105 nose. True that neither are perfect. If you can find the HB kit at a decent price, it's worth it just to avoid the headache of the fit issues of the Monogram kit, which seems to be hit or miss, really. Some fit pretty well, and others are just horrid. Good luck with your build. Aaron (who prefers the Monogram kit because the HB kit is WAY too expensive in the US!) Thanks! Good to know there aren't any hidden issues lurking somewhere. I bought the HB to be built as an F-105G with the flaps slightly down. I hope to circumvent the nose issue by opening the radome. I also bought the Revell Germany boxing of Monogram's F-105G. In the first place for its decals and in the second place to provide a template for the broader vertical stab. The length of HB's vertical stab is okay. It's also meant to be built though; because the fuselage pods are separate parts, it'll be built as an "E"F-105F. The HB "G" will be built as "Patience" from the 17 WWS, 388th TFW 1972, the "F" will be built as "Sinister Vampire" from the 44th TFS, 1970. But first I have to finish that AFV Club VFC-111 F-5N! Cheers! Erik. Edited February 17, 2012 by One-Oh-Four Quote Link to post Share on other sites
One-Oh-Four Posted February 17, 2012 Author Share Posted February 17, 2012 This pic shows the discrepancy of the front windshield even better: Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Finn Posted February 17, 2012 Share Posted February 17, 2012 Also if you plan to go with the i/b weapons pylons, note the front angle of the pylon in this pic to show how they should be: http://www.donhenry.net/Crew%20shot.jpg Jari Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dehowie Posted February 18, 2012 Share Posted February 18, 2012 One other major issue with the Monogram kit I forgot to mention is the totally in-accurate Anhedral of the wing. It's around 3-4 times greater than reality throwing out the look of the entire wing fuselage relationship and the pylons are totally askew. I've built 3 Monogram kits and still own 4 but I now have 4 Hobbyboss kits and evn just taped together the wing of the HB kit makes it a far better looking Thud to my eye OOB. Plus the bonus of beautiful panels etc combine that with the superior Monogram weapons and I think you get the best 105 you can get. If money is no object the HB kit with Monogram weapons is to me the bet result you can get. Your mileage may vary depending on how much ou pay for the kits.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
One-Oh-Four Posted February 18, 2012 Author Share Posted February 18, 2012 Also if you plan to go with the i/b weapons pylons, note the front angle of the pylon in this pic to show how they should be: http://www.donhenry.net/Crew%20shot.jpg Jari Thanks Jari, hadn't identified that yet! One other major issue with the Monogram kit I forgot to mention is the totally in-accurate Anhedral of the wing. It's around 3-4 times greater than reality throwing out the look of the entire wing fuselage relationship and the pylons are totally askew. I've built 3 Monogram kits and still own 4 but I now have 4 Hobbyboss kits and evn just taped together the wing of the HB kit makes it a far better looking Thud to my eye OOB. Plus the bonus of beautiful panels etc combine that with the superior Monogram weapons and I think you get the best 105 you can get. If money is no object the HB kit with Monogram weapons is to me the bet result you can get. Your mileage may vary depending on how much ou pay for the kits.. Ohhhh, is that the reason my F-105D (now sadly deceased) always looked like it sat too high on it's mains. Fuse too horizontal... Thanks for the pointer! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Zaggy Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 Is the HB kit now that old?!?!? Woah.... I'm about to crack on with one myself, thus am looking for ways to conquer the known issues - if one goes by the new Mushroom Publications 1/48 plans, the HB is not as horrific as I was bracing for. The big VISUAL for me is the HB Tail (has HB re-issued the kit with a different tail sprue?) and the slight nose thing. a) Tail - anyone know of any link to someone who has tried to correct this? ATM, Im thinking the tail needs to be glued together then cut into three major pieces - top the top off, then down the panel line at about 1/4 chord. From there hopefully I can piece it back together and increase the chord, so with some re-scribing it'll 'look' right... The weird bumps and inlet at the base of the fin is a given as to needing work (same as the old RM kit here!) b) Nose - this one is really subtle, and to my eye, probably about a 3" x 1/8" 10 thou piece of card could be used as a 'keel' under the nose and then shaped until the profile is right. Once right, a few skims of milliput upto my 'keel' and gentle sanding a re-engraving - I hate re-engraving, so even something that just makes it half-right (or 'righter') is a winner by me. To me, the seats are a non-issue (replace with a/m if I have to); the warload is a non-issue (I have a LOT of Shrikes, StandardARMs and HARMs, as well as various ECM pods from other WW builds, and from a/m); the canopy curve is a non-issue (open or closed - one or the other almost ALWAYS hides the majority of that issue); tank fins - seriously non-issue... I have plenty of plastic card! Potential issues tho - those main gear legs looks a bit fragile? Thoughts? Dan Quote Link to post Share on other sites
serendip Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 On 2/17/2012 at 4:31 AM, dehowie said: Otto don't get that wound up in the Monogram kit as it also has issues and is far if not further than the HB kit from a totally accurate Thud. One of he biggest issues with the Mono kit is the nose..I mean the entire nose. There are a couple of replacements available. As a perfect example of forum rubbish changing people's perceptions you above assume the Mono kit is correct..mistake. And from that you assume the HB kit is completely in accurate..second mistake. To say he HB kit is a characterture is idiculous at best and based off comparing it to a known inaccurate kit. Where he myth that Monogram kits are completely 100% accurate comes from as most of the kits have issues from small to large. The Mono kit suffers from poor nose poor canopies etc as well as HB. The HB has typically inaccurate weapons. It has lovely surface detail and there are several great builds now on the net.. To me I can get the HB kit for cheaper than Monogram so it's a no brainer if it's the reverse to you think about what's important to you and how much I've you have for rescibing etc. The myth going around that Monogram kits are so good is, in a word, a perfect example of unfounded chauvinism - a tautology I know. But then facts seem to be a side issue these days. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChesshireCat Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 On 2/16/2012 at 11:31 PM, dehowie said: Otto don't get that wound up in the Monogram kit as it also has issues and is far if not further than the HB kit from a totally accurate Thud. One of he biggest issues with the Mono kit is the nose..I mean the entire nose. There are a couple of replacements available. As a perfect example of forum rubbish changing people's perceptions you above assume the Mono kit is correct..mistake. And from that you assume the HB kit is completely in accurate..second mistake. To say he HB kit is a characterture is idiculous at best and based off comparing it to a known inaccurate kit. Where he myth that Monogram kits are completely 100% accurate comes from as most of the kits have issues from small to large. The Mono kit suffers from poor nose poor canopies etc as well as HB. The HB has typically inaccurate weapons. It has lovely surface detail and there are several great builds now on the net.. To me I can get the HB kit for cheaper than Monogram so it's a no brainer if it's the reverse to you think about what's important to you and how much I've you have for rescibing etc. have the Hobby Boss kit and have gone thru two or three Monogram kits in my old age. I tend to think the HB kit is a far better start. Yet in it's day the Monogram was considered state of the art. Much of the issues spoken of are almost unmissed till your standing beside the real thing (Dayton Ohio). The one thing I seem to pick up on instantly was the Monogram fails to present the overall impact of the size of the airframe and not real sure I see all of it in the HB kit. On the plus side, I felt the HB kit projected the over all exterior finish much better than the Monogram, but still could have been better. This air frame series would be a license to print money if GWH did it! Especially with the oil can texture on the skin. The weapons suck on both kits, and not all that happy with the ECM pods and blisters. They're OK, but something is lacking, and you don't notice it till your standing next to the real thing. gary Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChesshireCat Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 On 2/18/2012 at 12:46 AM, dehowie said: One other major issue with the Monogram kit I forgot to mention is the totally in-accurate Anhedral of the wing. It's around 3-4 times greater than reality throwing out the look of the entire wing fuselage relationship and the pylons are totally askew. I've built 3 Monogram kits and still own 4 but I now have 4 Hobbyboss kits and evn just taped together the wing of the HB kit makes it a far better looking Thud to my eye OOB. Plus the bonus of beautiful panels etc combine that with the superior Monogram weapons and I think you get the best 105 you can get. If money is no object the HB kit with Monogram weapons is to me the bet result you can get. Your mileage may vary depending on how much ou pay for the kits.. you hit it right on the money for me, and couldn't place what looked odd to me. The air intakes are fairly accurate on each kit, but when the wings are out of wack they just don't set right in relationship to the fuselage. Maybe I'm a little too picky, but that airframe has always be special to me gary Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RichardL Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 I wish I could still get a resin replacement nose from D-Mold. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Zaggy Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 So has anyone posted anything on the best way to increase the HB tail chord (the most 'visible' of the issues)? Or the Nose? D Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JEN722 Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 (edited) I have been working on the HB F-105G for some time. These are the things I corrected/improved: - Removed large ECM blisters on fuselage (I am building an early F-105G). - Replaced consoles etc. in the cockpit (my next HB F-105 will have a resin pit). - Replaced the fat ventral fin with one from Quickboost and added details around that area. - Increased the tail fin chord by simply adding a piece of plastic card on the leading edge and forming the leading edge with Tamiya putty. - Modified the intake on the belly (the HB item looks a bit shallow). - Scratchbuilt new wing pylons from plastic card. - Replaced weapons with Hasegawa items. - Added belly straps from adhesive aluminum foil. https://www.amarc.dk/images/models/F-105G_HB48_01.jpg https://www.amarc.dk/images/models/F-105G_HB48_02.jpg https://www.amarc.dk/images/models/F-105G_HB48_05.jpg https://www.amarc.dk/images/models/F-105G_HB48_03.jpg https://www.amarc.dk/images/models/F-105G_HB48_06.jpg https://www.amarc.dk/images/models/F-105G_HB48_07.jpg https://www.amarc.dk/images/models/F-105G_HB48_08.jpg Jens Edited February 8, 2021 by JEN722 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RichardL Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 4 hours ago, JEN722 said: I have been working on the HB F-105G for some time. These are the things I corrected/improved: Looking good 👍 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
serendip Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 6 hours ago, JEN722 said: I have been working on the HB F-105G for some time. These are the things I corrected/improved: - Removed large ECM blisters on fuselage (I am building an early F-105G). - Replaced consoles etc. in the cockpit (my next HB F-105 will have a resin pit). - Replaced the fat ventral fin with one from Quickboost and added details around that area. - Increased the tail fin chord by simply adding a piece of plastic card on the leading edge and forming the leading edge with Tamiya putty. - Modified the intake on the belly (the HB item looks a bit shallow). - Scratchbuilt new wing pylons from plastic card. - Replaced weapons with Hasegawa items. - Added belly straps from adhesive aluminum foil. https://www.amarc.dk/images/models/F-105G_HB48_01.jpg https://www.amarc.dk/images/models/F-105G_HB48_02.jpg https://www.amarc.dk/images/models/F-105G_HB48_05.jpg https://www.amarc.dk/images/models/F-105G_HB48_03.jpg https://www.amarc.dk/images/models/F-105G_HB48_06.jpg https://www.amarc.dk/images/models/F-105G_HB48_07.jpg https://www.amarc.dk/images/models/F-105G_HB48_08.jpg Jens Dank Jens! I'll be saving this thread when I start my HB 'G'. Right now working on the 1/48th HPH B-52 - what a complete nightmare. Marc. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Zaggy Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 Nice Jens - cheers mate... And here I was thinking you were only into Adversary and Aggressors too 😉 D Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JEN722 Posted February 9, 2021 Share Posted February 9, 2021 19 hours ago, RichardL said: Looking good 👍 Thanks Richard. 🙂 17 hours ago, serendip said: Dank Jens! I'll be saving this thread when I start my HB 'G'. Right now working on the 1/48th HPH B-52 - what a complete nightmare. Marc. You're welcome Mark. As for the B-52... Good luck and see you next century. 😉 12 hours ago, Zaggy said: Nice Jens - cheers mate... And here I was thinking you were only into Adversary and Aggressors too 😉 D Nah, it can't all be aggressors and adversaries. In fact, it's been a while since I have worked on those kits (although I have plenty waiting to be finished). 😉 Jens Quote Link to post Share on other sites
serendip Posted January 8, 2023 Share Posted January 8, 2023 On 2/7/2021 at 4:26 AM, Zaggy said: Is the HB kit now that old?!?!? Woah.... I'm about to crack on with one myself, thus am looking for ways to conquer the known issues - if one goes by the new Mushroom Publications 1/48 plans, the HB is not as horrific as I was bracing for. The big VISUAL for me is the HB Tail (has HB re-issued the kit with a different tail sprue?) and the slight nose thing. a) Tail - anyone know of any link to someone who has tried to correct this? ATM, Im thinking the tail needs to be glued together then cut into three major pieces - top the top off, then down the panel line at about 1/4 chord. From there hopefully I can piece it back together and increase the chord, so with some re-scribing it'll 'look' right... The weird bumps and inlet at the base of the fin is a given as to needing work (same as the old RM kit here!) b) Nose - this one is really subtle, and to my eye, probably about a 3" x 1/8" 10 thou piece of card could be used as a 'keel' under the nose and then shaped until the profile is right. Once right, a few skims of milliput upto my 'keel' and gentle sanding a re-engraving - I hate re-engraving, so even something that just makes it half-right (or 'righter') is a winner by me. To me, the seats are a non-issue (replace with a/m if I have to); the warload is a non-issue (I have a LOT of Shrikes, StandardARMs and HARMs, as well as various ECM pods from other WW builds, and from a/m); the canopy curve is a non-issue (open or closed - one or the other almost ALWAYS hides the majority of that issue); tank fins - seriously non-issue... I have plenty of plastic card! Potential issues tho - those main gear legs looks a bit fragile? Thoughts? Dan What would be a typical loadout for a Vietnam era Wild Weasel? AGM-78 but in combination with what? I'm guessing not with AGM-65's? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
serendip Posted January 8, 2023 Share Posted January 8, 2023 Also, I've been looking at some Thud pictures and to me the HB tail doesn't seem that far off: http://data3.primeportal.net/hangar/weichao_chen/f-105d_60-0445/images/f-105d_60-0445_10_of_44.jpg Also also the gear on most Weasel pictures seems more like steel than the white that HB kit has you using. Any thoughts anyone? Marc. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JEN722 Posted January 8, 2023 Share Posted January 8, 2023 The HB F-105D tail is ok. It's the G tail that needs a leading edge enlargement. Jens Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RichB63 Posted January 8, 2023 Share Posted January 8, 2023 (edited) In my opinion, scale thickness, or "thinness" of the tail is at least as big an issue as outline when critiquing available F-105 kits. The Thud’s vertical stabilizer had a blade like cross section, befitting a double sonic strike fighter. Available F-100 kits suffer this same ignominy, while the rest of the Century Series seems better served by kit manufacturers in this regard. Edited January 8, 2023 by RichB63 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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