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Space Shuttle Launch Pad 39A with Challenger STS-6 (1:144)


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Hi Mike,

 

every now and then just kidding ... 00000016.gif

 

Hi friends,

 

and here are the AFTSs, where one can hardly distinguish the two kinds with the naked eye, to the left the FUDs, and to the right the FXDs. speak_cool.gif

 

WGk17m.jpg

 

Of course, they now have to be freed from the rest of the supporting wax necessary for printing before they come fully into their own.

 

t42SXS.jpg

 

Only at higher magnification one can recognize the dividing lines between the individual segments, whereby the surface of the finer-grained structure of the FXD (right) feels a bit finer. 

 

licTLI.jpg

 

But of the feared and often described stepped structure of 3D prints is no trace, which has pleasantly surprised me. up045518.gif  

 

YhOHqB.jpg

 

And as one can see, the ring fits perfectly in the SRB Aft Skirt

 

PJkkIu.jpg

 

as well as the nozzle into the ring, which proves that I must have measured well and the parts have been printed exactly. top.gif

 

Tvqvmw.jpg

 

And so I really like the 3D AFTC Ring much more better than the spartan part of the Airfix Kit, to whom the Revell ASTC comes relatively close. 

 

bHDyHn.jpg

 

I suspect that the dividing lines between the segments become even more visible after cleaning and can still be seen after painting, so that the silver foil insulation strips can still be glued on well. up040577.gif

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Thanks Mike, :worship:

 

then you just need to order a set, Joe will be pleased. top.gif

 

Hello everybody,

 

quickly a small addendum to the ASTCs, which are tailor-made for the Airfix Shuttle Stack (1/144). cool.gif

 

But one can use them also for the Revell Stack, as one can see on this image.

 

aqjV2q.jpg

 

Since the inner diameter of the Revell Aft Skirts is slightly larger than for Airfix, it might therefore be advisable to glue an Evergreen Strip 0,25 mm x 1,0 mm around the ASTC ring, then the ring would probably fit even better. top.gif

 

Or I could ask my friend Joe (crackerjazz) if he could enlarge the ASTC rings for the Revel Kit to Ø 33,5 mm. smiley215.gif

 

And finally, the still remaining test with the Bare-Metal Foil (New Improved Chrome), of which still 24 thin strips (1 mm) must be glued after the painting of the rings, for what a lot of patience should be necessary again. analintruder.gif

 

For this I have cut a longer 1 mm wide strip. Then the very thin film can be easily removed from the carrier strip, then each short pieces of it were cut off, 

 

RXpb97.jpg

 

and glued to the half tube (to the left of the green line) as well as onto the Airfix ring and pressed and smoothed with a Q-Tip. These are the two stripes to the right of the Liquid Chrome strip that I have recently applied with the Pumpmarker.
 
GM5Yrv.jpg

 

And as one can see, the Bare-Metal Foil is sticking firmly even still after some hours. Let's see what it tomorrow will look like, hopefully not as with some of the previous stripes, but rather still unchanged firm, wherefore I precautionally press both thumbs. JC_doubleup.gif

 

And the chrome luster of the stripes is in my opinion completely sufficient, so that I would be fully satisfied with this result, if it stayed so. up040577.gif

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The resolution on those 3D parts is remarkable ... impressive ... Most impressive!  :thumbsup:

 

Thanx for sharing and thanks for taking such excellent photos of the parts! They leave no question in our minds as to the quality we can expect!

 

Pete

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6 hours ago, K2Pete said:

The resolution on those 3D parts is remarkable ... impressive ... Most impressive!  :thumbsup:

 

Thanx for sharing and thanks for taking such excellent photos of the parts! They leave no question in our minds as to the quality we can expect!

 

Pete

 

Thanks Pete, :worship:

 

I am pleasantly surprised myself by the quality of the AFTCs, which shows that Shapeways is on a good way. speak_cool.gif

 

I can recommend you the parts with a clear conscience. up040577.gif

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Hello

 

I have been using Shapeways FED stuff for a while now on ship parts...The quality is excellent. Important on FUD and FED is to let the parts first of all sit in the sun or under a UV lamp for some hours. In a lot of cases they not not fully cured inside yet. You can see that when they change from transparent to almost white. Then I soak them in Nitro thinner...or acetone. This chews off the left over wax from the priniting process. I also prime all my parts with a laqueur primer, either Tamiya extra fine or the MRP stuff. After that painting with lacquer or arcrylics is no issue any more.

 

cheers

Uwe

 

PS: Space stuff seems to be way more expensive then ship parts...;-)

Edited by anj4de
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Thanks Uwe for your useful tips. :worship:

 

I still have to collect the experience with the 3D parts. top.gif

 

According to Shapeways guideline, one only should clean the parts in acetone to remove any remaining wax:

 

"If there is any residual oil or wax support material left over from the production process, this can easily be removed using acetone or Simple Green solvent. You can simply dip and air dry the model. Or, using a paint brush, you can lightly spread the solvent on the train and air dry." 

 

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Hello everybody,

 

and even after a day, the strips are still gluing unchangedly in place, so that the decision for the Bare-Metal Foil (New Improved Chrome) has fallen. top2.gif

 

YPWEeb.jpg

 

Then I wanted to see how the stripes on the ASTC would look like, and was pleasantly surprised again. top.gif

 

ayz6Jo.jpg

 

Cutting these approx. 7 mm long and 1 mm wide strips and gluing over the dividing lines between the segments, however, proved to be the expected delicate matter, because one has hellishly to take care when handling with cutter and/or tweezers, so that the very thin foil does not tear off.  eek.gif

 

And as one can see, the dividing lines under the stripes are becoming slightly visible,  but the same can also be seen on this photo from the STS-43 at a higher magnification. cant-believe-my-eyes-smiley-emoticon.gif

 

RmFIhD.jpg
Source: flickr.com (NASA on The Commons)

 

All in all, a completely successful matter with these 3D-ASTCs, which was worth all the effort.  up040577.gif

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1 hour ago, anj4de said:

I have been using Shapeways FED stuff for a while now on ship parts...The quality is excellent. Important on FUD and FED is to let the parts first of all sit in the sun or under a UV lamp for some hours. In a lot of cases they not not fully cured inside yet. You can see that when they change from transparent to almost white. Then I soak them in Nitro thinner...or acetone. This cews off the left over wax from the priniting process. I also prime all my parts with a laqueur primer, either Tamiya extra fine or the MRP stuff. After that painting with lacquer or arcrylics is no issue any more.

Ahh, will have to make a note of that. Haven't yet gotten around to getting some of the recent miniatures up on Shapeways for the old sci-fi board game/miniatures game Starfire.

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Thanks Brian for your nice compliment, :worship:

 

I also think that the ASTCs in combination with the Bare-Metal foil strips will look awesome. speak_cool.gif

 

One can really fall in love with these 3D parts. up040577.gif

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Hello everybody,

 

after having been more intensively involved with the AFTC rings that have been printed meanwhile by Shapeways and tested by me, I want to go back to the 3D modeling of the Intertank wherewith Michael Key had started last December, what I've been posting about. 8)

 

Therefor I had sent him in the result of my research my drawing and the estimated Stringer dimensions without and with foam insulation, where actually only the dimensions with foam insulation for his 3D modeling are relevant. up045518.gif

ZQl2Lu.jpg

Thereupon he had to adjust his 3D model once again, which I as a 3D rookie have not imaginated so complicated, but which should turn out to be a fallacy. ::)

 

At the beginning of the year he told me that he has meanwhile modeled another version with these stringer dimensions, given by me,

 

up061175.jpg   
Source: shapeways.com/forum (Michael Key)

 

consisting of each 26 Stringers in the two Thrust Panels and of each 40 Stringers in the intervening Stringer Panels


But somehow I immediately stumbled over his number of 40, that's totally 80 stringers in the Stringer panels, which I was very surprised because I dimly remembered a number 108 in our German Raumcon discussions, wherewith the confusion around numbers and terms started at the beginning of my project start (11/2011). up039493.gif

 

After intensive researches I finally found the explanation in the System Definition Handbook SLWT, in which the Intertank structure is described quite well. 

 

up061176.jpg

Source: Space Shuttle/External Tank System Definition Handbook SLWT

 

up061177.jpg

 

After that one has to distinguish the following terms: up045518.gif

 

While in the six Skin/Stringer Panels (45°) there are each 18 of these Stringers,

 

up061178.jpg

 

one speaks in the two Thrust Panels of Ribs, whereby in each case 26 parallel ribs as well as seven circumferential ribs are integrated in these panels,

 

up061179.jpg

 

Therewith was clarified at least the number of stringers, namely 108, which showed that Michael Key's 3D model had with totally only 80 too little stringers.


And now I had to explaine this fact heavy-heartedly Michael Key, whereby I was afraid that he would lynch me for it.eek.gif

 

Thereupon he was very disappointed and had initially thrown in the towel quite frustrated.

 

But of course, I did not want to give up that fast ... i5684_no2.gif

 

On the other hand, it would probably have been more useful to distribute the Stringer number onto the circumference of the eight 45° panels, whose drawing he had also been given by me. But in hindsight one is always smarter than before ... ::)

 

In the meantime, I did it my way both for the six Stringer Panels and for the two Thrust Panels with following results and sent it to him, in the hope that he would have an insight as well as a good will. smiley_worship.gif

[IMG]

Long story short, therewith I obviously had affected his honor, so that he was ready to go on. But I had to confirm to him that it would finally remain, in each case 54 stringers in the Stringer panels (135°) and in each case 26 ribs in the two Thrust panels (45°), whereupon I gave him my word and was jolly glad. up040577.gif

 

 

 

 

Edited by spaceman
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Hello everybody,

 

there are progresses to be reported of Michael Key's intertank modeling.  up045518.gif

 

After the number of Stringers (108) and that of the Ribs (52) have been clarified, we now have to clarify some further details on the Intertank, which are marked in this image, some of which have already been integrated into Michael's model. 

 

up061337.jpg
Source: NASA

 

Here are his latest 3D pictures, whereby I wondered at first about these six plates in the Access Door, smiley215.gif that I've never seen before. 

 

Furthermore, I noticed that the size and location of the Access Door (AD) and the Carrier Plate (CP) cannot be quite right,

 

up061338.jpg
Source: shapeways.com/forum (Michael Key)

 

which is why I determined them more precisely based on photos, wherefore I used the agreed reference size 1 Stringer+Valley = 1,3 mm.  

 

At first I used this great direct view of the Carrier Plate, which has almost no perspective distortions, what should be considered. 

 

For the determination and conversion of the measures, the following explanation of my numbers in the photos with and without mm is necessary, so that one does not get confused.

 

Numbers without mm are measured values in the respective photo, and Numbers with mm are the converted measurements in 1/144. up045518.gif

 

And if one compares this photo with his model, stands out that the distance D2 of the Carrier Plate from the Thrust Panel is too large because it should be only 2 Stringer+Valley (2,6 mm).

 

up061340.jpg
Source: NASA

 

With this distance and the determined dimensions of the Carrier Plate of 3.5 mm x 5.0 mm (W x H) I am afterwards in this photo of the Access Door boarded, which unfortunately is not so distortion-free in the area of the door. rolleyes.gif

 

And in this photo one can see that the door is flat and has no attached panels. 

 

up061341.jpg
Source: NASA

 

Here's a similar picture at which the access door panel is removed, which is attached with 44 flat profile screws. 

 

up061329.jpg
Source: NASA

 

Thus, the Access Door and the Carrier Plate would have the following dimensions:

 

Access Door: 9,1 mm x 7,7 mm (W x H) 

 

Carrier Plate: 3,5 mm x 5,0 mm (W x H)

 

As one can see in the following image, the Fairings of the LO2 Feedline (17'') and of the GH2 Press. Line (2'') were added, as well as the LH2 PAL Ramp and the LO2 PAL Ramp, as well as the Supports for the two Press. Lines and the associated Cable Trays

 

up061330.jpg

 

Thereto Michael has suggested to omit the two thin Press. Lines and the Cable Trays, as they would go beyond the intertank anyway and could possibly break off during printing or transport. 

 

He was worried about the PAL Ramps. While the LO2 PAL Ramp could survive at the top, he fears that the LH2 PAL Ramp could probably break because it's very long and thin. So he asked if he should cut them off at the ends of the Intertank, which I agree with. up045518.gif

 

up061331.jpg

 

up061332.jpg

 

Since I anyway want to insert the LO2 Feedline and the Press, he should omit them away, but not the Cable Trays, because I could continue them to the front and backwards.

 

Then I still showed him these two photos, on which one can see that the bottom plates of the Fairings are flush with the stringers and not put onto, what he has accepted and wants to change.

 

up061333.jpg
Source: NASA

 

up061334.jpg
Source: NASA

 

These were essentially my hints and correction wishes.  up046118.gif

 

Regarding of his plates attached on the Access Door, which I had queried, he sent me this photo here, which surprised me, since I did not have seen it yet.

 

up061335.jpg

 

That's why I asked him if he had any source, whereby it could possibly be a Mock-up. undecided.gif

 

I believe that shows once again that a timely and consensual coordination of such details is important for a smooth process, that's why one never stops learning.   up040577.gif

Edited by spaceman
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Hello everybody,

 

let's go step by step on our way to the goal, here are the next images of Michael Key's 3D modeling. cool.gif 

 

As one can see in this image, he has omitted both the six plates in the door and adjusted their size, as well as he had corrected the distances of the AD and the CP from each other and from the Thrust Panel.  up045518.gif

 

up061495.jpg
Source: shapeways.com/forum (Michael Key)

 

The position of the CP, however, remained unchanged and still sits too high up, although I had already marked it in this last image, rolleyes.gif

 

up061341.jpg
Source: NASA

 

what one can also see in this photo.

 

up061496.jpg
Source: forum.nasaspaceflight.com (Jester)

 

Furthermore, it is noticeable that the bottom plate of the large LO2 Fairing admittedly is flush with the stringers, but not that of the small LH2 Fairing,

 

up061497.jpg
Source: shapeways.com/forum (Michael Key)

 

which is still to be corrected, according to the following photo, but hopefully will not cause any problems. rolleyes.gif

 

up061498.jpg
Source: NASA

 

Then here are two more images of the small supports of the GH2/GO2 Press. Lines (2''), first with the indicated lines,

 

up061499.jpg
Source: shapeways.com/forum (Michael Key)

 

and here the final design without the lines, whereby the thin wires (Ø 0.3 mm) will separately be inserted later and covered with small caps. up045518.gif

 

up061500.jpg
Source: shapeways.com/forum (Michael Key)

 

Now I hope that these last changes can also be considered by him, according to which an upload of the 3D model to Shapeways nothing would stand in the way. top.gif

 

But Michael Key wanted to be honest and told me, that there are some very small parts in this model that could possibly overstrain Shapeways' possibilities, so the model might not pass their inspections the first time around. That would be normal, and Shapeways would let him know the problem, which he would correct. smiley215.gif
That's why I'm very curious, but initially his modified model is still due. up040577.gif

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17 hours ago, spaceman said:

Hello everybody,

...

Regarding of his plates attached on the Access Door, which I had queried, he sent me this photo here, which surprised me, since I did not have seen it yet.

 

up061335.jpg

 

That's why I asked him if he had any source, whereby it could possibly be a Mock-up. undecided.gif

 

I believe that shows once again that a timely and consensual coordination of such details is important for a smooth process, that's why one never stops learning.   up040577.gif

Playing a bit with Google's reverse image search found another image of that door,

"The tank – also known as STA – was the third and final test tank for the Space Shuttle Program and was used for structures/stress testing at NASA’s Marshall Space Flight Center in Alabama between 1977 and 1980. After it had completed this task, the tank was placed on display at MSFC and then later at NASA’s Stennis Space Center in Mississippi. It was then moved to the KSC Visitor Complex in 1997 where it was visible to the public until April 2013."
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Thanks southwestforests for your sense of searching for the source of this photo of the Intertank-Access Door, shown by Michael Key:worship:

 

You've hit the nail on the head!!!  :thumbsup:  I had thought of a Mock-up right away. top.gif

 

In this article one can find this photo with its originator Jacques van Oene.

 

1246-nasa_space_shuttle_transition__retirement-jacques_van_oene.jpg

 

And in this Article I have found many other interesting photos, such as also this photo of the Carrier Plate, which is only five Stringers above the Access Door, as we meanwhile know.

 

space-shuttle-external-fuel-tank-5_29_2013-047.jpg

 

Very interesting details. smiley250.gif

Edited by spaceman
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