Jump to content

Space Shuttle Launch Pad 39A with Challenger STS-6 (1:144)


Recommended Posts

Hello everybody,

 

and now back to the 3D Intertank, where Michael Key is coming down the stretch after his considering of my last little changes. cool.gif

 

And just now, my "special" friend and helper DaveS in the NSF Forum comes out of the wood and presents me this interesting photo of the Access Door at STS-31 (1990), unfortunately without source. rolleyes.gif

 

But after I've found the image in Google, I recognized it from the URL, according to which it comes from the collection of George Gassaway, which I know by now. top.gif

 

1477143.jpg
Source: georgesrockets.com (George Gassaway)

 

And since I found a similar photo of the STS-30 (1989), I suspect that since the use of the Leightweight Tanks (LWT), starting at STS-6, such doors were installed, which apparently also had a foam insulation.   

 

STS-30_INT_Door_Umbil_crop.JPG
Source: georgesrockets.com (George Gassaway)

 

For this also militates this photo of my friend James MacLaren, which also shows such a door in the background. The image shows the Challenger on Pad 39-B, probably during the preparation for her fateful final mission STS-51L (1986), what I still will find out. huh.gif

 

jQkL6p.jpg
Source: forum.nasaspaceflight.com (James MacLaren)

 

Consequently the photo used so far for the 3D modeling shows a Graphite-Composite door, as has been used later on the Super Lightweight Tanks (SLWT)

 

EEJPuN.jpg
Source: NASA

 

like here at the STS-133 (2011). 

 

2010-5562-m.jpg
Source: NASA


For Michael Key's 3D-Modeling this realization is coming too late unfortunately, but which is not a problem, because I can glue this door with the two handles later on, especially since it is very small (9 mm x 8 mm), 

as one can see here. up040577.gif

 

QDv74s.jpg    

Edited by spaceman
Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...

Hello everyone,

 

now it goes on with the 3D Intertank journey, which went into the next round, which keeps me in suspense. rolleyes.gif

 

Unfortunately I have yet overlooked an important detail that was not yet correct in the last pictures of Michael Key's  3D model and consequently could not remain, what was to be seen 14 days ago in this picture.  

 

up061497.jpg
Source: shapeways.com/forum (Michael Key)

 

I had circled the part already, but at first I was only interested in the bottom plates of the two Fairings. cool.gif

 

After I had Michael Key pointed this and had been once more showing the still too high Carrier Plate, he wanted to get back to with the final model for the final checkup, for what I specifically had asked him befor a possible upload to Shapeways . schlaumeier.gif

 

Almost at the same time DaveS came up with this, so far unknown Access Door, how it most likely had looked like at  ET-8 during STS-6. top.gif

 

up061556.jpg
Source: georgesrockets.com (George Gassaway)

 

About this I have informed Michael Key and told him at the same time that he should not change the door, because I could scratch this little detail as well.

 

After that he surprised me with his final Intertank version, in which he had even considered this door in addition to the lower located Carrier Plate, which of course I was pleased. speak_cool.gif

 

w2EXDi.jpg
Source: shapeways.com/forum (Michael Key)

 

And here are further pictures of his 3D model:

 

1u6ocA.jpg

 

After I have begun to wonder about the arrangement of the two Fairings as well as the PAL Ramps and Cable Trays  cant-believe-my-eyes-smiley-emoticon.gif

 

tLOzft.jpg

 

at this close-up my hair suddenly stood on end. erschrocken3.gif

 

5dJqxP.jpg

 

Apart from the somewhat too crude shape of the big LO2 Fairing, both fairings are next to each other almost at one height, but what is not true, although in turn was clearly visible on previous photos, but what apparently he has not registered and consequently not so implemented. smiley_worship.gif

 

In reality, the arrangement of the fairings however looks like as at these two photos. cool.gif

 

bpUFmn.jpg
Quelle: NASA

 

hNiR2q.jpg
Source: NASA

 

But the bafflement was following, by telling me at the same time that he had uploaded his model to Shapeways, which would have allowed everybody to order immediately, but what was agreed otherwise, i5684_no2.gif by the way, for EUR 58 (WSF) or EUR 91 (FUD), but with these errors.   eek.gif 

 

And in the 3D panorama view of the Intertank in his Shapeways Shop, this error was also clearly visible (see red dashed line).

 

Furthermore, I wondered about the tapering shape till the top of the two PAL Ramps and the resulting gap to the Cable Trays, which is not true.  nono.gif

 

pqkvNv.jpg
Source: shapeways.com (The Aerospace Place)

 

Then I have immediately communicated Michael Key this change requirement on the basis of these earlier photos,

 

gOurBt.jpg
Source: NASA

 

i9aoUO.jpg
Source: NASA

 

what I have marked on this image again.

 

cIuzot.jpg
Source: shapeways.com (The Aerospace Place)

 

Because of these mistakes, I have asked him to remove his offer from his shop site immediately, which he then has done. hmmm.gif

 

A controversial point is still the form of the fairings and the arrangement of the GH2/GO2 Press. Lines, for which he has sent me this picture, in which I have marked my changes in red.

 

PR2MZk.jpg
Source: shapeways.com/forum (Michael Key)

 

And as one can see in these photos, the two Press. Lines should run closer to the LO2 Feedline .

 

DqRcub.jpg
Source: NASA

 

STS-59_ET-63_Mar94.jpg
Source: georgesrockets.com (George Gassaway)

 

As far as the current state. up040577.gif
Slowly but surely, but somehow we'll crack the hard nut like the squirrel. eichhoernchen_0006.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello everybody,

 

the Intertank in Michael Key's Shapeways Shop currently looks like this, but still with the important note Not For Sale, what will hopefully change soon. top.gif

 

710x528_22338957_12475127_1519068194.jpg
Source: shapeways.com (The Aerospace Place)

 

While everything looks awesome on this side, there are a few detail problems to solve on the other side.  smiley215.gif

 

But we can do it together, in any case I have supplied the necessary reference ammunition.  up040577.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello everybody,

 

Michael Key has still modified the shape of the two Fairings a bit, which looks really better now. cool.gif

 

vRnSN5.jpg
Source: shapeways.com/forum (Michael Key)

 

xcfhro.jpg

 

wKxZM7.jpg

 

And the arrangement of the details now agrees fairly well with the original and can therefore remain so.  speak_cool.gif 

 

tgI88m.jpg
Source: NASA

 

ldAGGQ.jpg

 

And since the wall thickness of the LO2 Fairing is only 0,25 mm in 1:144, we have agreed on to insert no opening for the LO2 Feedline (Ø 3mm), so I can glue the line directly. top.gif

 

Gjm05X.jpg

With that Michael Key has now reached the home stretch and the final is heralded. file.php?avatar=9546_1448235804.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Hotdog said:

Manfred, is this for the Airfix shuttle ET? It appears skewed in the latest 3D drawings. Which would make sense for the Airfix tank since it is tapered.

 

Hi Brian,

 

yes, it has been designed by Michael Key, whom you know, for my Airfix Shuttle Stack (1/144). top.gif

 

And this was also the tricky problem for Michael's 3D modeling, because the Airfix Intertank is a separate part of the ET and actually slightly tapered towards the front, which is unusual and initially surprised me a lot because one can not see it with the naked eye. cant-believe-my-eyes-smiley-emoticon.gif

 

[IMG]

 

Hard to believe, but true. up040577.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, anj4de said:

..." Which would make sense for the Airfix tank since it is tapered "... which I guess is not correct for the ET?

 

thanks

Uwe

 

Hi Uwe,

yep, that's the difference to your Revell ET Intertank, wherewith your doubts should be eliminated. up040577.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello everybody,

 

so friends, we are just before completion. cool.gif

 

At first still this small addendum, which I have reached out non-binding to  Michael Key, without knowing whether he would go into rapture in view of my previous special requests. rolleyes.gif

 

But I thought, asking does not cost anything, either-or?  nixweiss.gif

 

On this image of the STS-6 one can see these two areas, in which the Stringer-Valleys are filled up with Insulating foam, which would perfectly complete the already nicely detailed Intertank. top.gif

 

DJIuUw.jpg
Source: retrospaceimages.com (J. L. Pickering)

 

The white part (left) is the RSS Antenna, as well as an Aerodynamic Vent in the middle of the right-hand area, as I found it in George Gassaway's ET collection,  up045518.gif

 

here at STS-37 (ET-37),

 

ET-37_W_SRBs_plusZ_Jun90.jpg
Source: georgesrockets.com

 

as well as here at STS-36 (ET-33).

 

STS-36%20ET-33%201-90%20RSSant.jpg
Source: georgesrockets.com

 

And what should I tell you, in his final version, he has even implemented these two details.speak_cool.gif

 

b2HpvX.jpg
Source: shapeways.com/forum (Michael Key)

 

ku04kf.jpg
Source: shapeways.com/forum (Michael Key)

 

This surprise he really succeeded.   up040577.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello everybody,

 

after the events have almost happened in quick succession today, it is now done. yahoo.gif

 

But always nice in turn step by step. cool.gif

 

After Michael Key had uploaded his model to Shapeways, he sent me the link, from which the following images are taken, which are showing the awesome Intertank in different views, as one can see. top2.gif

 

Based on the large number of pictures you can already see how much the end product thrilled me ... erschrocken2.gif

 

MS3EOS.jpg

 

pNSBz9.jpg

 

jIV7JN.jpg

 

LiM3gR.jpg

 

ldogIb.jpg

 

IopbKr.jpg

 

Lixp7x.jpg

 

XICyny.jp

 

diuKrM.jpg

 

Thereupon I immediately ordered a print for 95,99 EUR incl. shipping. up045518.gif

 

In the midst of the delirium of joy then came a friend from our Raumcon Forum with his damper regarding the shrinkage problems at FUD and FXD, as well as in connection with the costly stiffening rings, which one would have to consider.  eek.gif

 

Based on these legitimate hints, Michael Key responded immediately and after a few changes has uploaded his model again, and now lets print it 0,8% larger. huh.gif

 

He also pointed out that one possibly might have to sand a bit, either on the printed Intertank or on the ET parts of the kit, but that would not be unusual and should be feasible. top.gif

 

However, as this model, with a wall thickness of about 0,7 mm, is quite thin, he would not recommend removing the stiffening rings. Instead, he has reduced their mass by enlarging the holes in the middle, which has fortunately resulted in a cost savings of about 20 EUR, that one can not complain about. speak_cool.gif

 

And those changes looked like this.

 

rj1s1N.jpg

 

3cvr3X.jpg

 

Thereupon I immediately have canceled my first order and reordered new, and here is the current Link, over which one now can order the Airfix Intertank (1:144) for 71,83 EUR in FUD, and in the 3D view (top right) one can keep a close eye on it from all sides. spiegel-smilies-0002.gif

 

XafzJf.jpg
Source: shapeways.com (The Aerospace Place)

 

Now I hope that Shapeways can also print the part with all its details, wherefore all available thumbs are needed, JC_doubleup.gif to make it to a round matter in the end in the truest sense of the word.  up040577.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites

Another outstanding job by Mr. Key! I remember my solution was to try and make a stringer wrap with engraved styrene sheet. Because of the 1mm taper, I had to warp the artwork for the wrap by 2% at the top.

1ikcy0.jpg

Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes, he actually did it optimally although it was very difficult to implement my ambitious ideas. idea1_2.gif

But now we can look at a great result and can be proud of. top.gif

I tried to help him as much as possible and have picked out my best reference photos. i6073_lupe.gif

All's well that ends well.  Now only Shapeways has to realize it.  JC_doubleup.gif

 

BTW, how thin was your styrene sheet and could you use your idea successfully? hmmm.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow. Looks like I’m gonna have to build another Airfix stack. 

 

The New Ware stack set has a wrap for the intertank section. It’s pretty good with the detail, but I think it’s going to be a challenge trying to adhere it to the plastic. Plus the Revell model (as it is intended for) requires a lot of work sanding down the molded ribbing. I think I posted a few photos in my discovery build. The wrap is very thin. 

 

This new piece will definitely make things easier. I will need to buy a few when they are available. Nice job Manfred. The research you do is incredible. 

 

Mike. 

Edited by egt95
Link to post
Share on other sites

Manfred,

 

The styrene sheet I used was .010" thick. I made it as accurate as I could, but due to limitations of my Silhouette cutter, I could not scribe as intricately the intertank ribs like in 3D printing. The wrap did fit well (thanks to my hard work and calculations), but the tapered nature of the Airfix ET really bothered me once I became aware of it, and it became noticible to my eye even though I knew no one else would notice it. I may be willing to give the Airfix ET another look once I see how Mr. Key's solution looks on your model build.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Brian,

 

I can imagine, that it could have been a bit tricky for your Silhouette cutter with all the stringers and ribs of the IT, although the cutter seems to be a miracle weapon, right? smiley215.gif

 

BTW, have you applied this wrap, if so, I would be interested in an image, how it looked. top.gif

 

Now let's see, how the new 3D Intertank will look like, then we are smarter,  whereby I don't hope that Shapeways will say: Mission impossible. up040577.gif

 

Edited by spaceman
Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow. Looks like I’m gonna have to build another Airfix stack. 

 

The New Ware stack set has a wrap for the intertank section. It’s pretty good with the detail, but I think it’s going to be a challenge trying to adhere it to the plastic. Plus the Revell model (as it is intended for) requires a lot of work sanding down the molded ribbing. I think I posted a few photos in my discovery build. The wrap is very thin. 

 

This new piece will definitely make things easier. I will need to buy a few when they are available. Nice job Manfred. The research you do is incredible. 

 

Mike. 

 

Thanks Mike for your compliments, :worship:

 

the research and evaluation of all the details a well as the endless scaling of measurements was my humble job, and Michael Key has conjured thereout an outstanding intertank. top2.gif 

 

BTW, I know the kit from your thread and had already considered whether I buy it ... hmmm.gif

 

Only for fun, if you would count the stringers and ribs in Newware's IT wrap, I do not think you'll find all the 108 Stringers and 52 Ribs, wanna Bet? up040577.gif

Edited by spaceman
Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello everybody,

 

my next project will be the Ice/Frost Ramps on the LH2 External Tank, and I hope that Michael Key can help me with this as well.  up040577.gif

 

FaWuvj.jpg

Source: NASA

 

And so the ramps for the GO2/GH2 Press. Lines look like in detail.

 

LKalCW.jpg

Source: NASA

 

I know that Bill (niPartshas modeled a set of these Ice ramps in 1:72, but in 1:144 they are unfortunately much smaller.

 

710x528_5088747_1336648_1459324146.jpg

Source: shapeways.com (niParts)

 

In reality these ramps are 2' x 2' x 1' , that means 2 mm x 2 mm x 1 mm for the ET (1:144).

 

The diameter of the LH2/GH2 Press. Lines is 2'' = Ø 0,35 mm (1:144) and should be the reference. up045518.gif

 

The openings in the ramps are slightly larger, approx. Ø 0.5 mm, as one can see in this image.

 

h0KrvK.jpg

 

Maybe that these very thin wall thicknesses could be a problem for Shapeways 3D printer? hmmm.gif

Edited by spaceman
Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi everybody,

 

Shipped! super.gif

 

Just now, I've got Shapeways' pleasant message, that they have shipped the Intertank (€ 73,26). top.gif

 

up061801.jpg

 

Consequently Michael Key's 3D model seems to have been print-ready. speak_cool.gif

 

Now I'm very curious what the part will look like.  up040577.gif

 

Edited by spaceman
Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello everybody,

 

meanwhile, the long-awaited package of Shapeways has arrived, at first again only a feather-light box with lots of air in it, which was carefully let out. cool.gif

 

6NTBQf.jpg

 

And before the last shell fell, one could already see the object of desire.  

 

F8PoUg.jpg

 

Compared with the accustomed images of the 3D model, the Intertank looks at first glance rather inconspicuous, because one can not really perceive the details due to the semi-transparent FUD look and really must look very closely,  cant-believe-my-eyes-smiley-emoticon.gif especially as there is sticking a lot of supporting wax in the fine grooves of the Stringer and Ribs, which still has to be removed. rolleyes.gif But stable feels the part anyway. 

 

iFzoEL.jpg

 

But what has attracted my attention immediately was the fact that the inner support tube was missing,  smiley_worship.gif through which I want to thread the support rod for the SRBs, which surprised me a lot and I can not explain,  noidea2.gif

 

vH1iOr.jpg

especially since the tube still was to be seen on Michael Key's3D model images, 

 

GXouQY.jpg

 

as well as in the 3D view on Shapeways' website, which is very strange ... smiley215.gif

tPEyM8.jpg
Source: shapeways.com (The Aerospace Place)

 

The later-planned steel rod (Ø 1.5 mm) could not at first be inserted into the opening and pushed through, but after a few attempts it was still possible, albeit with some difficulty. rolleyes.gif

 

After this first disillusionment I've tried out the provisionally taped front part of the ET,

 

xU2Z5M.jpg

 

which let fit tightly onto the intertank. 

 

fKYnb5.jpg

 

And here are some more images with an attempt to catch some of the details but what was not easy.

 

Here is a look at the two Fairings as well as the PAL Ramps and Cable Trays, although the latters can hardly be recognized. 

 

q1xVIE.jpg 

 

X2PqpG.jpg

 

In contrast to the narrow fit of the front part, I noticed perceptible clearance of the parts when setting the Intertank onto the rear part of the ET. 

 

JIMSXt.jpg

 

But otherwise the part is coming out quite well, I think. speak_cool.gif

 

537o8o.jpg

 

QrpYWe.jpg

 

Buz10l.jpg

 

And I just when I wanted to put the Intertank together with the ASTC rings in my new ultrasonic bath for cleaning, 

 

IYyFUY.jpg

 

as I noticed that the rear inner ring was broken and had detached nearly over half the length from the inner wall, as if it had not been tied to it at all. eek.gif

 

n62YMT.jpg

 

How this can happen is completely obscure to me, especially since the laser melts together the wafer-thin layers of powder when printing, really strange ...  hmmm.gif

 

To this amazing finding and the missing inner tube I have to consult Michael Key and hear what he means, then we'll see.  up040577.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi everybody,

 

now again to the missing inner tube, from which even Michael Key was very surprised, because when he has checked the number of parts of the model on Shapeways' website, there was displayed it with "1", which means, that everything is connected. huh.gif

 

Then I looked at the 3D Panoramic view of the model at Shapeways' website once more very closely and found a setting where one can see that the tube on both sides clearly is not connected to the inner wall of the tank, which will now be the main subject of my complaint to Shapeways next to the crack of the inner ring. schlaumeier.gif

 

fwvhEw.jpg

 

As Michael Key has told me, it would be Shapeways' standard method of sending a reprint, whereupon I'd like to renounce because I don't want to have a part with the same errors.  i5684_no2.gif Instead, I should ask them for a refund and say that there are some other issues with the model, whereat I have informed the designer, who is ready to modify his model for a better version. Besides I could casually mention Shapeways' 100% Satisfaction guarantee" with which they apparently advertise. top.gif

 

I have informed Shapeways about this today and hope for their goodwill, to grant me a refund, in order to get an improved Intertank with inner tube in the second attempt.  up040577.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites

From the looks of your photos, Manfred, the piece turned out really good. I’m glad you caught the discrepancies and relayed them to us. I was about to purchase one. Kind of steap in price though. $75 US.  But when I do it, it needs to be right. 

 

Oh and by the way.  I apologize for not getting back to you on the PAL ramp dimensions from the New Ware products. I recently returned to work post ACL surgery and have been working nights. I’m still trying to readjust to a 3 on 3 off work schedule. 

 

Mike. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Joe and Mike, that's right. :thumbsup:

 

BTW, Shapeways is still remaining silent, whatever that may mean. smiley215.gif 

 

Do not worry, Mike, about the Ice/Frost Ramps, another friend has helped me.

 

First, get well soon, that's more important. up040577.gif

 

 

 

Edited by spaceman
Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello everybody,

 

today I tested my new Ultrasonic cleaning bath.

 

Here is a vivid video of it by BANDELIN, on which one can see the ultrasonic cleaning of a chain in fast motion, and two images for comparison, in the initial state before cleaning,

 

up062004.jpg

 

and afterwards. cool.gif

 

up062005.jpg

 

I was surprised by the time of about 4 hours, which may have been due to the selected object. rolleyes.gif

 

But I did not let myself be guided by that when cleaning my first two ASTC Rings (FUD), especially since the device only allows max. 10 minutes.

 

up062006.jpg

 

The device has 5 pre-set cleaning intervals, 90 sec., 180 sec., 300 sec., 480 sec. and 600 sec., which are automatically switched off by the timer. Obviously there is no on/off for security reasons, which I consider to be a disadvantage, especially when I think of cleaning the Intertank with its lots of fine grooves, which will certainly have to run for a longer time. up047089.gif

 

That's why I asked the manufacturer if there is no other option than having to restart the timer over and over again. smiley_worship.gif

 

Anyway, I've let clean the FUD rings twice 600 seconds, so for a total of 20 minutes with some drops of rinse aid, after which they looked whiter than before, which has already been described by other guys. 

 

up062007.jpg

 

This can be seen by this comparison between the cleaned FUD rings (left) and the uncleaned FXD rings (right), although it is not serious.

 

up062008.jpg

 

And here are the two FXD rings (right) after 20 minutes of cleaning.

 

up062009.jpg

 

BTW,  the liquid looked so cloudy after cleaning of total of 40 minutes cleaning time of the four ASTC Rings, which shows in comparison to the picture before the cleaning already a quite enriched state with detached wax. huh.gif

 

up062010.jpg

 

As far as to my first ultrasonic cleaning attempts. up040577.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...