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Space Shuttle Launch Pad 39A with Challenger STS-6 (1:144)


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Manfred,

The pallet is beautiful! :thumbsup: I can only imagine how much time you've spent researching all these details. Keep up the great work, it's an inspiration to us all.

Mike.

Edited by crowe-t
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Hi Mike,

thanks for your praising words. That is really unbelievable, how much time one must invest, in order to come behind the last details and to find suitable informations and photos. And one needs substantially more time for looking than for the actual building. But only if one solved the mysteries, one can be content. Thus am I anyhow, that's my motivation. :thumbsup:

:wave:

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Before it continued to go to the left on the pallet, it however still gave another surprise by a new photo.

I had already stated that the right pallet in D. Maiers Paper Kit is somewhat too short. And on the basis of photos I've meant that it goes at least to something over half of the Bay 6 outside. In the meantime I know it more exactly. The pallet goes even up to the border between Bay 5 and 6, how one can see in this photo.

up018553.jpg

source: Jay Patterson (NASASpaceflight.com)

The arrow marks the left end of the right pallet framework. Keep in mind for orientation the foot of the camera to the left of the arrow, and if you then look at the next picture, you can see, where that is about on the platform.

up018554.jpg

source: NASA

The right pallet is so long in reality, it reaches up to the arrow, and thus the pallet from D. Maiers Kit is approximately 1 cm, too short nevertheless!

That means that I must extend my pallet framework still by the missing piece up to the border between Bay 5 and 6.

Thus first times the pallet framework was extended on the left by the missing piece. Then were added still a few new details. For the LOX Filter a small platform was prepared from two small H-Beams and sheet, already the round profiles for the filter was ready put. Besides a further piping mounting plate lies.

verlngerungteile.jpg

In the meantime I've noticed from pictures that there are obviously different designs of the LOX filter, depending on which MLP was used. With the MLP-2 the LOX filter sees in such a way from as in this picture with the STS-132:

up017258.jpg

source: NASA

The LOX line flows here directly into the filter part with the largest diameter. Differently it looks e.g. with the MLP-3 with the STS-124. There the filter has several diameter gradations, and the LOX pipe flows into the lower part with the smaller diameter.

filtermlp3.jpg

source: NASA

And here now still another photo with the new details on the right pallet:

verlngerungp.jpg

I followed to the thing with the different LOX filters again and therefore I looked at myself in particular older photos of the earlier Shuttle missions. And afterwards is it really like that: The two MLP's MLP-1 and MLP-2 have this filter, as it is to be seen on the panorama photo of the STS-132.

And here to the confirmation is again an older picture of the STS-63 (1995), on which this type of filter on the MLP-2 is to be recognized well with High resolution (2x clicks). And with the STS-6 MLP-2 was likewise in the use with this LOX filter.

sts63mlp2xxl.jpg

source: NASA

The MLP-3 against it had always the other filter design, as in the photo of the STS-124, which would be clarified thereby.

:wave:

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Mafred your work is great and u have a good eye on the details.

Nice refertce pics to i hope when i start my MLP i hope looks half as good.

Keep up the goed work will be impressing when finnishd.

Mark

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Thanks Mark for the kind words.

And here is a new update. Since I dedicate my project to the mission STS-6, with which the MLP-2 was in use, I therefore tried to scratch-build this type of LOX filter.

Here are the parts necessary for it. Those are two different pipe diameters, which larger (5 mm) for the top, into which the LOX pipe flows, and a smaller part under it, which sit on the small platform, as well as a cover sheet.

filterrohre.jpg

Beside the cover sheet lies a small board, which sits before the filter on the pallet framework. There one must look then later already exactly, in order to recognize it. And then the filter in the top has still a circulating nip, which I would like suggest as ring. In addition I used a thin wire (0.4 mm), which I preformed around the thicker filter pipe.

ringbiegen1.jpg

That can be glued now on the prefabricated filter with superglue.

ringr.jpg

And that is now the finished LOX filter, and besides to the comparison again the filter from the Paper kit. With one by the way sees the small board mentioned above on the black underground.

filteru.jpg

And that's now the fitting of the nearly finished right pallet, which could actually go now into the paint shop. A few small props in addition had still come.

filterpalletcent.jpg

Now naturally still the thicker LOX and LH2 pipes as well as some thinner pipings, as well as mounting plates/clips, etc. are missing ... :rolleyes:

And thus it is now time to take next the LOX and LH2 pipes. I want to proceed in such a way that I begin first on the Side 2 in order to see, how the two main pipes run around the corner to the Side 1, in order to manage the local binding well in particular those the LOX pipe, which leads inevitably by the LOX filter.

Here in this picture one can see quite well, how the pipes run around the corner.

loxlh2leitungen.jpg

source: NASA

So long guys.

:wave:

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Hi Youngtiger1,

Thanks for all your encouraging words, that's nice.

Let's have a look at the LOX-Pipes for Side 2. Those are here the pipes and Pipe Supports from the Paper kit, of which with however, honestly said, I have a horror. :woot.gif:

pipesgro.jpg

In particular if I look at myself and present in addition the handling layout in such a way in the following cross section to have to turn this “tube duo†together/into one another/against each other of paper, that frightens me! :blink:

pipesmakro.jpg

And to all abundance still with these small diameters: From the circumferences of the pipes from the kit one comes for the somewhat thicker LOX-pipe (white) on a diameter of 1.7 mm and for the LH2-pipe(grey) on 1.5 mm. :woot.gif:

But before I begin with the LOX/LH2-pipes, I wanted to plan after the Right pallet now also still the Left pallet on the Access Platform AP 1, since I know meanwhile, how it looks now with high probability in reality.

And also this pallet differs from David Maier's Paper kit. It is a closed frame construction, thus with a cover, but has however no break, something other dimensions, and sits not directly before the MLP wall, but about centrically on the Access platform, as will be to see alike.

There is no beautiful complete top view as with the right pallet, but nevertheless good front and side views, on which one can recognize something.

In this picture one can see the total length of the pallet, which reaches from Bay 1 to Bay 4,

linkespalletpfeile.jpg

source: NASA

and in this picture the end of left side, from which one can determine the width of the pallet.

anfanglpalletpfeil.jpg

source: Jay Patterson (NASASpaceFlight.com)

And those here are now the individual parts of the pallet, without break, the framework from I-beam (2,4x1,2 mm) and the cover from Sheet (0.4 mm), and behind it to the comparison again the pallet from the Paper kit, with break.

rahmenlpneu.jpg

On the pallet there are otherwise only the mounting plates for the LOX- and LH2-pipes, which run in different height and distance from the MLP wall.

:wave:

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Hi guys,

thanks for the nice words.

In the meantime the two pallets of the Access Platform AP 1 were in the paint shop and wait now for their armatures and pipings.

pallewt12.jpg

And looks already completely acceptably, as I find.

pallewt12mlp.jpg

In the meantime I tried to measure the diameters of the LOX/LH2-pipes from reference photos so that the pipes can be installed now finally. I wanted to begin on the Side 2, on which the two LOX pipes run. The something thinner of the two pipes is the white LOX Transfer line, and the thicker (grey) the associated Vent line.

I will make the lines however not of paper but from plastic, what appears me simpler and above all more stable. For these two fuel pipes there are eight Pipe supports on the Side 2. And those are in the paper template already considerable mites, which one can recognize in this picture on the basis the size comparison.

supportvorlage.jpg

I wanted to try it in any case, however when cutting out and folding already nearly despaired. It concerns gate widths of approx. 1.5 mm, in order those to fold itself several times would have, in order to model from the thing a framework. And that is an almost hopeless venture, because these thin bars very fast can tear up and one can hardly hold anyway. Although I am very patient actually and not like fast give up, I finally let it be and tried something else.

With the second support I glued first one half on cardboard (1 mm) and then cut these out, partial without the creases with the shears, the recesses for the pipes however with the cutter, which was to be made just in such a way. Afterwards the second half was cut out and glued on the back. The result one can see here in the next picture.

supportpappe.jpg

In addition, that is at least practicable, but the support looks not so great, particularly since the Pipe supports in reality look somewhat differently, as one can see in this photo.

loxlh2leitungen1.jpg

source: NASA

Apart from the only suggested upper free Pipe opening it is veilful me why the Pipe supports are implemented in the Paper kit not as closed frameworks, in addition the middle bar is continuous. Thus all in all that's not a convincing solution, therefore I will try, to scratch-build the Pipe Supports from plastic profiles, although that might become surely also no sugar licking. :rolleyes:

:wave:

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Thanks Mike for your encouraging comment.

Before it starts with the Pipe supports from plastic, first however again briefly back to the two pallets on the Access Platform AP 1, which I had painted some days before. Afterwards regarded, the cover of the left pallet appeared to me then nevertheless somewhat too evenly/brightly,

up018805.jpg

why I adapted it to the color of the MLP deck somewhat. And in such a way it pleases me now nevertheless better.

up018839.jpg

And now to my attempts to scratch-build the Pipe supports on the Side 2 for the two LOX lines from plastic, here again the first prototype from paper/cardboard to the comparison beside the new from plastic.

up018840.jpg

For the front frame parts I used U-Beams 1.7x1.0 mm, and for the remaining parts rectangle profile 1,5x1,0 mm. And it doesn't look bad nevertheless, up to the connection of the lower bevel, and this prototype is already in any case more stable than the paper variant. Completely contently I am not however thereby also because of the different profile thicknesses (1.7 mm - 1.5 mm) yet, why I made still another further attempt.

up018841.jpg

With this prototype (in front) the entire support is from I-Beam 1.5x1.2 mm, which the actual profile thicknesses and profile form better corresponds. Therefore I will remain now with this type and will manufacture the remaining seven supports in the same way. If I had it nevertheless only already ... :rolleyes:

:wave:

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Hi Pete,

which for a nice surprise, thank you for your praising words in German, that's almost perfectly. :rolleyes:

And I have also a surprise, I've just found a new photo of the Pipe supports at the Side 2, on which one can recognize their structure somewhat more exactly.

side3s2halterungen.jpg

source: NASA

How one can recognize on it when high resolution (2 x click), the cross-beams of the supports are not full profiles, as I thought so far, but flat angle profiles on both sides of the framework. And there I thought in such a way, All good things are three, and built still another third prototype of the Pipe support, which copies this structure in approximately, as is to be seen in these pictures:

supportpt31.jpg

supportpt3.jpg

That is the same framework from I-beams 1.5x1.2 mm as with the 2nd prototype, and the cross-beams are Evergreen flat profiles 0.75x0.25 mm, since there are no so small angle profiles. And this support is more delicate and for my taste still a little bit closer to the original than the other one, what do you think about in addition? :coolio:

And although there are four parts more, this support lets itself manufacture nearly some more lighter than the type of predecessor.

:wave:

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Thanks Mike for your nice comment, I find also that the last support succeeded to me well.

And therefore I started with the series production of the remaining seven Pipe supports for the Side 2. But I cut myself first times the individual parts, the frame parts from I-beam 1.5x1.3 mm and the cross-beams from Evergreen StripStyrene 0.75x0.25 mm. That were altogether 77 individual parts, which could be only manipulated with the tweezers. In addition then still Superglue (Pattex Ultra Gel) and toothpicks came for the stressful sticking orgy. :wacko:

supportteile.jpg

And in such a way the result looks, hardly to believe guys, but it is actually done, and I'm down, but happy. banana.gif

supports1.jpg

supports2.jpg

The ends of the cross-beams are now still carefully deburred and/or filed, and then the supports can be tried on already at the Side 2, in order to adapt still the lateral struts.

So far for today, thank God flehan.gif , that would be done for a start. 271.gif

:wave:

Edited by spaceman
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And after the joy promptly the disillusionment came, because there an unexpected problem emerged suddenly. In the transition from the Side 1 to the Side 2 there is a small, but nevertheless serious error in the sheets of D. Maiers kit, which stops for a start the transfer of the LOX Pipes and prepared me headaches. BANGHEAD2.jpg

As is to be seen in this picture in the original, the lower edges of the bar, on which the first Pipe support sits on the Side 2 (left arrow), and the lower edge of the Access Platform AP 1 on the Side 1 (right arrow) lie on the same line, i.e. thus on same height.

loxlh2leitungenpfeile.jpg

source: NASA

That is unfortunately not in the Kit sheets however like that, as is shown by the following picture. Afterwards the suggested Access Platform AP 1 is on the Side 1 approx. 2 mm more highly than the lower edge of the bar, on which the first Pipe support (s) sits, and thus too highly for the transition of the lower LOX Pipe, particularly since on the Access Platform still the left pallet with a height of approx. 2.5 mm and on it then still the mounting plates of the LOX Pipe sits.

s2s1kit.jpg

The discrepancy becomes still clearer from the following picture, with which I put a Pipe support with the lower LOX pipe in addition.

s2s1leitung.jpg

Now please do not disturb you to it that the kit template is on a scale 1:144, my Pipe support however 1:160. One nevertheless clearly sees however, where the pipe walks on the Side 1, and as minimal the gap is between the suggested Access Platform and the pipe lying over it. There now no pallet fits between them, neither with nor without mounting plates with the best will.

The matter of price is now, where the error lies? Does the Access Platform sits correctly on the Side 1 or the prop and thus the first Pipe support on the Side 2, which then yes still further seven supports follow? One of both must be changed in the height, or be adapted perhaps also together however, so that the pipings in the height fit. Still good advice is expensive. :woot.gif:

Therefore I must try now to measure the situation of both components as exactly as possible on the basis of good detail photos in order to be able to decide thereafter on the change. Possibly it come down yes also to a compromise. :rolleyes: The state of affairs is joyless, but not hopeless. Larger problems it would give in any case, if I had to set the Access Platform more deeply, because it glued rather firmly. cry.gif

:wave:

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Manfred,

I think it is safe to say that for all of us who frequent this forum we all have shared your recent frustration at one time or another during a build. We may live in different countries and speak different languages but modeling is a universal language. This is nothing but a speedbump and knowing your qualifications I'am sure that in no time at all you will have rectified the situation.

Edited by stevenichols
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Thanks Mike and Steve for your comfort and that you don't let me down. :rolleyes: That makes courage for me and gives me again new drive to make further and look for a solution.

:wave:

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I property therefore tried out, as it looks, if I shift the pipes so far upward in the pipe supports that still place for the left pallet with its pipe supports on the Access Platform on the Side 1 remains, if I would leave the Access Platform in the height in such a way:

s2s1leitungenprobe.jpg

Now would be still enough place for the left pallet, however at least half of the cross-beams for the pipe supports would sit too deeply on Side 2. But somehow this solution does not please me, since the pipes run upward forward too far, so particularly it looks somehow unrealistically, or what do you think? :rolleyes:

Well times sees, how I will solve that, however actually only the larger evil would remain, in addition I would have to really eliminate the Access Platform AP 1 now again and put it somewhat more deeply, in order to win place, what a horror thought!!! cry.gif

But long speech, short sense, we say in Germany, I bit into the sour apple and decided me nevertheless for the Emergency Operation. :woot.gif: The EO was laborious and stressfully, but in the long run successfully, patient is appropriate still in coma, is however surprisingly so far okay. That is the advantage of glueing with Superglue on paper, it holds on very fast, gives way however during bending load then sometime suddenly, and that's mine turn out well.

30911803.jpg

I had introduced the operation myself actually more badly, and/or first than venture nearly offering no prospects. With large caution and patience nevertheless to some extent succeeded then, although I occurred myself thereby however like a dentist, who had to pull all four wisdom teeth at once. :woot.gif:

Meanwhile the sticking props for the Access Platform are put according to deeper, so that the vertical height is balanced now and the LOX pipes on the Side 2 can run as before. Tomorrow the platform is then again glued to, and then the Pipe supports can be installed onto the Side 2. I consider only just whether I adapt, glue the lateral bracers at the supports still before painting and paint the supports then completely, or whether I paint the supports only still without bracers, afterwards glues to, and afterwards glues the before painted bracers to?

That is unfortunately somewhat pedantically with this mixture technology of paper and plastic, but, which is it, thus must I live, nothing is impossible ... :rolleyes:

:wave:

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Manfred,

Lowering the Access Platform as you did seems to be the best way to fix this. This way the pipe supports on Side 2 are in the correct position. Well done.

Mike.

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Thanks Mike and Clive for your encouraging words.

After the EO-Repair the platform on Side 1 could be installed and lies now somewhat more deeply.

ap1zm.jpg

And so place for the left pallet is now also still sufficient, over which the LOX Pipes can run.

pipess.jpg

Some little things, except which lateral bracers, have however to be still re-tooled at the Pipe supports. So that the pipings rest upon about centrically in the openings of the supports, still small bearings from Evergreen Strips 1,5x0,38 mm must be applied on the two lower cross-beams. Otherwise the pipes lie somewhat too deeply, which does not look so great. :rolleyes:

auflagen.jpg

:wave:

Edited by spaceman
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The hardest part is the disappointment in having to break apart what you've already built ... but the solution always makes it all worthwhile, doesn't it?

Your solution looks as good as new, Manfred! Wunderbare arbeit!

Pete

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