PB4Y-2 Top Turret Surprise

[B24RESEARCHER]

You're in trouble now...I figured out how to post photos!

Below you will find an example of the early (first 77) PB4Y-2s with several very interesting features. This is PB4Y-2 BuNo 59374, taken at Whidby Island in, I believe, 1944.

First item worthy of note is the nose section, looking for all practical intents and purposes like a mid-production B-24J-CO, complete with the A6B nose turret.

The next items are the top turrets. Note that the forward turret has all the appearances of the Martin A3C, while the rear turret is the A3D High Hat. While I have pretty much stopped researching the Privateer out of respect for the book I know is being worked on, I suspect that this may be a similar situation to that encountered on late B-24Hs - Block 25 and 30 - where Martin produced roughly 900 turrets as A3Ds but with the same dome and gunsight as the A3C. This is why AAF documents say the aircraft were equipped with A3Ds but photos seem to show the A3C. Neither Allan Blue nor I have come up with an explanation as to why this was, but we both agree that documents are clear (documents to which he did not have access when he wrote his great "The B-24 Liberator" some 30 years ago or more.

The camouflage is the then-standard beat-up-all-to-heck three-tone scheme.

If there are any PB4Y-2 researchers out there with actual documentary evidence explaining this (and I believe the same thing happened with B-24J-COs as well), I'd love to see the documents, recalling my "no documents, no facts" philosopy!

So for you modelers, here is yet another wonderful opportunity for a clearly different-looking model for the shelf or the contest table!

Enjoy!

Alan (Uncle Al the Modeler's Pal) Griffith

Edited April 11, 2012 by B24RESEARCHER

[Phil marchese]

Yes the picture demonstrates what I pointed out to Al Blue an a select others that the high dome A-3D was introduced early in the Privateer production in mid 1944 . I also concluded that the high dome and the A-3D designation were not in a one to one relationship. I did this using the AAF monthly armament updates and three years or collaborating photographic evidence before discussing it with Mr. Blue privately in early 2007. So yes Al Blue got this wrong in 1975 but he and I figured out why in 2007.

f also igured out the connection to the 2x4 production and the 2x4 back when you had concocted an impossible senerio. That is when you dropped your falable distribution theory and took up your foray into Privateer research . Ok I said it. I discovered the. Relationship between the low dome H-25/30 and the PB4Y-2 production back in 2007 and have the material to back up the statement. It was not reseased beyond Al and a few others expressly because of your presence at bestweb.

Sidenote Alan has interjected the H-25/30 in several unrelated post knowing full well. With malice of forthought to egg on conflict. It is what is also at the root of the protect of information his is willing to share to modelers openly. Alvis and all I apologize for this diversion in this forum but it is past overdue to set the honest record straight.

Edited April 11, 2012 by Phil marchese

[Phil marchese]

The factual data we can assume you poccess is the source of supply , month quanty and employment in aircraft by serial number of every Martin A-3D segregated by dome type supplied to all USN & AAF. Contracts calling for GFE delivery of this model turret including spares from Introduction of the D to the advent of the B-24L. Short of that you fall short of the standard of research you profess.

[B24RESEARCHER]

Documents. Documents. Documents. Specific references.

Stand and deliver. I'm sure they can be shown here. I'm willing to be wrong, but it needs to be proven.

Alan Griffith

[Phil marchese]

Next we can look at how NT met the requirement for enclosed waists in USSTAF;

When the L-CO finally enclosed waist;

How the various B-24 contractts reacted to AAF single acceptance policy:

What became of the B-24K-NT program planned in April 1943;

What is the significance of the G-16-NT & J-2-NT ;

What became of the B-24M-NT;

Why there was a clear detacable waist hatch w/o gun mounts;

When and why search cababilty was incresing inthe B-24 population by. Sept 1944;

What became of the programed 100 OCAD nose kits for local overseas installation;

And how can the C series be the production prototype if it was produced concurrent with the D series for three months and about an equal number of D deliivered before the last C?

Have at it champ....its all in your book is not an answer. What is your documentation?.

[Alvis 3.1]

You two don't listen very well, do you?

Al P.

[Alvis 3.1]

Now, let's think for a bit, ok? If either of you two have any interest in showing what information you have, then feel free to do so with the rest of us on ARC. If you feel like continuing your feud, feel free to use the PM system. If you disagree, fine, show what YOU have to show, and leave out the insults, cheap shots, whining, complaining and little cute hidden secret messages to each other.

Al P.