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pastafarian

whiff P-61 aew aircraft

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Hey folks,

I have it in my head to build a P-61 that has been converted to an AEW bird. I'm guessing the designation would be something like EP-61H? sound about right?

Anyway, removing all the guns, placing a copilot's position behind the pilot, the AEW radome is from one of the skyraider AEW birds from the parts bin, wingfolds since she was originally a US Navy prototype, and I'm replacing the engines with scratch built turbo props. I think I'm going to put her in Mexican AF markings.

Couple of questions. :P

1. the rear section of the monogram kit has what looks like a radar operator equipment. If I'm replacing the smaller kit radar with that big radome, would the equipment look the same? I'm thinking about just putting a larger shroud (the cone that covers the radar screen) as a means of suggesting that the radar kit had a larger display. sound ok?

2. I'm guessing that I wouldn't use the "radar" nose for the p-61 since I have the large radome underneath. Should I use the other nose in the kit?

3. Not sure if this is an issue or not yet, but the radome may obstruct the nose hatch for the crew. If that's the case, can the crew in the front exit the aircraft through the rear door, or is there no passageway to the rear?

Thanks,

John

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While I'm not an expert on the P-61 (cool plane but not really my prime area of interest), I suspect that the radar equipment wouldn't look much different. If you want a larger display, go for it.

Both noses are "radar" noses. The longer one is because the P-61B had a slightly longer foward fuselage between the rear of the radome and the cockpit. Use whichever you like, although I'd probalby go for the longer version.

The forward crew entry is through the nosewheel well, If I'm not mistaken. If your radome installation blocks that, then it's blocking the retraction of the nose wheel too and likely wouldn't fly. The overhead hatch was an emergency exit I think.

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While I'm not an expert on the P-61 (cool plane but not really my prime area of interest), I suspect that the radar equipment wouldn't look much different. If you want a larger display, go for it.

Both noses are "radar" noses. The longer one is because the P-61B had a slightly longer foward fuselage between the rear of the radome and the cockpit. Use whichever you like, although I'd probalby go for the longer version.

The forward crew entry is through the nosewheel well, If I'm not mistaken. If your radome installation blocks that, then it's blocking the retraction of the nose wheel too and likely wouldn't fly. The overhead hatch was an emergency exit I think.

all of the above is correct, and to answer your other question, there was no way for the forward crew to access the rear area internally. both areas where completely separate and isolated. You could make it so they use the emergency exit as the main entry point.

Sean

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Cool idea! You would need to leave the nose gear well clear for the nose gear to retract. As others said the nose gear well is the pilot and gunners entry point. The radar operator has his own entry hatch at the rear of the crew nacelle. If you need more info on the P-61, shoot me an e-mail, be happy to assist.

Cheers, Terry

(Certifiable P-61 NUT!!)

RM P-61 kits

10 built(8 for myself)

5 on the bench

29 in the stash

GWH P-61 kits

1 1st issue kit(under construction)

1 2nd issue kit(courtesy GWH/Loinroar for review)

Multiples of most LSM conversion/detail sets

Multiples of most PE sets

Multiples of nearly all decal sheets for it.

Edited by nightiemission

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RM P-61 kits

10 built(8 for myself)

5 on the bench

29 in the stash

GWH P-61 kits

1 1st issue kit(under construction)

1 2nd issue kit(courtesy GWH/Loinroar for review)

Multiples of most LSM conversion/detail sets

Multiples of most PE sets

Multiples of nearly all decal sheets for it.

Just curious, Terry, but what are your intentions for 46 1/48 P-61s? Are there that many different schemes available in decal form, even accounting for the F2T, F-15 and XP-61Es?

Not questioning your sanity (I have no room to talk there with somewhere in the neighborhood of 60 1/72 and 20+ 1/48 F4Us...), just wondering.

Joe

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Hi Joe,

Well providing that I live long enough, my plan is to build at one of each production block, Beginning with both XP-61s(XP-61 #2 is built)up to the F-15A Reporter. Add to that Other experimental aircraft, planned birds that were never built, one-offs and the rest as Whiffers.

I think I've got enough decal sheets to cover my planned builds(one can never have too many decal sheets, though!)

Cheers, Terry

(Certifiable P-61 NUT!)

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Hi Joe,

Well providing that I live long enough, my plan is to build at one of each production block, Beginning with both XP-61s(XP-61 #2 is built)up to the F-15A Reporter. Add to that Other experimental aircraft, planned birds that were never built, one-offs and the rest as Whiffers.

I think I've got enough decal sheets to cover my planned builds(one can never have too many decal sheets, though!)

Cheers, Terry

(Certifiable P-61 NUT!)

Cool. Good luck! I hope you get them done.

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Ok, here's what we have so far. :P

photobucket-2377-1335966003725.jpg

photobucket-3758-1335965923311.jpg

photobucket-5108-1335965981329.jpg

I was pretty surprised that the radome fit underneath with some clearance left. There is nearly a quarter of an inch gap on each side of the radome that I'll need to fill. The wing cuts were actually pretty easy since there was a panel line that went straight from front to back just outside of the engine nacelles.

John

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I like it! Which way are you going to fold the wings? Over the top and angle so they will lay relatively flat would help keep the weight of the model centered a bit more. I'll be watching this project with much interest. Keep us posted.

Cheers, Terry

(certifiable P-61 Nut!)

BTW, that's one "whiffer" for the '61 I hadn't thought of.

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Impressive is the first thing that comes to mind after seeing the WIP images. I am also curious to know how you are going to address the wing fold. Over the top as Terry is suggesting might be the easiest. I suspect trying to emulate the Grumman method of folding and rotating to fit along the booms would be a bit more challenging?

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Impressive is the first thing that comes to mind after seeing the WIP images. I am also curious to know how you are going to address the wing fold. Over the top as Terry is suggesting might be the easiest. I suspect trying to emulate the Grumman method of folding and rotating to fit along the booms would be a bit more challenging?

I had that thought to, but that would swing alot of weight behind the CG. Over the top and angle them ala S-2, IMHO would probably be the way to go. Shaping up to be a fun one(and inspiring.) to watch.

Cheers, Terry

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Thanks guys. The wings are going to just fold over the top. I did consider folding them back, but that would hide the radome a bit. I was thinking that I might have to put the radome on the top because of ground clearance, then I would have folded them back.

I was thinking about tacking on some wing tanks to extend the range on it. For a super long loiter time I wanted to use something bigger than the kit drop tanks. I have some 1/35 wing tanks from a blackhawk helicopter that I was thinking of shortening and using. They'd have to attach to the folded part of the wings. Would there be a problem with this?

John

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Thanks guys. I made a smidge more progress on it today. I wanted to build contra rotating turbo props so that I could get the most loiter time possible on the patrol area.

The nacelles are pvc pipe fittings that I got from Lowes and the silver cowlings are from a parted out B-17 (the p-61 cowlings wouldn't accept the pipe fittings).

photobucket-5030-1336075143617.jpg

I was going to use the extra props that come with the B-29 kit, but they would have cut into the nose of the aircraft. :P

photobucket-14248-1336075102355.jpg

So, I went with some b-17 props:

photobucket-490-1336075079492.jpg

I think I'm going to cut another half inch or an inch off the grey cones. they look too long at the moment.

John

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very interesting idea!!

if you want my opinion, I would cut off the kit nacelles, add the B-17 cowl right to the wing edge, and cut the gray cones and the PVC shorter. The entire engine arrangement should be(again just my opinion) about 1/2 the length it is now. Turbines need to be farther forward as they are light than Piston engines, but not that far( I think the props should be right around the forward edge of the PVC as it sits now). The other thing I would do is add the exhaust pipe on the outboard side of the nacelle...similar to how they are on the Turbo Commander:

002.jpg

Sean

Edited by martin_sam_2000

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very interesting idea!!

if you want my opinion, I would cut off the kit nacelles, add the B-17 cowl right to the wing edge, and cut the gray cones and the PVC shorter. The entire engine arrangement should be(again just my opinion) about 1/2 the length it is now. Turbines need to be farther forward as they are light than Piston engines, but not that far( I think the props should be right around the forward edge of the PVC as it sits now). The other thing I would do is add the exhaust pipe on the outboard side of the nacelle...similar to how they are on the Turbo Commander:

002.jpg

Sean

Thanks. I was thinking that the engines looked pretty strange, that's why I was going to shorten them. But I like your suggestions better. I'm gonna run with that. Also, I think I'm going to cut off the prop blades and afix them to the actual cones. Looks weird with them sticking out like that.

groovy, off for more surgery! LOL

John

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Shortened up the engines quite a bit. I removed the kit nacelles all the way back to the wings and cut about a half inch off of the grey engine cone. I attempted to place the prop blades onto the engine cones themselves, but I couldn't get them to line up right so I filled the holes and went back to the b-17 props.

photobucket-13436-1336140501508.jpg

photobucket-4913-1336140479337.jpg

How far back should I put the exhaust pipe? I was thinking either near the very back of the white pipe fitting or just aft of the silver cowling. Thoughts?

John

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Shortened up the engines quite a bit. I removed the kit nacelles all the way back to the wings and cut about a half inch off of the grey engine cone. I attempted to place the prop blades onto the engine cones themselves, but I couldn't get them to line up right so I filled the holes and went back to the b-17 props.

photobucket-13436-1336140501508.jpg

photobucket-4913-1336140479337.jpg

How far back should I put the exhaust pipe? I was thinking either near the very back of the white pipe fitting or just aft of the silver cowling. Thoughts?

John

I would bring the exhaust out just aft of the B-17 cowl ring. Also, you'll need to do something with the prop pitch on one of the props one each side to get the contra-rotation. Looking good.

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I would bring the exhaust out just aft of the B-17 cowl ring. Also, you'll need to do something with the prop pitch on one of the props one each side to get the contra-rotation. Looking good.

I agree...Just behind the B-17 engine cowl would be the best place. The early Turbo-props were quite long. other than prop pitch..it looks great!

sean

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Cool deal. I'll run a pipe out of there.

did a test fitting on the wings yesterday. I'm going to place some bracing inside, but I think they look good so far.

photobucket-10036-1336162448731.jpg

photobucket-18832-1336162373295.jpg

I tried the winds laying back like an e-2c, but didn't really like it.

As always, comments, criticism, even "that looks like crap!" hahaha are welcome. :P

John

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did a test fitting on the wings yesterday. I'm going to place some bracing inside, but I think they look good so far.

photobucket-10036-1336162448731.jpg

John

ever thought of doing a double folding wing like the seafire...it would keep the wingtips from hitting the top of the hangar deck on the carrier.

picture:

14.jpg

just add the double fold a little farther farther down on the win..maybe right inboard of the ailerons.

Sean

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If it was me, I would angle the wings ala S-2 Tracker so they would lay relatively flat. They way they are now, they would be too high to fit in the hangar deck. Just my $.02 worth.

Cheers, Terry

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That is so cool, thanks for sharing your in-progress shots. I agree with Terry, if you can, I'd fold the wings as on the S-2. I'm kind of curious about the canopy, is the cockpit to long to do a bubble canopy with a separate windscreen? Of course, if you don't have a vacuform machine the question;s kind of academic, unless you smash form it.

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He's using the stock canopies/cockpits. The entry is throught the nose gear well for the pilot and observer. The RO has his own entry hatch at the aft end of the crew nacelle. You did give me an idea for a variation on what he's doing.- - -An Air Force version, if you will.

Cheers, Terry

(Certifiable P-61 NUT!!)

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Alright, since you folks won't help out by raising the ceiling height of all of the carrier hangers, the engineers at Pasta Aero Industries have opted to place a rotation joint in the wing so that they will lay back like an E-2C. Gah, you folks are difficult. LOL

I was thinking of going ahead and attaching the wing drop tanks with the wings folded back, but I think that having them hanging like that will be problematic. soooo, would it be ok to leave on the pylons? Or would these get jarred around too much?

John

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