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1/32 Tamiya P-51D- Kicked up a notch


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Hi Chuck, neat work. Now, slap some paint around.... :woot.gif:

As an alternative, Radu Brinzan (RB Productions) includes similar etched parts in his replacement radiator grill set. ;)

See >> here <<

HTH

:cheers:

Thanks for the heads up Guy. Those look very good as well.

Before I continue with an update, please refer to my Edited Post # 173 above (at the end) where the mystery of the smaller resin sidewalls has been solved by Budman. Thanks Bud- and sorry to Roy Sutherland for doubting the quality of his fine product!

If you look at Post # 162 above, you will see that I painted the seats with gloss black lacquer, to give the seats a good primer coat for Alclad Dark Aluminum, followed by enamel paint, then weathering. I wanted a worn and chipped paint kind of look, which I usually do by dry brushing silver, but I wanted to try things a bit different this time to see how well it would work. I'll let you guys be the judge, although I think this method is a keeper!....

Seat6.jpg

Once the final coat of enamel paint has dried for a day, I used a small "mini-brush/ glue applicator" dipped in paint thinner, then I set about to "chip" the paint by rubbing some of the paint off. After experimented a bit (and re-doing a few screw-ups), I found that the best method is to have almost no thinner on the brush and then to rub the paint off, rather than try to just soak it off with the thinner which usually takes off too much paint and makes the finish a bit rough. I then dirtied up the seat slightly with ProModeler wash in Dark Dirt color, then sprayed some dullcoat to knock down the shine of the buckles. Here I moved the shoulder harness over a bit to reveal the weathered look of the seat.....

Seat11.jpg

Another angle.....

Seat7.jpg

The instructions ask you to place Part # D-53 on the back headrest of the seat, but Christian's instructions in Brett Green's book say that this part is only valid for very late P-51D's, so I added an Eduard PE piece and a Barracuda decal/stencil to the seat back instead. Of course I beat up the edges of the seat a bit, just 'cause....

Seat13.jpg

The angle brace for the side of the seats and the anchor for the seat belts should have a bolt showing, so I created some tiny ones with CA glue, then painted them silver......

Seat12.jpg

Seat10.jpg

With the seat done (man I'm glad there's only one this time! :P ), it's time to do the rest of the cockpit and sidewalls. The Eduard PE interior set has some fairly good looking stuff for the fuel tank behind the seat.....

Fueltank1.jpg

And there's even some nice Eduard detail for the Barracuda radio on the corners- sort of after-market to enhance aftermarket! Here I've also added some copper wire prior to painting, so that I can spray paint the electrical wires before bending them into place after assembly over the fuel tank....

Battery1.jpg

Now that I'm sold on my new weathering method, the rest of the cockpit gets the Krylon lacquer treatment as well......

Blacklacquer1.jpg

Followed by Alclad Dark Aluminum. I've chosen the darker aluminum color over regular Aluminum, Duraluminum or Silver and Chrome colors, because I think it looks more realistic as a base color when "chipped"....

Blacklacquer2.jpg

Thanks for your continued interest in this build. The more I review this kit, the more new ideas I think I'm going to try.

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Your new "worn" look is really accurate in replicating a surface that is worn rather than beat to h**l. I really like it and am gonna try it. Thanks for sharing Chuck...

You can do the same thing with salt before the enamel coat, but with this method I have ultimate control over where I wear the paint. For a seat, I know where it should or could get worn, so I like this method better. For the back and wings of an F-14 or F-4? Salt weathering all the way! :thumbsup:

Edited by chuck540z3
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Nice work!!!! I have also see folks do a similar technique as yours, but after the silver coat, they dab here and there rubber cement or liquid mask, then paint the part its final color, when all dry they rub off the mask and you have chipped paint. I hope to try this at some point.

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Wow Chuck, the seat is incredible :rolleyes: All of the research you do on your builds really sets them aside from other builds.... I noticed that you painted the copper wire and later you will bend them to shape... Won't the paint break or chip after you bent the wires?

/Jesse

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Wow Chuck, the seat is incredible :rolleyes: All of the research you do on your builds really sets them aside from other builds.... I noticed that you painted the copper wire and later you will bend them to shape... Won't the paint break or chip after you bent the wires?

/Jesse

Thanks. To be honest, I don't really know, but I did it anyway because I'm hoping the super thin coats of lacquer won't crack like thicker enamel or acrylic paint. I'll be sure to "fess up" if this doesn't work, but I might learn a new trick if it does. We'll see!

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Thank you Gentlemen!

Ever since I tried to attach spark plug wires to the coolant rail (who knew! :bandhead2: ) on the side of the engine, I've been dying to get back to it and do it right. Since I really screwed it up and I claim this build is "kicked up a notch", I've done a ton of work since. First off, the main reason I mixed up the coolant rail for an ignition rail, is because they sit parallel with each other and getting decent pics of the engine in all my books and the 'net hasn't been easy. Thankfully, Budman came to my rescue and not only sent me some engine pics, he sent me full engine service references for the Packard Merlin engine. NOW I know where everything goes! Thanks Bud! :thumbsup:

The first order of business was to strip off the old coolant rail and install a new one, since the old one became messed up with glue from the prior installation. Before installing it, however, I drilled a hole in the bottom of the rear fitting for a coolant pipe that feeds to the rear bottom of the engine. This was done on both sides with a silver plated copper wire....

Engine25.jpg

Next up was to install thin oil lines from the oil relief valve (I told you I learned stuff! :P ) on the side of the engine with copper wire, bending it around objects like the coolant rail, etc. like the several pics of the engine I now have. Once they are formed properly, I drilled holes into the engine where they should go, then carefully removed them for painting....

Engine26.jpg

One major thing missing from this engine is the CUNO oil filter (whatever "CUNO" means), which sits just aft of this oil valve and has a few major oil lines running out of it. I made one from scratch with scrap, as you shall soon see.

For the ignition rails, the pics I have of this engine show that there are two on each side that attach to the coolant rails near the exhausts and go into the left (port) "B Side" magneto, and two on the top of the engine along the valve covers that are near the intakes, that attach to the right (starboard) magneto on the "A Side". There are 12 spark plugs for the exhaust side and 12 plugs for the intake side, or 2 per cylinder. To make these rails, I wanted the plug wires to insert into them like the real deal, so I used 0.030" styrene rod for the ignition rails and thin copper wire for the plug wires, which were inserted into small holes I drilled into the rod, the glued, leaving a slight "knob" of glue at the base of the wire to sort of replicate the fastener on a real plug wire. The real deal has these plug wires coming straight out from the cylinders on tube-like fasteners, but with the exhausts on this kit installed later, there isn't room for this, so I made them to fit flush on the exhaust side.

One thing of note about the top intake ignition rails. In some pics of this engine I see that there is just one rail on the right side with 12 plug wires going to all the cylinders, so I assume this is a later adaptation of this feature. My pics, however, clearly show two of them, so that's the way I'm doing it.

Once everything was installed, I drilled holes for all the cylinders for the plug wires to fit into. The kit parts have circular depressions to show where the plug wires should go, so with a small drill you can get a nice hole on the outside exhaust, but for the top under the intakes, this proved to be very tricky in this tight dark space, so if you plan on doing this, make sure you drill these holes first before installing the intakes. With an hollow interior to the cylinder heads, you can use fairly long wires and then just slide them in. Here's everything put together and ready for painting....

Engine27.jpg

Now some results of several days of picky work!.....

Engine28.jpg

Note the new oil filter canister and oil lines behind the oil relief valve....

Engine32.jpg

There's a lot of scratch built plumbing lines all over the place including the rear of the engine, but there's also some very helpful Eduard PE linkages...

Engine29.jpg

The other side. This is where you can really see all the Eduard stuff at the back and some of my plumbing lines just forward of it.....

Engine35.jpg

Engine33.jpg

Some views from the top....

Engine30.jpg

Engine34.jpg

I still have several things I want to install on this engine, but I can now wait until I get it parked into the fuselage to see how room I really have before I start. Next up, the cockpit!

Thanks for checking in.

Edited by chuck540z3
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Really nice work Chuck. I particularly like the attention to the oil system and the linkages. I can see I need to get the Eduard engine set for the linkage help if nothing else. Really excited to see what you do with the cockpit!!

Bud

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Good Lord that thing is purty. Nice job Chuck I love the linkage it is very realistic. I'd like to see some one pull that off in 1/48th or even 1/72nd. Can you do all of us smaller scale guys a favor and post a pic of the Fuselage with some sort of reference in order to get an idea of how big this aircraft will be when finished. Can't wait to see more. I am looking into doing a 1/24th scale P-51 for my father any ideas on that scale or should I go 1/32nd instead. I would imagine after market for something in 1/24th would be impossible to find.

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Thanks Guys!

Here's a few more details about the engine that you may want to copy for a reference. Believe me, I know nothing about this engine, other than what I'm getting from Bud's pics and references, so here's what I did in a "monkey see, monkey do" sort of way...

Engine41.jpg

In the above pic, the top ignition rails for the intake plugs both go into the right side magneto, while the exhaust plug rails are wired into the left side magneto. I made an oil filter out of scrap which has a metallic colored cylinder cap with some bolts on top, because there are two major oil lines coming from the oil pump at the bottom of the oil pan into the filter at the bottom right hand side and another line coming out above it to the oil relief valve on the side. The injector tube at the rear comes out of an "accelerator pump and discharge nozzle" at the top and goes into a coupling at the bottom as shown. All plumbing was attached using drilled holes into the engine. Here's another angle of some of the other oil and coolant lines...

Engine42.jpg

And here's a better pic of the top ignition rails and how they are attached with a black coupler at the rear, before they go into the right side magneto. I used a tiny bit of CA glue at the base of each plug wire to form a "knob" coupler like the real deal, but at this big magnification it just looks like a messy glue job. Oh well, I can honestly say that you can't see this rough feature with the human eye at 6", so I suppose I shouldn't care. Obviously, however, it does!- so I may do some more work here later.

Engine45.jpg

The left side is less busy with that oil line coming from the other side at the front. These oil lines from both sides should go into a "dual drive unit" that is missing right under the prop spindle, but I didn't scratch build one out of fear of clearance issues once the engine is installed into the fuselage. Same thing for the large coolant lines that come from the bottom, which should be coming out of a coolant pump right behind the oil pump, so I just used one larger wire that wrapped around the bottom for both sides and plumbed it into the coolant rails at the rear. The Eduard linkages look great, but to tell you the truth they aren't very accurate and there is no way you can tell where to put them with the provided instructions. Good thing I had great pics to guide me!

Engine43.jpg

TIP # 4

Jesse asked me earlier about whether or not painting those small copper wires first then bending them later would result in chipped or cracked paint. Well, my experience using Krylon lacquer followed by Alclad proved to work very well and I had no issues with the paint coming off. I believe this was due to me doing most of the bending of the wires beforehand and the thin coats of lacquer paint, so there was no real build up of paint to crack. I also bent the painted wires before the lacquer had fully cured, so there was still some flexibility.

In order to bend these delicate painted wires, metal tweezers are a bit too rough, so I dipped a pair into liquid mask a few times and the remaining rubberized film proved to be just the ticket to cushion the painted wire as I bent it into shape without leaving a mark. Make sure the liquid mask if fully cured for a day or so and it won't come off the tweezers unless you really get rough with it. Now I have a permanent set of "cushioned tweezers" that are easily repaired with more liquid mask if required.

Engine36.jpg

Edited by chuck540z3
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Hmmm. Thanks for the painting tips once again Chuck... It sure beats trying to hand paint the wiring and plumbing after it is attached to it's vessel :bandhead2:

BTW the engine really looks better than I could have imagined it :rolleyes:

/Jesse

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One of the best things about your builds Chuck, is all the research you save us from having to do! THANKS man, some great stuff that is sure to immense help when I delve into mine.

*edit*: on Tip #4, you suppose you could get the same results with Elmers straight, or maybe thinned with water just a bit? I may give it a try as I don't have any of Mr. Masking, though I ought to add it to the shopping list huh?

Edited by blunce
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Thanks Guys!

Here's a few more details about the engine that you may want to copy for a reference. Believe me, I know nothing about this engine, other than what I'm getting from Bud's pics and references, so here's what I did in a "monkey see, monkey do" sort of way...

Engine41.jpg

In the above pic, the top ignition rails for the intake plugs both go into the right side magneto, while the exhaust plug rails are wired into the left side magneto. I made an oil filter out of scrap which has a metallic colored cylinder cap with some bolts on top, because there are two major oil lines coming from the oil pump at the bottom of the oil pan into the filter at the bottom right hand side and another line coming out above it to the oil relief valve on the side. The injector tube at the rear comes out of an "accelerator pump and discharge nozzle" at the top and goes into a coupling at the bottom as shown. All plumbing was attached using drilled holes into the engine. Here's another angle of some of the other oil and coolant lines...

Engine42.jpg

And here's a better pic of the top ignition rails and how they are attached with a black coupler at the rear, before they go into the right side magneto. I used a tiny bit of CA glue at the base of each plug wire to form a "knob" coupler like the real deal, but at this big magnification it just looks like a messy glue job. Oh well, I can honestly say that you can't see this rough feature with the human eye at 6", so I suppose I shouldn't care. Obviously, however, it does!- so I may do some more work here later. Sorry about the word "I gniton", but I was having trouble with the text software.....

Engine44.jpg

The left side is less busy with that oil line coming from the other side at the front. These oil lines from both sides should go into a "dual drive unit" that is missing right under the prop spindle, but I didn't scratch build one out of fear of clearance issues once the engine is installed into the fuselage. Same thing for the large coolant lines that come from the bottom, which should be coming out of a coolant pump right behind the oil pump, so I just used one larger wire that wrapped around the bottom for both sides and plumbed it into the coolant rails at the rear. The Eduard linkages look great, but to tell you the truth they aren't very accurate and there is no way you can tell where to put them with the provided instructions. Good thing I had great pics to guide me!

Engine43.jpg

TIP # 4

Jesse asked me earlier about whether or not painting those small copper wires first then bending them later would result in chipped or cracked paint. Well, my experience using Krylon lacquer followed by Alclad proved to work very well and I had no issues with the paint coming off. I believe this was due to me doing most of the bending of the wires beforehand and the thin coats of lacquer paint, so there was no real build up of paint to crack. I also bent the painted wires before the lacquer had fully cured, so there was still some flexibility.

In order to bend these delicate painted wires, metal tweezers are a bit too rough, so I dipped a pair into liquid mask a few times and the remaining rubberized film proved to be just the ticket to cushion the painted wire as I bent it into shape without leaving a mark. Make sure the liquid mask if fully cured for a day or so and it won't come off the tweezers unless you really get rough with it. Now I have a permanent set of "cushioned tweezers" that are easily repaired with more liquid mask if required.

Engine36.jpg

Great idea - Is this your preferred masking solution and if so could you elaborate?

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Great idea - Is this your preferred masking solution and if so could you elaborate?

I'm no expert on masking solutions, but I really like this one. It's easy to apply, it dries fairly quickly (use a hair dryer if you're in a hurry) and it's reasonably strong, hence its use on the tweezers. Here it is doing what it does best: Masking difficult areas.....

Frontfuselage1.jpg

I'll be going on vacation for a few weeks just like the rest of you, so I thought I'd throw some in-progress shots out there, even though nothing is completed in these new areas.

Since I had to paint the inside interior green, I thought I may as well paint the zinc chromate colored members of the front fuselage at the same time. Since I was doing that, I may as well paint the outside of the zinc painted framework as well, to ensure that the edges of each cross-member was painted yellow-green where it should and remain bare metal where it shouldn't. Before I show my work, I need to explain a little of my research into colors and where these areas should be painted. Right or wrong, this is what I did.

If you study pics of re-furbished P-51D's, which are the majority of them in color for obvious reasons, the colors and where stuff is painted is all over the map. For this reason I used mostly black and white photos of the assembly line in California and other WWII pics, which show that the interior (Interior Green) is a darker color than most of the other painted areas, which are presumably a lighter green or even yellow. Since the lighter areas were not a major difference from the interior as yellow would be, I stuck with Zinc Chromate Green, but the Model Master enamels I have for these two colors are almost identical in color. To "fix" this lack of contrast- and with the help of other color pics- I added quite a bit of Insignia Yellow to the Zinc Chromate Green to lighten it up, maybe 1/3 yellow to 2/3's green. The end result is almost identical to the Tamiya instructions in terms of painting pattern, with the exception of a cowling tab at the rear which I painted green instead of aluminum to match the rest of the rear firewall once it's installed. Now the results....

Frontfuselage2.jpg

Frontfuselage3.jpg

Remember all those pin marks on the inside I removed earlier? The only ones left will be buried after final assembly of the floor and engine/oil tank into the fuselage. That big "pin mark" in the middle is my first installed magnet for the engine cowling. There are also a few Eduard PE bits added, but you can't see them very well in these pics.....

Frontfuselage4.jpg

Now the results of that liquid mask earlier. You might ask yourself, "Why did he mask off areas that will be painted later anyway?" The reason is that the rivet detail is VERY subtle and I don't want to bury it under multiple coats of unnecessary paint. It may be overkill, but I'd rather be safe than sorry. Also, remember to remove that little vent just in front of the wing where you can see some sanding. The instructions tell you to cut it off on Page 13, but it's easily missed....

Frontfuselage5.jpg

Speaking of pin marks, the engine cowlings are FULL of them!.....

Engineshroud1.jpg

Since I plan on detailing the inside of the cowlings as much as the outside, they all have to go. This should be fun to sand.... <_<

Engineshroud2.jpg

Although the Barracuda resin comes with some neat brass PE, I find that I'm still using quite a few Eduard PE bits, like on this fuel tank behind the seat- and there's a LOT more to come!

CockpitFlr3.jpg

Although it's along way from being fully detailed and weathered, here's why I used some of that wood decal film found with the seat belt kit on the floor. After application underneath and a coat of flat black enamel, I just rubbed off some of the paint with a tiny glue applicator brush with a bit of solvent. The wear pattern more or less matches a few pics I have of this area of the real deal during WWII, then I just messed up the rest of the floor with a bit more solvent to cause a random staining. Once I finish weathering the cockpit and hit this with dull coat, that copper-like shine to the wood floor will get knocked down to a more woody look. Also note some more Eduard PE bits on the floor....

CockpitFlr1.jpg

As good as some of the Eduard brass is, all Barracuda brass that is a duplicate is usually much better. For example, whereas there is a general pattern to the Eduard brass foot pedals, you can actually read the lettering of the Barracuda pedals. Using my "new weathering method" for paint chipping explained earlier, all I did was to remove some of the green paint by rubbing, just like the real deal, to reveal the hidden details.....

CockpitFlr2.jpg

That's all for now boys, assuming anybody is even looking at modeling forums these days! :P

Edited by chuck540z3
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hey Chuck that cockpit looks very good, nice work mate, I would rekomemd changing the floor delimitaion, the black paint limits at the control stick position,the pit were the control stick is the wing top and was yellow chromate, what you painted interior green is actually a canvas cover and was in dark olive green, the floor under the fueltank is made of fibre or something I cant remenber, also balsa wood was used to avoid shaking of the tank, take a look at this pics, the model cockpit is from jerry rutman and is very accurated on its colors, hope it helps, keep this amazing build mate :rolleyes: , cheers

antonio

p51b, similar floor like D model

bfloor-1.jpg

001-55.jpg

Roy Shutherland cockpit

barracudacals32010reviewrk_1.jpg

Edited by Antonio Argudo
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hey Chuck that cockpit looks very good, nice work mate, I would rekomemd changing the floor delimitaion, the black paint limits at the control stick position,the pit were the control stick is the wing top and was yellow chromate, what you painted interior green is actually a canvas cover and was in dark olive green, the floor under the fueltank is made of fibre or something I cant remenber, also balsa wood was used to avoid shaking of the tank, take a look at this pics, the model cockpit is from jerry rutman and is very accurated on its colors, hope it helps, keep this amazing build mate :

antonio

Thank you Sir! I was going to paint the area under the seat, "Olive Drab", as per the instructions below when I paint the control stick, etc., but that black demarcation line on the floor is quite different than what Tamiya calls for. Thankfully at this early stage, it's an easy fix.

P-51DInstructions1.jpg

As for the color of the floor under the tank, does anybody have a pic for reference?

Thanks guys!

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never trust 100% the kit instructions :D you should join the p51 SIG forum, plenty of reference and information there, you will find pictures of the tank fuel floor, cheers mate

http://p51sig.com/index.php

Thanks Antonio,

I really should, but I've had nothing but difficulty in trying to do so in the past, so I gave up. I tried again today, but you can't just "register" like other forums. The website suggests that you send them an email, but they don't give an email address anywhere in order to do so. What am I doing wrong?

This website reminds me of the Lancaster Archive Forum, where past sins of other members has made them clamp down on who can participate, making registration awkward and difficult. In doing so, participation in the forum goes down significantly, killing all the fun of the forum.

Back to modeling. I've fixed the painting errors which turned out to be a very positive thing to do. That big oval on top of the tank, I've found, is usually painted interior green, so now it contrasts very nicely with the rest of the black tank, with some nice Eduard PE to really make it "pop" now. Thanks to your heads up concerning the cockpit and tank details, I'll be going in a very different- and more accurate- direction with respect to weathering and other detailing like new plumbing. If anybody has any other suggestions, bring them on! ^_^

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Hey chuck

Dont waste you time sanding those pin marks in your cowl

take the wifes nail polish remover and some Q-Tips(Real ones) and rub the putty smooth

Cheers

Neo

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