Joe Hegedus Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 OK, guys, I hope someone out there can help me with this one. What's the specific term used to describe a situation where one recognizes that things are going wrong, but one does not act to correct the situation (hoping that it will improve) until it is too far deteriorated to be corrected? An example might be a situation where a line handler for a hot-air ballon is holding one of the guy ropes, and suddenly is lifted off the ground - he doesn't let go because he expects (hopes) that the other line handlers will pull the ballon back down, but they don't before he's too high to safely let go... Serious question, so I'd appreciate serious answers please. Thanks, Joe Quote Link to post Share on other sites
PlasticWeapons Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 (edited) Catch-22? Clusterfu**? Too little, too late? Edited July 12, 2012 by PlasticWeapons Quote Link to post Share on other sites
martin_sam_2000 Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 the one that comes to my mind is "the elephant in the room" but its not quite what your looking for I think. This is going to bother me know till I figure this out... Sean Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Aaronw Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 Try searching for Swiss Cheese Model, I'm pretty sure you can find the term in there. The Swiss Cheese model is the concept that there are lots of near misses but an accident only occurs when all the holes (in the swiss cheese) line up. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
rightwinger26 Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 In the Navy it's called a gagglef**k. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Edgar Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 Letting things slide. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rex Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 a "Lassi Fare" attitude?,,,,,,I know I spelled it wrong,,,,,,I can't spell French Laize Fair? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Browning Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 "Too little, too late."? By the time you decide to take action, it's past the point of recovery and any effort/effect you can bring to bear on the situation is horribly underpowered. To "hope against hope" is to force yourself to believe something good will come out of a bad situation, even though you know the odds are ridiculously low. "Wilful denial" is where you KNOW that something bad will very likely happen, but for whatever reason you force yourself to ignore that fact and proceed to do something every fiber of your being is telling you not to do. However you phrase it, your balloon buddy is on deck for a Darwin award..... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KursadA Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 This is probably not exactly what you're looking for; but I have seen the psychology term "optimism bias" in engineering project management books to describe a generally similar human condition where individuals underestimate the actual chance of a negative outcome even when they recognize how bad the situation is. Wikipedia gives the following definition. The optimism bias (also known as unrealistic or comparative optimism) is a self-serving[dubious – discuss] bias that causes a person to believe that they are less at risk of experiencing a negative event compared to others Going back to your example, it looks like it could describe the mindset of the line handler; since you say that he hopes that the situation will correct itself or will be corrected by external forces(other line handlers, etc.) OK, guys, I hope someone out there can help me with this one. What's the specific term used to describe a situation where one recognizes that things are going wrong, but one does not act to correct the situation (hoping that it will improve) until it is too far deteriorated to be corrected? An example might be a situation where a line handler for a hot-air ballon is holding one of the guy ropes, and suddenly is lifted off the ground - he doesn't let go because he expects (hopes) that the other line handlers will pull the ballon back down, but they don't before he's too high to safely let go... Serious question, so I'd appreciate serious answers please. Thanks, Joe Quote Link to post Share on other sites
-Neu- Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 (edited) OK, guys, I hope someone out there can help me with this one. What's the specific term used to describe a situation where one recognizes that things are going wrong, but one does not act to correct the situation (hoping that it will improve) until it is too far deteriorated to be corrected? An example might be a situation where a line handler for a hot-air ballon is holding one of the guy ropes, and suddenly is lifted off the ground - he doesn't let go because he expects (hopes) that the other line handlers will pull the ballon back down, but they don't before he's too high to safely let go... Serious question, so I'd appreciate serious answers please. Thanks, Joe "Digging yourself deeper into a hole" (or some variant thereof) Edited July 12, 2012 by -Neu- Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rex Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 knowing that a train wreck is about to happen, but unable to move to give warning also,,,,,,caught like a deer in the headlights? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SOGman Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 Government Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 exceeded the correctable threadshold. OR passed the point of pucker! Bill Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Joe Hegedus Posted July 12, 2012 Author Share Posted July 12, 2012 This is probably not exactly what you're looking for; but I have seen the psychology term "optimism bias" in engineering project management books to describe a generally similar human condition where individuals underestimate the actual chance of a negative outcome even when they recognize how bad the situation is. Wikipedia gives the following definition. Going back to your example, it looks like it could describe the mindset of the line handler; since you say that he hopes that the situation will correct itself or will be corrected by external forces(other line handlers, etc.) Thanks, Kursad, that might be what I'm looking for. I shall go from there and see what else I can find. Aaron, I'll also look under the swiss cheese model. Thanks! Joe Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Horrido Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 Wishful thinking? Negligence? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fishwelding Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 It depends what you're asking. "Indecisive" could work, if you are only suggesting that generally, someone hesitates out of wishful thinking. "Yes, my "Check Engine" light is on, but hey, I've driven many miles with that before, so I'll just squeeze a few more weeks out of it before taking it into the shop." If specifically, one's wishful thinking is in the belief that someone else will correct or prevent an impending or growing problem, that may require something more specific. Kursad, does "Optimism Bias" specifically refer to a failure of any team member to come forward and delay or stop a project, even when each could do so, because they collectively rely on each other to catch or report a problem? As in "I had grave doubts about the plan of attack, but I just figured some other staff officer would speak up with doubts, too. Otherwise, if the entire staff seemed to agree that the plan was good, then my doubts must be unfounded. After all, they can't all be wrong, and I'm the only one sensible, right?" Quote Link to post Share on other sites
KursadA Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 (edited) Kursad, does "Optimism Bias" specifically refer to a failure of any team member to come forward and delay or stop a project, even when each could do so, because they collectively rely on each other to catch or report a problem? As in "I had grave doubts about the plan of attack, but I just figured some other staff officer would speak up with doubts, too. Judging by the usage that I encountered; it doesn't seem to imply anything on lack of initiative from the individual. It rather seems to describe the feeling "This project seems to be going badly; but I have a feeling we will not fail. Either someone will intervene, or the team will get its act together and pull it off somehow". At least this is my understanding of it. Edited July 12, 2012 by KursadA Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TaiidanTomcat Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 Kafkaesque? Comes from the author Franz Kafka, and refers to the style with which he wrote his books (which in his dying wish asked for to be burned). Basically it describes a nightmarish situation which most people can somehow relate to, although strongly surreal. With an ethereal, "evil", omnipotent power floating just beyond the senses. Probably not it. Maybe "negligent" or "dereliction of duty?" "Moral Cowardice?" Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Horrido Posted July 12, 2012 Share Posted July 12, 2012 What Kursad describes seems to fit in well with what the psychs refer to as "magical thinking", in that no action is taken to correct an impending or growing problem because somehow it will take care of itself and/or go away. Joe, are you looking for a term that you've heard, and since forgotten, or just looking for a word or phrase to describe a situation you've encountered? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dmk0210 Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 (edited) Judging by the usage that I encountered; it doesn't seem to imply anything on lack of initiative from the individual. It rather seems to describe the feeling "This project seems to be going badly; but I have a feeling we will not fail. Either someone will intervene, or the team will get its act together and pull it off somehow". At least this is my understanding of it. Another aspect of this is when one (or many ones) have so much time and/or money invested that they can't believe or allow for it to all go to waste. Sometimes members of a team can positively reinforce each other as well, to the point where they are deceiving each other into believing that the project is successful, when in fact it is a failure. They will actually believe that major problems are just minor and that those outside the team are not seeing clearly. I believe some examples of this can be seen in the military leaders of the axis powers during WWII. Edited July 13, 2012 by dmk0210 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Joe Hegedus Posted July 13, 2012 Author Share Posted July 13, 2012 What Kursad describes seems to fit in well with what the psychs refer to as "magical thinking", in that no action is taken to correct an impending or growing problem because somehow it will take care of itself and/or go away. Joe, are you looking for a term that you've heard, and since forgotten, or just looking for a word or phrase to describe a situation you've encountered? More the latter, but not in regard to a specific incident. The question came up relating to flight termination systems and when a UAV flight going awry should be ended. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fishwelding Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 (edited) Another aspect of this is when one (or many ones) have so much time and/or money invested that they can't believe or allow for it to all go to waste. That's a favorite of mine. A related idea is "path dependence," or the limitations or pressures imposed on a decision by previous decisions. We poured lots of tons of concrete over lots of tons of rebar to make what was, then, considered a cutting edge piece of infrastructure. Now, we're hell-bent on finding a way to keep that capital relevant. This can be somewhat tempered by "depreciation," or a systemic accounting of the diminishing value of investment, due to age or obsolescence. It makes it easier to throw stuff out, although it's unscientific and subject to dispute. Consider, for example, building a new nuclear-powered aircraft carrier. "Do you wish to pour an obscene amount of tax money into another one, when current technology developments might point to the obsolescence of such a beast in as little as twelve, fifteen, twenty, or twenty-five years? Then again, people have been predicting the obsolescence of aircraft carriers since just after World War II." Another, related term in this thread, generally: "Group Think." Via Wikipedia: "It is the mode of thinking that happens when the desire for harmony in a decision-making group overrides a realistic appraisal of alternatives." An example: "Everyone at Acme Plastic Model Company publicly agreed that a 1/16th scale plastic kit of the SB2C was a good investment, sure to sell big. But we all had big doubts. It's just that no one wanted to be the "gloomy gus" over the whole thing." Edited July 13, 2012 by Fishwelding Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MikeC Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 (edited) "Being in denial" or "Head in the Sand" seems to cover it. Or how about blind optimism? Summed up in the theatrical phrase "It'll be alright on the night". Edited July 13, 2012 by MikeC Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GreyGhost Posted July 13, 2012 Share Posted July 13, 2012 Procrastination ... I would have typed this earlier but well ... -Gregg Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jinxter13 Posted July 14, 2012 Share Posted July 14, 2012 Procrastination ... I would have typed this earlier but well ... -Gregg Dang he did it to me again.....I've just sent Joe a PM and then I see this.....Hey Gregg ol' buddy, ol' pal, ol friend of mine (a great one too) will ya give me a chance...Well if I'd seen it earlier ya wouldn't have beat me...so my delay done it to me this time B) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.