Monogram 1/72 Space Shuttle Discovery *mark II window assembly*

[DutyCat]

To help. I will say careful painting the AFRSI you add. The surgical tape curls up like bacon as the paint dries. Any tips guys on fixing this problem?

I think I have a solution for the thermal blankets. It is super top secret squirrel for right now, as I don't want to look like an idiot if it does not work. I just poured the bottom half of my latest attempt (3rd and last) at the beany cap mold. I will start working on my thermal blanket solution tomorrow. I will post progress in the Shuttle Wars video series on the dutycat blog.

Edited February 23, 2013 by DutyCat

[vehicle]

Here is a photo of Discovery to help you with your model. http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/17jskayalhdwwjpg/original.jpg http://www.nasa.gov/centers/dryden/images/content/638768main_EC05-0166-37.jpg

[Hotdog]

DAYS 1-7

25 hours

Build cost to date: $219.13

I have decided to take time off from my Tamiya shuttle build and go ahead and fully finish the 1/72 cockpit here. I'll get back to the Tamiya shuttle once the cockpit is done, I promise. I'm going all-out to detail this part of the shuttle as much as possible (within reason). I'm treating this as a sort of build-within-a-build. I am taking my time to make it as accurate as I can and scratching in a lot of the details.

Here is a dry fit showing some of the little bits I've made out of Milliput dropped into place. You can also see the sidewalls I made out of styrene that go directly next to the seats, and the widened and squared up aft control panel to correct the inaccurate shape of the kit. This is my first time working with Milliput and I love it. I think i'm going to find it very useful in adding and fixing a lot of details! Missing from this photo is the joystick that goes on the aft control panel. It's done and will be in the finished piece.

Here's a dry fit showing the seats and heads-up displays. Pay no attention to the Milliput headrests, they haven't been sanded down to the correct size and shape yet. I will finish them later. The HUD's turned out way too big in my opinion and I spent a lot of time making them, without noticing they were out-of-scale until I took the above photo. I'm not looking forward to having to make a new set!! I have also sanded off all of the raised panel lines on the control panels in preparation for the decals, and you can't really see it here but I have also scratched in the "dashboard" awning over the front control panel.

Can ya guess what these are supposed to be?

Look here.

They are the storage bags that hang on the walls in the aft area of the flight deck. The port side has bags 1-3 while the starboard gets 4-7. So I'll be sticking these to the inside of the crew compartment area of the fuselage halves.

Speaking of fuselage halves, I have already masked and sprayed the interior of the nose sections silver for shielding the light of the LEDs when I light the cockpit. Using lessons learned from the Tamiya shuttle build :coolio:/>

I took crowe-t's advice and contacted Realspace about returning the resin SSME's. Glenn was really nice and said he would refund my money and send me a new set when he makes a new mold. Meanwhile, I ordered a set of the Fisher engines. So, I'm hoping to receive those, my astronauts and the window kit this week. Exciting stuff!

I have also started on a set of 1/72 decals that will cover most of the cockpit area, not just the controls. With all that I've learned about photo decal making lately,the finished decals I have made for the cockpit so far are ridiculous in detail and quality. Can't wait to get to that stage of the build and see how they turn out.

[niart17]

Man, this is coming along nicely! Nice catch on the storage bags. Can't wait to see the decals added, it's going to look great!

A question and/or suggestion if you don't mind. Are you going to put the cockpit in before you join the fuse halves together or after? Reason I ask, is I found that if you slide the cockpit in after the fuse is assembled and the storage bags are added to the fuse halves, it becomes difficult to get the cockpit in without damaging the bags; they get in the way. I added a simple brace between the cockpit bulkheads and mounted them to the cockpit assembly so it can slide in with the cockpit. You can just make it out here in this shot

Just a suggestion. If you're putting the cockpit in first then I rudely interupted your thread for nothing...sorry :bandhead2:/>

Keep up the great work and keep the great pics coming!

Bill

[Hotdog]

No it's good to get input from those who have gone before me with the same ideas and have useful knowledge to share.

My plan was to glue the bags onto the inside walls of the fuselage halves first, then slide the cockpit/bulkhead assembly in later after the halves have been glued together. So you're saying the pit won't fit if the bags are already in place when I slide it in? What if I skip the step of gluing the pit to the bulkhead first, that way I can glue the pit to the inside of the fuselage first (saving gluing on the bulkhead for the last step)?

I'll save gluing the bags on until the rest of the pit is completed, then I can do some dry fitting and see which way would be best before gluing anything down.

[niart17]

...So you're saying the pit won't fit if the bags are already in place when I slide it in? ...

I guess it depends on a few things. On mine, the added bulkheads behind the pilot and co-pilot's chairs stuck up too high to get past the bags mounted on the fuse sides. If your bulkheads aren't as tall or wide, then maybe it will fit. Like you said, dry fit them and see what clearances you have to work with. As for when to put the cockpit, I personally prefer to put it in after the fuse is joined up and seams are sanded. That allows you to access from inside and outside to make sure the alignment is good plus it saves any problems getting the cockpit to sit level. But that's a personal preference.

Bill

[Hotdog]

It looks like the bulkheads behind the chairs on mine turned out very similar to yours. So it's likely I would encounter the same problem. I'll be mindful of this as I proceed. Thanks Bill.

[Brian 1]

Whats going on fellas!? Some good building going on here! Honestly, I dont care if you buy the Fisher nozzles, but you should really return those others and just work with the kit parts if thats what your budget allows...thats some rough stuff you got for the wait and the money spent. Cockpit is looking good! Look forward to seeing more.

[crowe-t]

The Fisher nozzles are the way to go and I can't wait to see a set installed on an orbiter.

I just wish Fisher would consider making a 1/144 scale set of SSME's. I'm sure there are a lot of us who would buy them, I know I would.

Mike.

[Hotdog]

Thanks Mike. I will probably just install the SSME's and OMS from the Fisher set, and save the RCS thrusters that come with them for a future build since I'm going the decal route again and not attempting to scratch in tiles or thermal blankets. Those thrusters have a hefty amount of blanket and tile detail scribed into them that might stick out too much on a flat, decaled orbiter. That's the apprehension I have about it, anyway.

Edited February 26, 2013 by Hotdog

[Brian 1]

The Fisher blanket and tile detail is extremely petite and would lend itself well to being complimented with decals. Hear ya Mike, but it is outta my control.

[umtutsut]

I will be using the new 1/72 shuttle window replacement set from Accurate Model Parts. The AMP window kit features the front, aft and payload bay windows, each with three layers of glass (clear plastic) like on the real shuttle.

Maybe I'm just dense...but I don't see those listed on the AMP site. All I see is submarine stuff. Are they still available?

Les (The Voice of Authority)

[Hotdog]

Maybe I'm just dense...but I don't see those listed on the AMP site. All I see is submarine stuff. Are they still available?

Les (The Voice of Authority)

They just finished them. They're so new, they're not even on their site yet. Stay tuned!

[Hotdog]

I received the sets of 1/72 shuttle windows today from Accurate Model Parts. The above photo shows all of the parts that came with it. In the photo it's hard to see the clear windows, but they're there. You get two layers of "glass" for the front and top windows, and one layer for the payload bay windows. All of the parts are cut very nicely, and they even give you the thin sheet of styrene the frames are die-cut out of. I'm assuming this is to use as a mask or to help fit the windows into the fuselage? I'm not sure of the entire assembly process yet, as I have not gotten the final version of the instructions. But from what I can tell, the parts for the front windows will have to be bent somehow to fit into the opening in the fuselage.

So this should be a fun experiment! This will be my first time testing a new product like this. I hope my skills will be good enough to do it justice. They were nice enough to send me a spare set in case I mess up the first one!

[crowe-t]

Those windows look very nice! I can't wait to see them installed.

When you get your Fisher SSME's please post some pictures and let us know what you think of them.

Your shuttle is becoming the test-vehicle for all these new parts.

Mike.

[spaceman]

Wow, these AMP windows set is the madness. :woot.gif: That might become certainly a tricky installation, I wonder what that will look like.

Make nice close-up pics that we can see all the details well.

[Hotdog]

Today I received the set of Fisher engine nozzles and RCS pods. They are wonderful! Very little flash or rough spots to be sanded. And very solid, almost like styrene, compared to the seemingly brittle and flaky Realspace kit.

The OMS engines are just a tad on the stumpy side and need to be elongated a little more, but they will suffice.

Love that detail inside the engine nozzles.

Lookie there, they even got the insulation detail around the outer ring. No scribing needed here!

On these RCS pods, the thermal blanket detail seems out-of-scale and is a bit overkill in my opinion. I will probably sand this off, if I decide to use these parts at all. I may just stick with the Monogram kit and save these for a future build. It would be nice if Fisher made these parts optional for those of us who just want the engine nozzles.

I'm still waiting on delivery of my astronaut-pilot figures. This is a story in itself that will have to wait for another time.

I have a big update coming SOON to bring ya'll up to speed on my last several days of model building, so stay tuned. Lots of progress on the flight deck, and I have started on the AMP windows.

[crowe-t]

The SSME's look like the real thing! The OMS engine nozzles look fine, I don't think anyone with criticize those.

You're right about the RCS pods detail looking a bit out of scale. It's not bad but could be toned down a bit, otherwise the shape and thrusters look perfect.

Can you post a picture of one of the Fisher SSME's next to the Monogram SSME?

Mike.

[niart17]

Very nice. They are definately miles ahead of Realspace's. I do however agree that it might be a good idea for them to sell the SSMEs by themselves. The RCS pods are nice, but a lot of people are fine with what's there on the kits and would rather pay 1/2 to 2/3 the cost for just the nozzles. Perhaps in the future they'll reconsider that. Can't wait to see paint on these things, should look great!

Bill

Now get on to those windows!!!

Edited March 8, 2013 by niart17

[crowe-t]

I agree, Fisher should offer the option of just purchasing the nozzles.

Hotdog, the more I look at these pictures you posted the more I'm liking the Fisher set. I thought the rear walls of the SSME's looked a bit thick but they actually don't look that way in your pictures. When I build a 1/72 shuttle I'll pick up a set. They are beautiful.

Mike.

Edited March 8, 2013 by crowe-t

[Hotdog]

Mike,

Here is a comparison of the Monogram SSME and the Fisher SSME.

* * *

Yesterday I finally received the 1/72 pilot figures from JP Productions that I had planned to turn into astronauts for my shuttle (more on that in a minute). As you can see from the photo, they're not any bigger than the 1/72 Monogram SR-71 pilot figures. This is disappointing, as they looked like they might be larger in the photo.

So now I have three options:

1. Stick with the SR-71 pilots (which look too small when seated in the cockpit)

2. Attempt to modify the standing Apollo figures that came with the kit

3. Try to get my hands on the seated Airfix Astronauts and modify them the way Jay did.

What to do?

So here's the backstory. It took 28 days to get the figures from 1001 Model Kits. I had tried to contact them about the delay but got no response other than an automatic response saying "your order will be shipped soon". So, thinking my order was never going to be fulfilled, I found another overseas supplier that carried the same JP pilot figures. However, this supplier required a total order of $50 or more in order to ship to the US. So, I had to buy two sets of the JP pilot figues and an Airfix 1/144 Saturn 1B to get over the $50 hump. This was Tuesday. Then the original order of pilot figures arrive Friday and now it's too late to cancel the order from the second supplier. Doh! Oh well, I guess I will have 6 future astronauts waiting on a shuttle, and a Saturn kit to add to my stash.

[crowe-t]

If you can find the astronauts that Jay used for a good price then that will work, otherwise you can modify the astronauts that came with the kit. They may not be 100% but once the cockpit is installed you won't see too much through the small windows. I'm sure it'll look OK when it's all together.

BTW, thanks for posting the picture of the Monogram and Fisher SSME together. They look about the same size. I assume the diameter of the openings are about the same???

For my 1/144 Airfix stack build I was considering using the kit's SSME's but they are a bit on the small side so I'll stick with the Real Space resin SSME's unless I find a set of Cutting Edge nozzles to use, which are nicer.

Edited March 10, 2013 by crowe-t

[Hotdog]

DAYS 8-18

19.4 hours (44.4 hours)

Build cost to date: $259.47

Lots of work going on over the last couple of weeks. I've finally reached a milestone worth stopping and giving you guys a look at what I've done with the cockpit and the windows. I'll start with the windows.

Here are the painted pieces, laid out and ready to be glued together. I had to bend them into shape to match the curve of the fuselage. I used the existing Monogram window clear window parts as a guide and gently bent them using the straight edge of the desktop of my work area. You don't have to bend them perfectly into shape at this stage, just get them in the ballpark. You want to do the bending first, BEFORE you paint!

The next step is the gluing. First you want to tape each clear window piece behind the frame or mullion it attaches to with masking tape and glue them together. After that dries (overnight), you remove the tape and tape the two assemblies to each other and glue them together to complete the set.

The final gluing step is the tricky part where you have to be careful. First you have to use the Monogram window piece here to make sure you get the shape correct while you are gluing, while being sure not to glue the Monogram piece to the AMP windows! You also must be sure not to use too much of your trusty Elmer's white glue to where it seeps between any gaps between the frame pieces. This happened on both assemblies, as you can see on the two front windows in the photo below.

And here they are side by side. The glue is more noticible on the port side window. What do you guys think? Does this glue issue warrant ripping these things apart, sanding, repainting and reassembling? It's a lot more work than it looks.

So the next step will be making the windows fit into the fuselage. This next picture will show you what I mean by that.

I will need to cut out pieces of thick .60 styrene, using the die cut pattern provided with the AMP window kit. The windows will be masked, glued and puttied into the holes in the styrene and then I will have to cut the fuselage to make the assemblies fit into the nose of the fuselage. I will then have to putty and sand that to shape. It's alotta work, but I hope I can pull it off and come out with a very accurate looking set of eyeballs for this orbiter.

And now, back to the cockpit...

Here is the fire extinguisher I scratch-built that goes on the starboard bulkhead next to the pilot. Because of its' micro-scale, this little bastard was a lot more difficult to make than it looks! I used a .30mm styrene rod and milliput to make the extinguisher, some thin styrene sheet for the bracket it fits onto, and aluminum foil for the strap. I tried to use some very thin styrene strip for the strap, but I couldn't get it to bend correctly, and it was getting messy trying to get the white Elmer's glue to bond to the paint. So the foil was a much easier solution.

Here is a picture showing the fire extinguisher dry-fitted to the bulkhead.

So when I dry-fitted the cockpit into one of the fuselage halves, it seemed to fit fine. But I just-so-happened to tape the halves together and do a dry fit, only to find out the bulkheads I had scratch-built were too big. I had to do quite a bit of sanding to get them to a useable shape. This took 2 or 3 hours of sanding, test fitting, and more sanding to get right. I then noticed gaps between the front sides of the cockpit and the windows.

In this picture, you can see my solution for the gaps. I added some milliput to the sides of the cockpit. Once the milliput was dry, it took a couple more hours of sanding, test fitting, and more sanding to get right.

Here is the cockpit so far, painted and ready for decals. You can see the new HUD's dry-fitted onto the dash. They're still maybe 1mm too large, but I think they're close enough. I'll touch up the paint a bit and start laying the decals down tomorrow.

[crowe-t]

Everything looks very good so far! I like the fire extinguisher.

In the pictures the glue isn't too noticeable but not sure how it shows in person. If it isn't too noticeable then just leave them as they are.

[Hotdog]

Thanks Mike! It's not very noticeable. Only when the light hits a certain way do you see it. And it's only the two front windows. After what happened to the Tamiya shuttle windows, I'm ready to let this one slide and not dig myself deeper into a hole trying to be a perfectionist. I do have a second set of the AMP windows, so I think I will assemble those and see if they turn out any better.