johnbuck Posted April 15, 2013 Author Share Posted April 15, 2013 (edited) Thanks Guys, Really appreciate the encouragement. Re the rivets Manfred : if you go back to page 1 of this build and post 19th March in reply to Pete have explained the method there, but just re-reading it it is not terribly clear. I should have added that you 'pin-prick' first into the sheet leaving plenty of border around; then cut out the rivet strip to the dimensions needed. If you attempt it on a sized strip first it buckles/spreads eveyrwhere. Am using 5000 here in the pic but it still works on 10 & 20 thou. Hope this clarifies things My fingers remain crossed for your mods. Cheers John Edited April 15, 2013 by johnbuck Quote Link to post Share on other sites
j-love Posted April 17, 2013 Share Posted April 17, 2013 (edited) I had mentioned the PA-1 test article earlier ... found a really nice picture of it displayed at the X-prize Cup back in 2006. See here and here. Edited April 17, 2013 by j-love Quote Link to post Share on other sites
crackerjazz Posted April 17, 2013 Share Posted April 17, 2013 (edited) Great cutaway shot! It's apparent that over the stiffeners are flat solid panels over which the crumpled micrometeoroid shielding would be applied? If that's the case, are there any standoffs in between or would the outer skin have been just taped onto the solid panels? Edited April 17, 2013 by crackerjazz Quote Link to post Share on other sites
johnbuck Posted April 18, 2013 Author Share Posted April 18, 2013 (edited) Thanks for posting these pics j-jove. Very useful detailing shots; have not seen these before. crackerjazz: if you go back on to the heroics link for LT4 I gave http://heroicrelics....structural.html basically there are very few 'solid' panels . The insulation blankets are fixed onto a wrap- around frame. Micrometeriod shielding 10/20/30 thou thick is then attached on standoffs where necessary, hence the 'crumpled' look in all the pics. Very difficult to rivet tension such thin material. The cabin walls themselves were only 10 thou thick ! Hope this helps. Cheers John Edited April 18, 2013 by johnbuck Quote Link to post Share on other sites
spaceman Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 Thanks Guys, Really appreciate the encouragement. Re the rivets Manfred : if you go back to page 1 of this build and post 19th March in reply to Pete have explained the method there, but just re-reading it it is not terribly clear. I should have added that you 'pin-prick' first into the sheet leaving plenty of border around; then cut out the rivet strip to the dimensions needed. If you attempt it on a sized strip first it buckles/spreads eveyrwhere. Am using 5000 here in the pic but it still works on 10 & 20 thou. Hope this clarifies things My fingers remain crossed for your mods. Cheers John Hi John, that's almost unbelievable, have you made these lots of rivets one by one? Have you thought about using a riveter tool? BTW, thanks for your fingers crossed for my SRB hole mods. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
davegee1 Posted May 2, 2013 Share Posted May 2, 2013 Hi John, that's almost unbelievable, have you made these lots of rivets one by one? :woot.gif:/> Have you thought about using a riveter tool? :coolio:/> BTW, thanks for your fingers crossed for my SRB hole mods. :worship:/> :wave:/> Outstanding work there, John!!! Very impressive!!! davegee Quote Link to post Share on other sites
johnbuck Posted May 6, 2013 Author Share Posted May 6, 2013 (edited) Hi Folks Thanks for your kind words davegee….really appreciated and encouraging. Well at last …almost back to where I was a month or more ago. As with most of these things there have been a number of positive outcomes as more info’ photographs have come to light …thanks again you guys. Have ‘installed’ more rivets ( yes Marvin, they are pricked individually – a little tedious but the results are worth it I think - with a riveter tool there is much less control IMHO ). Also more accurate stringer profiles are now going in on the aft side of the forward bulkhead. Had not realised they varied so much. As mentioned last time have completed a new sectioning of the port side skin which I think looks better. With all the pencil marks everywhere it is starting to get somewhat grubby but that will get cleaned up with meths which also acts as a good de-greaser in prep for painting. Cheers John Edited May 6, 2013 by johnbuck Quote Link to post Share on other sites
johnbuck Posted June 4, 2013 Author Share Posted June 4, 2013 (edited) Good morning all and crackerjazz particularly, Was not sure where to post this but thought I should let you know : Have literally just this minute discovered ........THE S/CAT ERIC HARTWELL INFODABBLE SITE IS BACK http://lm.ehartwell.com/SCATSystems.htm IMHO for those of us interested in the lunar module this is just about the best and most informative site on our beloved LM that is out there on the web.........brilliant........... Will post my LM progress in the next couple of weeks .. Keep playing with the styrene Best wishes to all John Edited June 4, 2013 by johnbuck Quote Link to post Share on other sites
spaceman Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Hi John, thanks for sharing this brilliant source, I immediately have saved. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
crackerjazz Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Really excellent stuff, John, thanks for sharing! :) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
johnbuck Posted January 2, 2014 Author Share Posted January 2, 2014 (edited) Hi Folks, so here is a sort of walk-around update until it went on hiatus last autumn...self explanatory I hope. The brackets were fun to do ! They cannot be fitted until I have painted the main body as with the facing panels associated with them (on the sectioned side I could put one in as you can see ) and then I will probably start on the cabin. Must get back to it....stop modelhopping..... Have found a couple of assemblies I built to go on but cannot remember where they go !!! hey ho....back to the drawing board......old age is not for sissies. Happy New Year to one and all and keep hacking at the styrene... Cheers John Edited January 2, 2014 by johnbuck Quote Link to post Share on other sites
K2Pete Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 And here I thought you were stuck in the same doldrums I'm in ... you've been bizz-z-z-z-zy! My gosh John, this is simply spek-tak-yoo-lar! Thanx for posting ... now I'm gonna take a nice lo-o-o-ong look at this eye-candy! And a Happy New Year to you! Pete Quote Link to post Share on other sites
johnbuck Posted January 2, 2014 Author Share Posted January 2, 2014 Thanks Pete...really appreciated Have just added another pic to the post that I had forgotten. Getting an update on Columbiad as well. Cheers John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
crackerjazz Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 Even at an unfinished stage your work is already worth displaying, John. A real treat watching this! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
johnbuck Posted January 3, 2014 Author Share Posted January 3, 2014 Thanks Crackerjazz...really appreciate your comment. Cheers John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
johnbuck Posted April 19, 2015 Author Share Posted April 19, 2015 Hi Folks well...after a year + hiatus on my LM thought it was time to get back to it...so : the cabin first, now that the mid-section is virtually complete ( one or two rivet overlays and a couple of small repairs to do). Have decided to make the 'break' at the front face of the cabin rather than the more conventional break at the cabin/midsection so as to aid the cabin's final shape. The front face is a self contained assembly and will be more easily removed and re-fitted when necessary. Developed the skin assembly and made the up the frame longerons. Dry fitted the total assembly just to check everything was in order and cemented the skin assembly only to the forward bulkhead of the mid- section. Plenty of access should I wish for any second fixings later. Before I cement the longerons I will get the deck beam assembly and deck made, the latter sits on the former, and also add the internal/external cruciforms. It feels good to be back with it. Cheers JohnB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
crackerjazz Posted April 19, 2015 Share Posted April 19, 2015 Just beautiful, John!!! Always excited to see an update from you :) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
johnlove_mk_II Posted April 20, 2015 Share Posted April 20, 2015 That's beautiful. Great work John. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Aussie-Pete Posted April 20, 2015 Share Posted April 20, 2015 Wow. Now that's some special building and abilities. Not a mech engineer? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
johnbuck Posted April 21, 2015 Author Share Posted April 21, 2015 Thanks Guys for your kind words...really appreciated Nope Aussie-Pete...just have a fascination with structures...what lies under the skin as it were. The ol' LM was certainly a remarkable piece of engineering...ten thou thick that cabin skin in 'real life...same as the styrene sheet I have used...!! Am working on the deck and deck beam assemblies at the moment. Will post more pics then. Thanks again. Cheers JohnB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
johnbuck Posted April 24, 2015 Author Share Posted April 24, 2015 (edited) Hi Guys, Am making some progress. Deck construction is well underway. The stanchions at the front ( when trimed to the correct length ) form supports for the interstage connection points . On the underside sectioned a small area to show its honeycomb construction. Deck is just dry fitted to check. There are still quite a lot of fittings to go on. Longerons are now cemented in position and cruciforms being installed. When these are all in I can section the port side of the cabin and place any rivet overlays. This is fun.......... Even at this scale the structure is becoming surprisingly rigid and it is by no means complete..all due to Tom Kelly, his slide rule, and his team's superb engineering methinks. Cheers JohnB Edited April 24, 2015 by johnbuck Quote Link to post Share on other sites
crackerjazz Posted April 25, 2015 Share Posted April 25, 2015 When you say "rivet overlays" are those separate pin-pricked panels that you glue onto the smooth surface? Would that be 0.13mm (.005") styrene? That's what I did on my LLRV ejection seat and I noticed that the thin styrene melts and warps somewhat when I use Tamiya liquid glue on it. Very interesting that honeycomb - how was it done? Also, it's good you found some good references for the deck. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
K2Pete Posted April 25, 2015 Share Posted April 25, 2015 Johnny, Johnny Johnny ... this 'bunch of loonies' is so happy to see you back on this and wonder if your wife is concerned that you've rejoined the 'no sox brigade'! This build is giving me visual orgasms! Pete Quote Link to post Share on other sites
johnbuck Posted April 25, 2015 Author Share Posted April 25, 2015 (edited) Hi Pete, Many thanks...never left it...according to her....and neither have any of us ! Hi Crackerjazz, with the 005" rivet overlays and throughout all my builds I use Slater's Mek-Pac liquid cement applied with a number 3 sable brush, just a touch on the edges and light finger pressure. I had the melting problem too but now seem to judge the amount OK most times. The honeycomb is bridal veil material stacked up, from the local habadasher. They also have square netting which could be used should I fit any of it out later. Its made of nylon ? rayon ? and cements to styrene with cyno' no problem. The photo refs are from J Stoff's ' Building Moonships' in the Images of America series...available on Amazon ....which reminds me : in the spring of last year you asked about the drogue latches in the tunnel by PM....clearly I had a big senior moment and completely forgot about the tunnel pic in this book I also used which shows the latches I modelled (also the deck ) .... so many apols for that and hope I answered your questions OK this time. Your wonderful ascent engine inspires me : am definitely going to build one for this LM .... even if I don't fit it out. Cheers JohnB ps. Highly recommend this book to all if you don't know it...essentialy a collection of excellent B/W photographs. Edited April 25, 2015 by johnbuck Quote Link to post Share on other sites
johnbuck Posted July 6, 2015 Author Share Posted July 6, 2015 Hi Folks, Have hit a problem with the build : thought things were coming along on the cabin section but have discovered another incidence of my idiocy........I made the cabin too shallow by 3/64" by mis-interpreting/measuring a fundamental dimension. So all now scrapped ( the cabin that is ) but am now on the way with the re-build. However, this has provided an excuse to let you all know ( if you have not found it yourselves ) a extraordinary paper model LM I discovered on one of my paper modelling forums. This has got to be the definitive 3D representation of our beloved LM methinks... this chap is clearly incredibly gifted... the design alone, let alone the art work.... all aspects in fact in producing this remarkable piece of paper engineering. Yep...pick it up from the printers tomorrow ( requires A3 at 3/8 scale ) Enjoy http://uhu02.way-nifty.com/die_eule_der_minerva/041.html Cheers JB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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