Spacecraft and rocket models

[ralf]

I agree with John here. I am also looking forward to see your approach on the solar cells. And as I said it's always interesting to see such a project develop and I am sure we all can learn a thing or two from it.

By the way can you share the pictures of the solar panels? They would probably helpful for my Ranger build. Thanks...

Cheers Ralf

Edited June 9, 2013 by ralf

[davegee1]

I agree with John here. I am also looking forward to see your approach on the solar cells. And as I said it's always interesting to see such a project develop and I am sure we all can learn a thing or two from it.

By the way can you share the pictures of the solar panels? They would probably helpful for my Ranger build. Thanks...

Cheers Ralf

Hi Ralf: I would be happy to. I think one of the best things about websites like this and the threads we put on them is that we can share our modeling experiences and ideas that might help each other on our projects. Regarding the solar panels, I am not sure yet exactly how we will go about it, but I do have an idea of the color and shape of what panels were used on the early DMSP satellites. Closeup photos I have taken show wires leading inbetween the panel modules, so I would like to add some of that to make it look more believable as an accurate model. If I can make it look like a backup satellite that was flight ready but never launched, that would be the level I would like to attain. Not sure if that will happen, but that is my goal, anyway.

davegee

[davegee1]

Hi Ralf: I would be happy to. I think one of the best things about websites like this and the threads we put on them is that we can share our modeling experiences and ideas that might help each other on our projects. Regarding the solar panels, I am not sure yet exactly how we will go about it, but I do have an idea of the color and shape of what panels were used on the early DMSP satellites. Closeup photos I have taken show wires leading inbetween the panel modules, so I would like to add some of that to make it look more believable as an accurate model. If I can make it look like a backup satellite that was flight ready but never launched, that would be the level I would like to attain. Not sure if that will happen, but that is my goal, anyway.

I just glued in the 10 radial beams onto the bottom of the satellite. They will be the supporting structure of the bottom, and then all sorts of crossbeams will be added, too. It looks like a lot of this was aluminum riveted together. I won't acually be doing riveting on this, but will add some "rivets" made from a punch in aluminum. I hope they look like the real rivets on the satellite.

The hole in the side of the tube is where the camera unit will eventually go.

davegee

Edited June 9, 2013 by davegee1

[davegee1]

REQUEST FOR ANY IDEAS ON A FOAM SAFE PRIMER/SURFACER

Hi All: a lot of the pieces being added onto this satellite model are a thing called gatorfoam. For those unfamiliar, it comes in various thicknesses, like 1/4", 1/2", etc. It is a foam core sandwiched by two pieces of a plastic like sheeting. The problem is, it has a foam edge that needs to be sealed on any cut pieces that are exposed to viewing. I could use a putty or something to seal and sand these areas, but was wondering if anyone knows of a spray primer/surfacer that won't attack foam. If need be, I could use a can and paint the stuff on, but prefer spray that I could later sand, if possible.

Any ideas are appreciated!

Thanks,

davegee

[ralf]

Hi Davegee

I never used those gatorfoam since we don't have those here in Germany. But I used Kapamount which seems quite similar. It's also made of two plastic sheets and has a foam core. So I think the material (polyurethane) is quite similar. I've used them for some other projects since they are quite nice to scribe with a needle if you remove one of the plastic sheets. Of course I also painted them and they work quite well with the paints. Normally they should work with any acrylic paint. I used Tamiyas grey primer (from the can) but I think any acrylic primer (like Vallejo) will work.

Hope this helps..

Cheers Ralf

[davegee1]

Hi Davegee

I never used those gatorfoam since we don't have those here in Germany. But I used Kapamount which seems quite similar. It's also made of two plastic sheets and has a foam core. So I think the material (polyurethane) is quite similar. I've used them for some other projects since they are quite nice to scribe with a needle if you remove one of the plastic sheets. Of course I also painted them and they work quite well with the paints. Normally they should work with any acrylic paint. I used Tamiyas grey primer (from the can) but I think any acrylic primer (like Vallejo) will work.

Hope this helps..

Cheers Ralf

Thanks for the tip, Ralf. I will give them a try.

cheers

davegee

[davegee1]

Hi All: Been working on parts of the satellite model when able, work always gets in the way! Anyway, I loosely assembled the outer panels and top to the satellite and taped them together just to get a general idea of the fit. And it looks like very little, if any, trimming will be necessary. These pieces are 3/16" thick gatorfoam, basically foam sandwiched by sheets of thin plastic. It is very light, very strong, and doesn't warp. These pieces will eventually be screwed into the carboard tube beneath it, and then the simulated solar panels will almost completely cover all the black gatorfoam.

Here is a pic of the first "fit test" of the panels and top. It is setting on top of what used to be the rest of the cardboard moving barrel that was a part of the satellite structure in the first place. It just happened to be exactly the right size, and it was cheap!

Will post more pics as we develop this. Special thanks to Patrick at Moonshine Signs who is helping me fabricate some of these parts. If you need cool signs or things made for your models, I bet Patrick can do them, at a reasonable price!

Although you can't see the detail of the bottom of the satellite in the picture, a lot of work is going on down there, too. I will be adding two rows of cut, beveled foam pieces that will make two rings that go around inbetween the spokes of the satellite. I will probably finish the bottom and maybe even paint it before actually working on the rest of the model.

davegee

[davegee1]

More pics to follow soon. One of the panels will have an area removed that will house a simulated videcon camera lens that took pictures as it rotated at about 12 rpm above the earth. Every time the camera faced towards earth, it would take a picture. The images would then be sent down to receiving stations on earth where they would be developed. The NASM is developing a stand that will allow this model to rotate as the real thing did while orbiting the earth.

I learned that this particular type satellite I am making had a big support role in the Cuban Missile Crisis of October 1962, where we almost went to WWIII with the Russians. They used pictures from the satellite that photographed the suspected missile sites in Cuba to gauge when the cloud cover would clear so they could send a high speed "recce" F-4 to photograph them. On one pass, it looked like in the next 90 minutes the cloud cover would shift east, exposing the missile sites. So, off went an F-4 out of Homestead AFB in southern Florida, flying right over the wave tops and below radar detection towards Cuba. Once it hit the Cuban coast, it popped up to 3000 feet and flew at "bat out of hell" speeds right over the sites, taking pictures as it went. They fired on the aircraft but they were surprised and missed. The plane made an uneventful landing back at Homestead, the pictures were sent to Washington, and the the next day president Kennedy addressed the United Nations in New York with the evidence.That was heady stuff back in the day, pretty damn scary, even for a little 8 year old kid like me!

davegee

Edited June 21, 2013 by davegee1

[ralf]

Nice work so far, and also some interesting historical facts. Keep em coming...

Cheers Ralf

[davegee1]

Nice work so far, and also some interesting historical facts. Keep em coming...

Cheers Ralf

Thanks, Ralf. To be honest, the unmanned spy satellites were never that high on my interest list compared to manned spaceflight, but I am getting into this project, and the people who made it happen.

Right now I am busy "facing" sections of the gatorfoam to complete it. I mentioned previously that the gatorfoam is a foam sandwiched on each side with a thin plstic sheeting. But the edges aren't finished, so you have an exposed edge that needs something to finish it off. I tried a few different things like puttying, painting, etc., but settled on thin strips of .015" styrene that are glued to the exposed edges with Gorilla glue. I've found the Gorilla glue is quite adequate for the job. You have to be careful not to put on too much at a time as it expands quite a bit during the curing process, but if you clamp or tape it in place, it bonds styrene to foam very well. And if it does squeeze out a little past the edges, you can sand off the excess without too much trouble.

I'm hoping to finish a lot of the edges on the bottom side of the satellite today, and will post pics when I get it done. I'll be pretty busy with work until July 16 to do much more after that, but if I do get a break to work on it some more, I'll post more pics on progress.

davegee

[davegee1]

Thanks, Ralf. To be honest, the unmanned spy satellites were never that high on my interest list compared to manned spaceflight, but I am getting into this project, and the people who made it happen.

Right now I am busy "facing" sections of the gatorfoam to complete it. I mentioned previously that the gatorfoam is a foam sandwiched on each side with a thin plstic sheeting. But the edges aren't finished, so you have an exposed edge that needs something to finish it off. I tried a few different things like puttying, painting, etc., but settled on thin strips of .015" styrene that are glued to the exposed edges with Gorilla glue. I've found the Gorilla glue is quite adequate for the job. You have to be careful not to put on too much at a time as it expands quite a bit during the curing process, but if you clamp or tape it in place, it bonds styrene to foam very well. And if it does squeeze out a little past the edges, you can sand off the excess without too much trouble.

I'm hoping to finish a lot of the edges on the bottom side of the satellite today, and will post pics when I get it done. I'll be pretty busy with work until July 16 to do much more after that, but if I do get a break to work on it some more, I'll post more pics on progress.

davegee

[davegee1]

Hi All: I did get quite a bit done today before closing up shop and going back to work for a couple of weeks. Fortunately my wife, and one of my daughters are experts at sanding and priming, so I am going to give them some work while I am gone!

Here is a demonstration of lining up the 1/2" wide styrene to be glued onto a open face section of the gatorfoam. Gorilla glue works great, just be careful for its expansion during curing and wipe away excess with damp rag during this.

Here is the bottom section taped up for drying after the styrene was applied.

here is a picture after spray priming the bottom section and the 20 wedges that will make two rings around the "spokes" on the bottom structure. This whole mess will then be wet sanded and made smooth as glass hopefully so when the metallic gold paint is applied, it will look like real metal.The reason for the painters tape on the wedges is twofold; first, to get better adhesion of the wedges into place in the bottom of the satellite, and second, to keep the primer from possibly "eating" the unprotected foam edges.

davegee

Edited June 23, 2013 by davegee1

[davegee1]

Hi All: been busy with work, but progress continues. Several parts are out for fabrication to be cut out of acrylic. I had these cut out of gatorfoam, but acrylic will work better and be stronger. In the meantime, the "wedges" that make two rings around the bottom of the satellite in between the radial beams have been sanded, primed, cleaned, and now glued into place on the bottom of the satellite. There will be trim pieces that go along the edges where they connect to the radials, and styrene pieces that will look like connectors over the intersections of each radial/wedge. They will look like they were riveted in place by punching out some thin aluminum discs that will be glued on in strategic places.

Here is a pic of the wedges glued into place. Still much work to do, and eventually the whole area will be sprayed gloss black, followed by a special metallic gold spray from Tamiya. So, the entire bottom will be metallic gold, and the tube will be metallic silver, pretty shiny. It doesn't look like much now, put there is a plan, although sometimes I have to admit to a bit of "winging it" since no plans exist of the real thing, only a few photos and dimensional data.

Have a happy 4th, everyone.

davegee

[Youngtiger1]

Hey Dave, some amazing work you do my friend. Last year, a good friend invited me accompany him to Seatle for his SR presentation at the the museum by Beoing field where I saw your work. Totally awesome. I am glad that you are sharing some of your work here because I sure will like to learn as many tips as possible. :thumbsup:/>

Mike

[davegee1]

Thanks for the kind words, Young Tiger. I just happened to be at the Museum of Flight on a layover a couple of days ago, the first time since 2010. I was relieved that the models are in the exact same condition I left them when we dedicated the re-installation of them in the museum (I did an 18 month overhaul/restoration in 2009-10 as they had fallen into some disrepair over the years).

cheers

davegee

[davegee1]

When I was visiting the Museum of Flight a couple of days ago, I was inspecting the LM model for possible maintenance issues when a young couple came up to take a look at it. They were wondering to each other how and where the rover was stored before being deployed on the moon. I was happy to explain this and some other questions. Incredibly, they thought the LM might have been brought aboard the space shuttle, and were completely unaware of the Saturn V rocket! I hope I educated them just a little on the history and operation of one of Man's greatest accomplishments.

Davegee

[davegee1]

Got some time free to add some more details today. There are triangular fasteners attached with rivets on the real spacecraft that connect the radial beams and concentric pieces. I used styrene and my friend Patrick cut them out on his machines at his sign shop.

here is one of the little fasteners that is glued to each intersection of radial beams and concentric circle structures.

Here are some of the aluminum "rivets" that were punched out of aluminum stock and are 1/4" diameter. I'll use these all over the satellite to simulate places where pieces were riveted together.

davegee

Edited August 13, 2013 by davegee1

[davegee1]

Hi All: today I put some more fasteners on the bottom and also "rivets" stamped out of aluminum sheet. I glued them on with CA glue. So far, it seems this really bonds them onto the surface. Still a lot of work to do on the bottom, once that is done, I'll set it up for painting. From there, the 10 side pieces will be attached to the round core section. I just cut out a hatch on one of the side pieces where the camera will be mounted in the side of the model.

here is a picture with some of the fasteners in place and the "rivets" that fastened the aluminum structural pieces.

Here is a closeup of the rivets and fasteners. Since no photos exist (to my knowledge of the bottom of the DMSP satellite, I used a modified TIROS satellite as a guide. Col. Haig, original program manager for this secret project of the early 1960s advised me this was how it looked.

davegee

[davegee1]

Hi All: today I added some structural gussets to the intersections of the radial beams and the cirucular crossbraces. I used .020" styrene and had it scored down the middle so that 1/4" widths covered each side of the joints. I also added some steel rods and wood blocks inside to accommodate the four (4) trailing antennas that will attach to the aft end of the satellite. I was concerned that they would wobble too much during rotation of the model on its stand. But when I roll it on the rug simulating it spinning, the 24" long antennas are very solid and don't wobble. I suspect we might be ok if we have a really good motor that will turn the satellite without much torque and also it will be critical to be sure we have the mounting bracket dead on center so we can avoid any wobbling or instability. I think we can do this, just have to be careful.

Here is a pic of the aft end with the trailing antennas sticking out. They are 24" long and 1/8" diameter brass tubes.

A closeup showing some of the gussets I added today. I will be putting "rivets" on each one tomorrow. It actually goes pretty fast, they attach best with CA. There will be hundreds of screws, rivets, and bolts on this thing when I'm done.

davegee

Edited August 13, 2013 by davegee1

[ralf]

Great work so far. It's interesting to see how those little details enhance the overall look of the model. Just another question from me. At which angle will the completed model later be rotated? 90 degrees or slightly bent?

Cheers Ralf

[davegee1]

Great work so far. It's interesting to see how those little details enhance the overall look of the model. Just another question from me. At which angle will the completed model later be rotated? 90 degrees or slightly bent?

Cheers Ralf

Hi Ralf: I'm sure some of the details I am doing from a practical point of view won't be observed or appreciated by the viewers, as the model will be on a stand rotating at several rpm. But, it is my nature to put as much detail on a project that I can justify, so whenever it is at rest, people might see the details on close inspection.

The plans are for a mounting bracket to be bolted on the "top" of the model, and the replica will spin up to 12 rpm (depending on motor and vibration tests,etc.,) with the vertical axis of the model parallel to the ground. In other words, it will be in the alignment that it held in space so that every time the camera was pointed towards earth it would take a picture. We are still ironing out details of the stand design that will be fabricated at the NASM. The mounting flange will be sent to me and I'll install it on the finished satellite prior to shipping to Washington. If all goes well when we install it sometime next year it will be a simple attaching of the satellite onto the stand which will be bolted into the floor.

davegee

[davegee1]

The last day or two I have been painting the bottom structure of the satellite a gloss black, and now I just painted a ring that goes around the bottom of the satellite the metallic gold paint from Tamiya. Man, this stuff is expensive for a little spray can is $21!! But hopefully it will be worth it and will look like metal when done. I'll include a couple of pics.

Here is the bottom after being sprayed gloss black. After this is fully dry, I'll paint the metallic gold over it. The black helps the gold "pop" and look more realistic.

This is with the gold ring painted on the bottom layed on top of the rest of the satellite. This ring will actually be placed about two inches below where you see it in the picture, and serves as a base for the 10 sides of the satellite to attach to.

davegee

Edited August 13, 2013 by davegee1

[richter111]

I have seen your work for years and always stand amazed. Im glad you joined and even more glad to see your work. It's like peeking into the mind of a master.

[davegee1]

I have seen your work for years and always stand amazed. Im glad you joined and even more glad to see your work. It's like peeking into the mind of a master.

Thanks so much for your kind words, Richter111. I equally enjoy seeing the incredible works of other modelers on this site, and others, too. We have a lot of ingenious, gifted modelers out there, and I am proud to be associated with them.

Cheers

davegee

[Stratospheremodels]

OK, here goes!

Hey, it worked! I had not tried using the "direct" entry before. Anyway, this is an interior shot of the 1/6 scale LM Challenger. This, being a two-year project and probably over 2500 hours into it, the details are too numerous to mention here. But just a few, scale lighting throughout the cabin, including the circuit breaker panels that were on each side of the astronauts. Alarm buttons on the control panel that light up and sound, the abort stage button that turns on a floodlight inside the ascent engine bell to demonstrate how it worked, and two blue lunar surface sensor lights that came on when pressure was applied to one of the probes on the three pads that had them. I can upload more if anyone is interested.

Thanks for the tip on uploading to this forum. I had used a similar thing before to upload from photobucket, but it was different than what this takes to upload the pics.

davegee

Indeed....!!! That's incredible work ! Bravo ! Bravo ! Bravo !

Stephane.