Attempt at wash gone wrong...

[Cobus]

I attempted my first wheelbay wash for my first model (Hobbyboss F-14) and it did not go well so I need to understand what I did wrong, please advise.

What I did to the wheelbay was:

1. Coat of primer - Alclad gray primer

2. 2 coats of Tamiya flat white to get it nice and white

3. 1 Coat of Tamiya TS-80 flat clear

Couple of days passed between each previous step

4. Wash with Tamiya Panel Line Accent Colour Black

5. Waited a couple of minutes then I started cleaning up with Tamiya X-20 enamel thinner.

I thought the TS-80, being a lacquer, would be enough of a barrier to protect the white coat but when I started clearing some of the wash with a bud dipped in X-20 the white started coming off as well, showing the gray primer/plastic.

Where did I go wrong? Should I have coated another layer of TS-80?

[xavi84]

You need to use an acrylic clear coat if you are going to use a enamel thinner. Give your model a good coat of Future instead of the Tamyia clear coat.

HTH

-xavi

[Netz]

Or once you've painted it white, give it a wash of Tamiya Smoke thinned with X-20 and leave it alone.

Curt

[Holeshot]

I just use an oil paint (from the tubes) and turpenoid wash right over the Tamiya white, you'd be fine. A mix of paynes grey, lamp black, burnt umber, and raw sienna makes a nice grungy dirty grimy wash.

Good luck,

Curtis

[galileo1]

Use an acrylic gloss like Future or Tamiya's acrylic gloss. Once you've got your wash done, then spray a clear flat.

Rob

[Cobus]

You need to use an acrylic clear coat if you are going to use a enamel thinner. Give your model a good coat of Future instead of the Tamyia clear coat.

HTH

-xavi

Unfortunately down here in South Africa we don't have access to the miracle liquid that is Future... :crying2:/>

Or once you've painted it white, give it a wash of Tamiya Smoke thinned with X-20 and leave it alone.

Curt

Ok, I got Smoke, how much should I thin it by? And when you say "leave it alone", do you mean I should not clean it up?

I just use an oil paint (from the tubes) and turpenoid wash right over the Tamiya white, you'd be fine. A mix of paynes grey, lamp black, burnt umber, and raw sienna makes a nice grungy dirty grimy wash.

Good luck,

Curtis

Just want to make sure - the turpenoid wash does not damage enamel?

Use an acrylic gloss like Future or Tamiya's acrylic gloss. Once you've got your wash done, then spray a clear flat.

Rob

Ok I got Tamiya Acrylic Clear, will give that a try.

Edited May 7, 2013 by Cobus

[arnobiz]

Just to make it clear (haha) washes work much better on GLOSS coats. Flat coats will retain the wash in every pore, which is not what you want normally.

Arnaud

[Cobus]

Just to make it clear (haha) washes work much better on GLOSS coats. Flat coats will retain the wash in every pore, which is not what you want normally.

Arnaud

Found that out the hard way... :(

[chukw]

You always need a clear barrier between layers of paint, and the layers need to alternate between the different types of paint: acrylic/enamel/acrylic/enamel- etc.

Hope this helps!

chuk

[arnobiz]

You always need a clear barrier between layers of paint, and the layers need to alternate between the different types of paint: acrylic/enamel/acrylic/enamel- etc.

Not sure if I follow you there chuk...

1/ Why would you apply a clear coat between, say, two layers of the same colour?

2/ If you paint a camo would you actually paint the base colour with, say, acrylics, the second with enamels and the third with acrylic?

Needless to say my answer to both questions is simple - I would not. A barrier between enamel and acrylics, why not, but other than that I would not bother. Actually the only use I have for clear coats (i.e. Future) is before decalling to avoid silvering and after decalling to protect decals and paint from the oil and avoid absorption of the wash by the paint instead of the panel lines.

But then I have been wrong more than once ;)

Arnaud

[chukw]

I should have noted that this is necessary when using washes and thinners- the barrier keeps the solvent from attacking the base coat, that's all.

[MarcDuhon]

Just to make it clear (haha) washes work much better on GLOSS coats. Flat coats will retain the wash in every pore, which is not what you want normally.

Arnaud

Amen to that...... washes for gloss and pigments for flats ....

Honestly I favor using a black primer for wheelbays... then build up to white with thin coats..... it is a great effect and needs just a little wash to finish off...

[Cobus]

Great help, thanks all!

[Cobus]

Thanks for all the help!

[kozlok]

To clear up any confusion. 1: paint the aircraft with whatever paint you want, oil or acrylic. If you paint in gloss acrylics, skip step 2. 2: coat with any good gloss acrylic clear coat. If your main paint was enamel or other solvent based paint, make sure it is fully cured before the acrylic clear. I usually wait a week or so. Future is probably available in your country under a different name. Really, though, any acrylic clear works, future is just very nice, and very cheap. 3: wash with enamel paints or oil paints. I like oil paints (for artists) thinned with turpenoid. 4: wait a few minutes for the wash to almost set. 5: use a cotton swab (q-tip) with a small bit of turpenoid/thinner on it to wipe up the extra wash. When you wipe the flying surfaces, wipe in the direction the air goes, and you can get some nice streaking. 6:wait a week and top coat with whatever flat finish you like.

If you want to, you can swap the clear coat to a solvent based clear, and use an acrylic wash, but otherwise, the same principle applies. The clear coat can be the same as the main paint, but mus be different than the wash paint. If the clear and the main paint are different, allow plenty of time for the paint to cure between types of paint.

[Der Grüne Punkt]

The safest way is to use water based washes, Vallejo's paints or Revell acqua paints, or water-diluted school paints, you'll never damage anything with that, also if you use the right oil thinner with enough coats you'll damage enamel based varnish too.

Edited May 31, 2013 by Der Grüne Punkt

[Netz]

Ok, I got Smoke, how much should I thin it by? And when you say "leave it alone", do you mean I should not clean it up?

I can't really give you an exact ratio, but 50/50 would be a strong mix, 70/30 would be better more subtle.

Here is the wash applied over unpainted grey resin (1/48),I'd say the mix was 70-T/30-P.

I just brushed it on heavy and left it alone.

Curt

Edited June 8, 2013 by Netz

[Cobus]

Thanks for getting back to me Curt.