MarkC Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 I really like this forum - I thought a good place to put up builds - join in, have fun! You can get lots of information from people on here. Also I like to post up my work... a-4 in display case So why on earth does Mike T take it on himself to start pointing out how very wrong my weathering is on this thread? So even when I took the trouble to show him some references of none so immaculate airframes --- what does he do --- responds with a stack of insults ? I also post builds up in the Critique area -- critique corner A-4 I like both areas - one for feedback one for just showing the builds to the forum. I personally don`t really care - frankly its pathetic. Just a shame on this forum I thought it was a more relaxed place with less of this sort of stuff? best Mark Link to post Share on other sites
Hajo L. Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 You guys (both!) need to work on your attitude... ;) HAJO Link to post Share on other sites
MarkC Posted June 5, 2013 Author Share Posted June 5, 2013 I make a point of respecting peoples work. You know a bit of encouragement sometimes. Not one for shooting away peoples builds. I can take critique but not like this ! He basically just said it's all wrong ... Hey so when I tried to show references hey guess what im insulted for my trouble ...go figure Link to post Share on other sites
TheFlyingDutchman Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 I can't see anyone in your linked thread insulting you personally. Just someone with another view on the subject than you have. When you post pictures of your models on the internet, you get reactions and when you don't like them, you have to ignore them, or stop posting your models on the web. You're making a very large issue out of this. Don't do that, modeling is a hobby and hobby's should be fun. Link to post Share on other sites
HOLMES Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 (edited) Mark, I see the BOSS. Has reiterated the rules n your first linked thread.. Some folk need to vent their "expertise" even if the real experts are out there. And showing references etc still wont be right for him ..because he knows better .. I would not give up posting as the ARC. is still the BEST . forum.. I also see that you posted the build in critique corner where if anyone wants to criticize with constructive criticism. The gentleman who ever it was could have said his piece in the critique corner.. Better to leave it..I agree we All need a bit of or lots of encouragement .. Some people get a bee in their bonnets and its buzzing in their heads so they get a tad over the top ..and let rip.. You did nothing wrong. Keep on posting your WIPS AND FINISHED Models... And do not forget there us an ignore button...use it!! By the way it's a Really stunning build. Edited June 5, 2013 by HOLMES Link to post Share on other sites
MarkC Posted June 5, 2013 Author Share Posted June 5, 2013 Holmes your a rock bro. Your always here you always offer positive encouragement on the forums. Many thanks I agree with what you say about the forum. Best mark Link to post Share on other sites
jester292 Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 Mark, I also enjoy checking out your work. Let him go be angry on someone else's time. Aaron Link to post Share on other sites
-Neu- Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 (edited) I can't see anyone in your linked thread insulting you personally. Just someone with another view on the subject than you have. When you post pictures of your models on the internet, you get reactions and when you don't like them, you have to ignore them, or stop posting your models on the web. You're making a very large issue out of this. Don't do that, modeling is a hobby and hobby's should be fun. I think you should examine this issue a bit more closely than applying a broad brush claim about the way the internet is. He posted his photo in the display case, (not critique corner) both of which have very clear forum guidelines. So no, your claim that its "just the internet" does not apply. He did not expect that sort of response in there, and for good reason. Second, the individual in question made some fairly asinine remarks, supported by some very subjective evidence based on "In my time in the marine corps." The OP posts a photo of a fairly weathered A-4 in response (maybe not as much as the model, but its not far off either), to which the critiquer replies with more subjective views with some fairly asinine comments. He didn't say he was there, or post any contradictory evidence that threw MarkC's claims into question. He basically doubled down on his previous argument. Should MarkC posted a new thread about it? Maybe not, but then again under your logic, maybe you should have just ignored it and moved on. By the way, I really liked the skyhawk too. Edited June 5, 2013 by -Neu- Link to post Share on other sites
scapilot Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 Such is life. I see this happen a lot and it's kinda sad. Makes you think that some folks need to get out of the house a bit more. You see some really good builds sometimes, and you see some really bad builds sometimes. The grown up thing to do is stick to the old cliche of not saying anything if you've got nothing nice to say. Notice i said "not nice", not constructive. But some people think that they're one in the same. You can't blast someone's work without leaving some sort of constructive criticism and then come back later and say "I was just trying to help.", that's nonsense. Strangely, the people that I often hear jeering from the cheap seats on the forums are the people who haven't built anything at all in five or more years. I think there should be a requirement that states that if you haven't completed a model in the pastt three months that is also available for viewing, that you can't comment on anyone else's. In the meantime remember that you only build on your skills for your enjoyment. So others comments are merely that. Link to post Share on other sites
zark Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 I am not going to take sides on this... "battlefront", from my experience I can tell you only one thing...in one year time you all are going to be laughing with all this!!!...keep modeling!!! Link to post Share on other sites
vince14 Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 I can't see anyone in your linked thread insulting you personally. Just someone with another view on the subject than you have. When you post pictures of your models on the internet, you get reactions and when you don't like them, you have to ignore them, or stop posting your models on the web. You're making a very large issue out of this. Don't do that, modeling is a hobby and hobby's should be fun. I have to agree. I can't see anywhere where Modelguy2 insulted you personally. He might have got it wrong by critiquing in the Display Case, which is not allowed in that forum, but all he said was that in his experience he'd never seen an A-4 with such extensive weathering - and he even compliments you on your technique. Frankly, I think you're over-reacting. Vince Link to post Share on other sites
MarkC Posted June 5, 2013 Author Share Posted June 5, 2013 (edited) I like the way Neu and Scapilot has summed this up. I posted this in both areas - one for critique and input. The other after it was done - I mean its the end finito. How do I feel insulted - its the condescending manner that he uses - like the "during my time in the corps", "you will have to show me a photo", "hey whatever kid". The fact is I used a lot of research on that build! However, it just gets blown away with this guys opinion that I have created some piece of fiction. Scapilot is correct - why not keep your opinion to yourself unless its going to help? Even when I went to the trouble of posting up some ref pictures - hey that don`t matter - because I have not got a clue. That is pretty much an insult! What is the trend nowadays? I mean seriously I don`t mind critique when it actually helps - and a lot of people do. As in look at the first postings where the guy points out that I have not really got the refuelling probe correct. I mean seriously that is fair and useful --- it really helps. I think if you take your time to build and photo your models and regardless of ability and style. You dont expect to get blasted? I mean if its not your thing thats ok - but do you really need to insult me? I dont mind some sort of debate on a-4s and weathering or whatever - i mean an opinion is one thing - we can all be different so why not respect that also. best Mark Edited June 5, 2013 by MarkC Link to post Share on other sites
White Wolf Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 I think it's strange that you're so focused on that one lone voice of dissent compared to the 10+ positive compliments that you got for your build, and you can add one from me. I'd be thrilled if I got that many compliments for my own builds, but anyway. Link to post Share on other sites
Flyingfortress Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 Just let it go. Link to post Share on other sites
MarkC Posted June 5, 2013 Author Share Posted June 5, 2013 Guys im not on a mission here, my ego is just fine. I should have made this general instead of specific to my build. But yes I am hacked off with this sort of attitude. I just sort of see this hsppening,to a lot of other modellers . I just don't like this happening to anyone. More so beginners that get knocked for the fact they are still learning. Link to post Share on other sites
phantom Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 Sorry, most everyone gave a nice comment on your well done build. The one you questioned gave a comment from his experience which did not appear insulting to me. Just a difference of opinion. I would let this go as well. Link to post Share on other sites
Maker Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 I think he's just jealous. Your Skyhawk looks better than any of his that he posted pictures of. Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 I tend to think in these situations you have to try to look at it from the other ones point of view, and that might help clarify things. I like to ask what his motives were for posting how he did. Did he genuinely think he was helping by providing feedback based on his real life experience? Was he trying to show off his inside knowledge of the subject to make himself look good? Was he perhaps insulted as a Marine that one would think their planes were that dirty? Is he just "that kind of guy" that likes to criticize? Who knows? perhaps it's a combination of all that. I do think that yes he may have been out of line posting a critique (even though it wasn't an overly harsh critique) in the gallery but he might not have known the rules. I think you may have jumped to the defensive a bit too quick as well. From there it started being more about being insulted he posted an honest critique then what the critique was. He did compliment you on the technique and simply disagreed with the application. I think a "thanks for your input, but keep in mind this isn't critique corner. I think it's accurate as is so it is what it is" might have been a slightly better coarse of action. I say at this point, shake hands, agree to disagree and move on. Also, something else to keep in mind, Marines are great guys, wonderful friends and all around the best buddy you can have on your side of bad things, BUT they aren't exactly known for their subtlety. So you have to realize their filter might be slightly different from yours or mine. Just a thought. Bill BTW, awesome build! Link to post Share on other sites
RKic Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 why not keep your opinion to yourself unless its going to help? Because when you expose your work to the public, some of the public may not like it. That is part and parcel of a public display. Mike didn't start off by insulting you. He simply made a statement that he thought your model was over-weathered. Link to post Share on other sites
RKic Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 I think he's just jealous. Your Skyhawk looks better than any of his that he posted pictures of. Seriously? Are we applying playground debate tactics now? Link to post Share on other sites
Kevan Vogler Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 I think it's strange that you're so focused on that one lone voice of dissent compared to the 10+ positive compliments that you got for your build, and you can add one from me. I'd be thrilled if I got that many compliments for my own builds, but anyway. I tend to agree with White Wolf on this. You really are focusing too much on the comments of one member at the expense of those of the others who responded to your post. Don't let one voice get to you so much. Link to post Share on other sites
ChippyWho Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 Mark, I think this would be my response: "Many thanks for your input -have a great day!" Link to post Share on other sites
VA-115EFR Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 For what it's worth, I just looked at your Scooter in the display case, and I think it looks AWESOME!!! I LOVE EM DIRTY!!! Link to post Share on other sites
TheFlyingDutchman Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 I think you should examine this issue a bit more closely than applying a broad brush claim about the way the internet is. He posted his photo in the display case, (not critique corner) both of which have very clear forum guidelines. So no, your claim that its "just the internet" does not apply. He did not expect that sort of response in there, and for good reason. Second, the individual in question made some fairly asinine remarks, supported by some very subjective evidence based on "In my time in the marine corps." The OP posts a photo of a fairly weathered A-4 in response (maybe not as much as the model, but its not far off either), to which the critiquer replies with more subjective views with some fairly asinine comments. He didn't say he was there, or post any contradictory evidence that threw MarkC's claims into question. He basically doubled down on his previous argument. Should MarkC posted a new thread about it? Maybe not, but then again under your logic, maybe you should have just ignored it and moved on. By the way, I really liked the skyhawk too. You're right about the kind of comments you should expect in ARC's different forums but it just surprises me how people react sometimes on fairly unimportant issues. It's what the Dutch call 'turning a mosquito into an elephant'. And yes, I liked the model too. Link to post Share on other sites
echolmberg Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 (edited) Mark, I think your model looked great. I was building a Hasegawa A-4 but have since shelved it since I botched up the paint job. I'll go back at it once I feel the motivation again. Until then, it'll just have to remain in its box back in my small stash. If it ends up half as nice as yours does, I can die a happy man. I know it won't though since my weathering skills could really stand some improvement. Mike, I value your input ESPECIALLY for being a Marine who worked around those planes. I think in general modelers such as myself who have zero military experience whatsoever value your input and expertise. Veterans like you are much valued first and foremost for your service and secondly due to your input and advancement in our continuous efforts to create realistic models of our favorite subjects. Having said all that, I feel I would be remiss if I didn't say the following: Mark, I do not believe Mike was burning your build or in any way denigrating you personally nor your model skills in general. He was just saying that as a person who worked around those very aircraft, he never personally observed heavily weathered aircraft. I don't think he was saying you were wrong or that you or your model suck. He was just saying that he had never seen one as weathered as yours was depicted. In my opinion, I think you took things too personally and chose to escalate the matter. Mike, I've been yelled at in the past for asking a question on this forum in regards to why someone weathered their plane the way it was. I received several e-mails afterwards saying I broke the rules. So if there's one thing I learned, if a picture is posted on the general forum, just blow sunshine at the person even if they show a La-Z-Boy recliner in the cockpit of a Sopwith Camel and the wings are made of bricks. I feel like I'm having to speak to Mark and Mike in the same way I speak to my 6 and 9 year old girls when they're having tantrums. Grow some thicker skin and appreciate constructive input even if it differs from your own. Don't start bashing others when they say your work isn't their cup of tea. If you're going to post pictures, you've got to check your ego at the door. Take something positive away from what was said and let it go at that. Now let's go back to playing nice and not like the 2nd graders with whom my wife has to work. Eric Edited June 5, 2013 by echolmberg Link to post Share on other sites
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