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Great Wall Hobby 1/48 F-15B/D


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Dear GWH,

If you ever plan to modify your Eagle, here is my book of dreams.

So, in yours next Eagle release I would like:

1) New shorter exhaust nozzles with etched actuators.

2) New exhaust nozzles with turkey feathers.

3) New canopy fairing.

4) New bulged canopy and windshield.

5) New internal engineering so that we do not need to fit inside the fuselage the engine trunks.

6) New wheels accurate in both sides.

In addition, I would like:

7) Only one engine, but with additional parts, so to be possible building the engine and the airplane as separate models.

8) A stand for displaying the engine next to the airplane.

9) New, up to date, missile launch rails.

10) A metal fork insert for the nose undercarriage leg.

11) Some accurate conformal packs (NOTE: not like the Revell ones).

What I would not like follows:

12) Big wide open access panels, because open them is easier than closing them

13) Variable air intakes, because they are down almost only when taxing and pilots are not supplied.

And what I dream is an Eagle with:

. . . very restrained panel lines, and very few rivets.

. . . accurate engine bulges.

. . . finally accurate air-brake area.

Dreaming, keep dreaming

Hi Galfa

This is not a book anymore , it's just as thick as a bible !

Jesus ( If I may say ...), I am sure Mr G.W.H. will have a close look at this list, and I know for sure that he will do whatever is economical for him do to fullfil your wishes, but please not every dream can come true , can't it ?

Perfection doesn't belong to this world, does it ? . You are perfectly right when you use the word "dream".

I just trust G.W.H and I am sure he will improve his product thanks to all the "rivet counters" and dedicated people from this thread, but be also aware that Mr G.W.H. has a business to run , still on the learning process , still listening in and doing his best to satisfy his customers.( I can testify on this ! )

For all this I , for sure , will add one of his Eagle to my stash, just to encourage him to go on like this.

There is enough crap coming on the market nowadays ( from Europe and Asia ) that serious and listening new producers need our encouragements and support.

G.W.H. is one of these.

Madcop :D/>

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Dear Madcop,

I have just read your post. Well, maybe we have some misunderstanding. I wrote "book of dreams" just for ironic purposes.

All the things in my list are very possible, and most of them are since long avaible in the much cheaper Hasegawa Eagle. So, it is not a matter of costs, even less of perfectiion.

My point is not if GWH will ever do, or not, what is in my book of dreams. I do not care if GWH listen of not. GWH lerning curve is none of y business.

My point is to warn other modelers, who share my same love for accuracy, from wasting their money on a kit that is less accurate than the cheaper and older Hasegawa.

I know very well that perfection does not belong to this world, but I do know that this new GWH Eagle is way less perfect than the twenty-five years older Hasegawa Eagle. Accuracy wise the Hasegawa Eagle is much better than the new Eagle from GWH (and the same is true for the Revell Eagle).

This thread has explained beyond any dubt that the GWH Eagle is a kit full of mistakes, seriously mishaped, over-engineered and expensive.

So, my point is not about sharing my dreams of perfection, but to warn my fellow modelers to stay away from the new GWH Eagle if, and only IF, accuracy, ease of assembly, and money are importat for them like they are important for me.

Cheers,

Edited by galfa
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Spang had C models by the early 80's same with Bitburg, a bit later then Langley.

Maybe they got the gear before they transitioned but highly doubtful .

Spang means Spangdahlem? When I left Ramstein in May 1986 the 52 TFW at Spangdahlem was still all Phantoms, a mix of F-4E ARN-101 DMAS birds and F-4G Weasels in the 23 TFS, 81 TFS and 480 TFS. It wasn't until at least 1987 that they got their first F-16s, and after that when the first F-15s were assigned. Forgive the nit-pick but I thought some folks might be interested.

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Spang means Spangdahlem? When I left Ramstein in May 1986 the 52 TFW at Spangdahlem was still all Phantoms, a mix of F-4E ARN-101 DMAS birds and F-4G Weasels in the 23 TFS, 81 TFS and 480 TFS. It wasn't until at least 1987 that they got their first F-16s, and after that when the first F-15s were assigned. Forgive the nit-pick but I thought some folks might be interested.

Thanx Scott appreciate the info...

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My point is to warn other modelers, who share my same love for accuracy, from wasting their money on a kit that is less accurate than the cheaper and older Hasegawa.

I know very well that perfection does not belong to this world, but I do know that this new GWH Eagle is way less perfect than the twenty-five years older Hasegawa Eagle. Accuracy wise the Hasegawa Eagle is much better than the new Eagle from GWH (and the same is true for the Revell Eagle).

This thread has explained beyond any dubt that the GWH Eagle is a kit full of mistakes, seriously mishaped, over-engineered and expensive.

So, my point is not about sharing my dreams of perfection, but to warn my fellow modelers to stay away from the new GWH Eagle if, and only IF, accuracy, ease of assembly, and money are importat for them like they are important for me.

Cheers,

Isn't the Hasegawa D model not a D at all, but an E? So not exactly sure how a kit of a wrong variant could be more accurate than one designed to be a B/D from the box….

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Isn't the Hasegawa D model not a D at all, but an E? So not exactly sure how a kit of a wrong variant could be more accurate than one designed to be a B/D from the box….

The Hasegawa kits were B/D models as they never really made an E model. For a long time, their Strike Eagles were based on their kit of the prototype Strike Eagle, which was a F-15B. Over time, they added additional sprues to make it more E like, but the base sprues in the kit were always for the B/D model.

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The Hasegawa kits were B/D models as they never really made an E model. For a long time, their Strike Eagles were based on their kit of the prototype Strike Eagle, which was a F-15B. Over time, they added additional sprues to make it more E like, but the base sprues in the kit were always for the B/D model.

Thanks, I thought it was the other way around. Is it actually as nice of a kit as the new GWH one? Or is it a strange hybrid mix of Hasegawa parts, like the F-4s or A-4s?

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Thanks, I thought it was the other way around. Is it actually as nice of a kit as the new GWH one? Or is it a strange hybrid mix of Hasegawa parts, like the F-4s or A-4s?

Read the last 100 posts of this thread.

It's all there; and more!

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Thanks, I thought it was the other way around. Is it actually as nice of a kit as the new GWH one? Or is it a strange hybrid mix of Hasegawa parts, like the F-4s or A-4s?

The Hasegawa kits are something like 25 years old. At the time they came out, I think the only other options for a 1/48 Legacy Eagle were the even older Revell, Monogram, and Tamiya kits. The Hasegawa kit was, for the time, a modern recessed panel line tooled kit and the level of detail was similar to their F-4 series. They never really changed much in the kits over the years other than small things like adding featherless exhausts and the aft facing ECM antennas, so it's still the same basic 25 year old kit. Here's a link to Hasegawa's latest twin seater release, the -DJ kit.

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10246242

If you are just talking level of detail and mold quality, the GWH kit blows the old Hasegawa kit away. The main issue with the GWH kit is the accuracy of some parts, and whether it's worth spending the high price of the new kit, considering the errors.

Edited by Dave Williams
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For anyone interested: at Zone 5 Jens Brandal posted a few photos of the GWH radome part - there are some issues with its shape particularly in topside view and cross section (the side profile looks quite good).

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The Hasegawa kits are something like 25 years old. At the time they came out, I think the only other options for a 1/48 Legacy Eagle were the even older Revell, Monogram, and Tamiya kits. The Hasegawa kit was, for the time, a modern recessed panel line tooled kit and the level of detail was similar to their F-4 series. They never really changed much in the kits over the years other than small things like adding featherless exhausts and the aft facing ECM antennas, so it's still the same basic 25 year old kit. Here's a link to Hasegawa's latest twin seater release, the -DJ kit.

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10246242

If you are just talking level of detail and mold quality, the GWH kit blows the old Hasegawa kit away. The main issue with the GWH kit is the accuracy of some parts, and whether it's worth spending the high price of the new kit, considering the errors.

Thanks Dave. That's a great assessment. Given the pictures of the GWH kit seen so far, I think it's pretty clear which one to buy. I'm not too bothered by a mm here or there, and the price difference really isn't much where I am. The Hasegawa Eagles are close to $70 even online, so that extra $20 for the detail and fit isn't something I'm bothered by, especially if it keeps me away form the AM budget like the Hasegawa would need to be fully detailed.

Matt

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Thanks Dave. That's a great assessment. Given the pictures of the GWH kit seen so far, I think it's pretty clear which one to buy. I'm not too bothered by a mm here or there, and the price difference really isn't much where I am. The Hasegawa Eagles are close to $70 even online, so that extra $20 for the detail and fit isn't something I'm bothered by, especially if it keeps me away form the AM budget like the Hasegawa would need to be fully detailed.

Matt

What part of Fresno do you live in? Are there any hobby shops around there, and have you seen the 144th F-15's yet? I lived in/around Fresno for two years.

Aaron

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What part of Fresno do you live in? Are there any hobby shops around there, and have you seen the 144th F-15's yet? I lived in/around Fresno for two years.

Aaron

I'm up on the northern end of town, and the only hobby shop around anymore is the big Hobbytown USA on Blackstone. Haven't seen those yet, but 1/144 isn't my thing, so I might not have looked too hard last time I was in.

Matt

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I'm up on the northern end of town, and the only hobby shop around anymore is the big Hobbytown USA on Blackstone. Haven't seen those yet, but 1/144 isn't my thing, so I might not have looked too hard last time I was in.

Matt

No, I meant the real deal...The 144th Fighter Squadron's F-15's. :monkeydance:/>/> I was in Fresno during 9/11 and had the opportunity to go on base just a few months prior...One of the first indications I had that something was going on was seeing every aircraft launch within about 3 minutes of each other with live weapons on board.

I didn't get up North much...Mostly was down around MLK Blvd and out by Ashland. Places that as a 19 year old missionary in a white shirt and tie with a black badge (that could be mis-construed pretty easily as being a cop or immigration) you didn't want to find yourself after dark.

Aaron

Edited by strikeeagle801
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I'm just thinkin' that for most of us - we have a price point on certain scales of most kits - whatever their pros or cons. Throw out the "must have" - and I'm at around maximum $25 ~ 30 for 1/72, $45 ~ 50 for 1/48 and $75 ~ $125 for 1/32nd. With this kit - when I find it at $50 or less, any issues it might have won't be such a big deal. When you reach a certain price point - it's not just comparing F-15's to F-15's - but what can I get for $100? That's what I spent on the Tamiya 1/32 Mustang and Corsair - so it becomes more of a value thing. The Corsair is the nicest kit I've ever worked with - and I'm still adding aftermarket decals, landing gear and seat belts - but that's only because I want to. So, whatever you price your product at - it's being compared to everything in that price category. If this was priced at $25 ~ $40 - I don't think it'd be too big of a deal - and I'll still get one when I can find a good price point.

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I'm just thinkin' that for most of us - we have a price point on certain scales of most kits - whatever their pros or cons. Throw out the "must have" - and I'm at around maximum $25 ~ 30 for 1/72, $45 ~ 50 for 1/48 and $75 ~ $125 for 1/32nd. With this kit - when I find it at $50 or less, any issues it might have won't be such a big deal. When you reach a certain price point - it's not just comparing F-15's to F-15's - but what can I get for $100? That's what I spent on the Tamiya 1/32 Mustang and Corsair - so it becomes more of a value thing. The Corsair is the nicest kit I've ever worked with - and I'm still adding aftermarket decals, landing gear and seat belts - but that's only because I want to. So, whatever you price your product at - it's being compared to everything in that price category. If this was priced at $25 ~ $40 - I don't think it'd be too big of a deal - and I'll still get one when I can find a good price point.

Totally agree on price range.

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No, I meant the real deal...The 144th Fighter Squadron's F-15's. :monkeydance:/>/>/> I was in Fresno during 9/11 and had the opportunity to go on base just a few months prior...One of the first indications I had that something was going on was seeing every aircraft launch within about 3 minutes of each other with live weapons on board.

I didn't get up North much...Mostly was down around MLK Blvd and out by Ashland. Places that as a 19 year old missionary in a white shirt and tie with a black badge (that could be mis-construed pretty easily as being a cop or immigration) you didn't want to find yourself after dark.

Aaron

Ah, I misunderstood. Yes, the new F-15s fly over the college and my house almost daily, and they are quite a bit louder than the older F-16s. They look great though with the Griffin on the tail. They were threatening to take away the base a couple of years back, but looks like it's as strong as ever. Especially with Cal Fire flying out of there pretty frequently with the Orions and C-130s.

I can see that, not the best neighborhood down there. It's a pretty rough part even in the daytime.

Matt

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"People like Murph, Waco, Jennings, Bruce radebaugh and others to include myself that know their jets because

they Flew or worked on them with more time then average."

Well, I would ask they to show some measurements of the areas where We are having such doubts, pics are fine

but rarely taken in the same angles the models are.

For example what is the dimensions (Height x Lenght)of the canopy braces of the F-15A/C and B/C?

Remember Einstein: "If God exists He is pure mathematics".

Long time ago I asked about the A-7K cockpit dimensions to correct the "joke" HB A-7K kit, since looks to me

that the real A-7K has parallel cockpit sills, while the HB kit clearly has convergent cockpit sills, well,

I'm still waiting...

I have several F-15s from Hasegawa 1/48, and absolutely ALL have the upper wings malformed due to the plastic

shrinking (where lower surfaces joints to upper).

For sure I will buy the GWH F-15s considering theirs MiG-29s.

For me Fatal Flaws are only the wrong dimensions and angles in a kit. All the rest may be fixed using my skills

and/or resin sets, even for the bad tires now We have several options like Royale Resins, True Details and others

that surely will come.

SouthViper

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"People like Murph, Waco, Jennings, Bruce radebaugh and others to include myself that know their jets because

they Flew or worked on them with more time then average."

Well, I would ask they to show some measurements of the areas where We are having such doubts, pics are fine

but rarely taken in the same angles the models are.

For example what is the dimensions (Height x Lenght)of the canopy braces of the F-15A/C and B/C?

Remember Einstein: "If God exists He is pure mathematics".

Long time ago I asked about the A-7K cockpit dimensions to correct the "joke" HB A-7K kit, since looks to me

that the real A-7K has parallel cockpit sills, while the HB kit clearly has convergent cockpit sills, well,

I'm still waiting...

I have several F-15s from Hasegawa 1/48, and absolutely ALL have the upper wings malformed due to the plastic

shrinking (where lower surfaces joints to upper).

For sure I will buy the GWH F-15s considering theirs MiG-29s.

For me Fatal Flaws are only the wrong dimensions and angles in a kit. All the rest may be fixed using my skills

and/or resin sets, even for the bad tires now We have several options like Royale Resins, True Details and others

that surely will come.

SouthViper

+ 1.

Madcop. :)

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. . . For me Fatal Flaws are only the wrong dimensions and angles in a kit. All the rest may be fixed using my skills and/or resin sets . . .

SouthViper

------------------------------------------

Well, according to your definition of Fatal Flaws, the new Eagle from GWH has plenty of them. This is a short list of major mishaped parts:

- Radome

- Windshield

- Canopy

- Canopy fairing

- Engine bulges

- Exhaust nozzles

. . .

Edited by galfa
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"People like Murph, Waco, Jennings, Bruce radebaugh and others to include myself that know their jets because

they Flew or worked on them with more time then average."

Well, I would ask they to show some measurements of the areas where We are having such doubts, pics are fine

but rarely taken in the same angles the models are.

For example what is the dimensions (Height x Lenght)of the canopy braces of the F-15A/C and B/C?

Remember Einstein: "If God exists He is pure mathematics".

Long time ago I asked about the A-7K cockpit dimensions to correct the "joke" HB A-7K kit, since looks to me

that the real A-7K has parallel cockpit sills, while the HB kit clearly has convergent cockpit sills, well,

I'm still waiting...

I have several F-15s from Hasegawa 1/48, and absolutely ALL have the upper wings malformed due to the plastic

shrinking (where lower surfaces joints to upper).

For sure I will buy the GWH F-15s considering theirs MiG-29s.

For me Fatal Flaws are only the wrong dimensions and angles in a kit. All the rest may be fixed using my skills

and/or resin sets, even for the bad tires now We have several options like Royale Resins, True Details and others

that surely will come.

SouthViper

Who would you suggest as best to acertain accuracy then? Plans are wrong going from 2D to 3D, can't go that route...

Apparently according to you nobody can?

Have I bought the D model (Remember can't be an accurate B model),no, I am waiting on the A model due to Choice of not wanting the D.

Have I seen this kit in the plastic, No, just listening and seeing to what is shown and stated here and by the manufaturer themselves (Because they have seen the mistakes and want to correct them). There are certain items that can't be fixed with aftermarket unless they gave you the whole aft fuselage?

When the Academy 1/48 came out I was in Korea on alert, I took the kit on top of the jet when I was in the Hole (2days on (in the hole)and 2 Days off) with a tape measure and measured the aircraft and comppared it to the kit measurements, angles and shapes and found that was the worst kit for accuracy.

Did that deter anyone from buying said kit, no...

Am I able to climb on the jet with the GWH kit, No, But I am able to acertain that there are some unusual looks to said kit by experiance, maybe unnoticable to the Layman but they still are there.

Currently I am an Engineer (working in a Managerial position) on the F-35 Vane Box Program. Does that make me an expert on the overall F-35, no....

So who would you suggest as the best judge of this kit or even say a Spitfire (there seems to be allot of flak when a new kit is issued?) or a 109 (Revells 1/32 G-6 kit has got so much flak that who knows if to stick to the Hase G-6 kit or the new Revell?)I have 7 of the Hase kits and 2 of the Revell kit.

So who would you suggest to be the best expert to constructivly critic a kit?

I think if you want accuracy then listen to all and use what you will to build that kit if you so desire. If you don't want accuarcy then just go an buy the 1970's Revell kit and call it a day, but this kit is fine if you want a state of the art F-15 so your choice as to what you want to model, accuracy or because it looks like an(input said kit???) is all up to you ....?

No flames intended

Cheers :salute:/>/>/>/>/>

Edited by Ol Crew Dog
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Dave (Ol Crew Dog),

You mentioned before that GWH are in contact with you about the corrections for future releases of their F-15s. Please make sure they are aware of the FUBARed radome cross section - it hasn't been discussed here, but photos posted at Zone 5 show it clearly... For me the radome shape problem is bigger than any other issue discussed here. I doubt GWH would be willing to retool the entire front fuselage (as the cross section problem starts there), but if they at least correct the radome front part to proper circular cross section, it would greatly improve things.

Edited by Vodnik
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Dave (Ol Crew Dog),

You mentioned before that GWH are in contact with you about the corrections for future releases of their F-15s. Please make sure they are aware of the FUBARed radome cross section - it hasn't been discussed here, but photos posted at Zone 5 show it clearly... For me the radome shape problem is bigger than any other issue discussed here. I doubt GWH would be willing to retool the entire front fuselage (as the cross section problem starts there), but if they at least correct the radome front part to proper circular cross section, it would greatly improve things.

Thanx for the info, could you share those pics on here, I am sure everyone would love to see them.

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