gb_madcat_sl Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 Sprue shots up on Luckymodel. http://www.luckymodel.com/scale.aspx?item_no=IT%202502 Mark Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dave Williams Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 Looks like there is some detail on the side consoles, which would have to be shaved off to use the PE, but it looks like the raised plastic detail isn't much different than the PE sheet. That begs the question, why include the PE sheet consoles at all? I don't see any advantage. I'm not very impressed. Hopefully the AFV club kit will be better. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Alpagueur Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 (edited) I'm not sure about the quality of the Sparrows, but will know more next week when I will have my kit handy. As I said the problem is box-decals provide just 1 Italian fighter: an ASA from 4°Stormo. On this aiframe you can only put two AIM-9L since, by that time frame, Sparrows were mostly replaced by Aspides. I will check if you can convert the Sparrows into Aspides, but I guess it will not be easy since Aspides had much larger wings. I checked Tauro decals in 32 scale but all I found were very old sheets, poorly printed and with yellow clear film :bandhead2:/>/>/>/>/>/>/> Now we can only hope aftermarket producers will take care of the problem but it will take time... Hi Paolo, many thanks. I'd like to do a bird of 36° stormo 12° gruppo C.I.O. (with the green arrow on the tail), first '80s.. so at that time the aspide and the aim-9L were not used yet (I think). I also ordered the kit but I do not know where to get the aim-9b :( (I'm not sure about the quality of the missiles included in the kit... and unfortunately cutting edge ones are out of production) cheers, Luca Edited November 27, 2013 by Alpagueur Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Paolo Maglio Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 Hi Paolo, many thanks. I'd like to do a bird of 36° stormo 12° gruppo C.I.O. (with the green arrow on the tail), first '80s.. so at that time the aspide and the aim-9L were not used yet (I think). I also ordered the kit but I do not know where to get the aim-9b :(/> (I'm not sure about the quality of the missiles included in the kit... and unfortunately cutting edge ones are out of production) cheers, Luca Good choiche if you can find suitable decals! You can use Sparrow and AIM-9B from the box but must close the gun mouth, the ejection port for fired ammunition and close the gun door. Missiles in the box looks quite good but I will know more soon. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Alpagueur Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 Good choiche if you can find suitable decals! You can use Sparrow and AIM-9B from the box but must close the gun mouth, the ejection port for fired ammunition and close the gun door. Missiles in the box looks quite good but I will know more soon. Hi Paolo, I really hope the sidewinder (at least) in the kit are good (I would have no other choice). OK for closing the gun mouth and the gun door (I already knew), but where is located the "the ejection port for fired ammunition" you said? (I had missed this particular) Thanks again! Luca Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Harold Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 Kormorans anyone? I have the main body and fins mocked up. The pylon hasn't been started yet. It hasn't been a big priority. But maybe now, I could get motivated. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jennings Posted November 27, 2013 Share Posted November 27, 2013 I'm certainly not rushing out to buy one, especially given that there's another one in the pipeline. By the time you spend $100+ for the kit and who knows how much more for corrections/upgrades, you'll be in it for a lot of coin. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dave Williams Posted November 28, 2013 Share Posted November 28, 2013 Kormorans anyone? I have the main body and fins mocked up. The pylon hasn't been started yet. It hasn't been a big priority. But maybe now, I could get motivated. Yes, please! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dave Williams Posted November 28, 2013 Share Posted November 28, 2013 (edited) Looking at the sprue shots on LM, on the photo of the sprue with the missiles, I see what appears to be dished A/C style mainwheels. Speaking of wheels, where are the thin wheels for the CF-104? I see only one set of spoked mainwheels, which I assume are the thick wheels for the G/S. I hope they don't tell you to use the dished wheels for the CF-104. Although it used thin tires, it still had a spoked hub like the thick wheeled G/S birds. Plus, there seems a lot of flash for a new tool kit. Edited November 28, 2013 by Dave Williams Quote Link to post Share on other sites
JayBee Posted November 28, 2013 Share Posted November 28, 2013 Looking at the sprue shots on LM, on the photo of the sprue with the missiles, I see what appears to be dished A/C style mainwheels. Speaking of wheels, where are the thin wheels for the CF-104? I see only one set of spoked mainwheels, which I assume are the thick wheels for the G/S. I hope they don't tell you to use the dished wheels for the CF-104. Although it used thin tires, it still had a spoked hub like the thick wheeled G/S birds. Plus, there seems a lot of flash for a new tool kit. About the wheels: In the past I make a suggestion for Danny Coremans F-104 improvement set to add correct wheels and hubs for the Hasegawa F-104 in 1/48 scale. As you mentioned, F-104G/S and CF-104 maingear hubs and wheels looks different, same for the frontwheel hub and wheels (spoked type and closed type). Unfortunately no plans to add those corrections to his set. The early "C" type of the 1/32 Italeri hubs looks completly off compared to the real one. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Paolo Maglio Posted November 28, 2013 Share Posted November 28, 2013 (edited) here is another big problem: the avionics bay in the kit is full of computers and systems as used by F-104S CI (fighters) only. If you want to build a G or a S-CB (bomber) you must close the avionics bay. Then if you go for the fighter you can keep it open but te gun ammunition compartment will show trought on the back of it. This is WRONG :bandhead2:/> since F-104S-fighters had no gun and a fuel tank replaced the ammunition box. It is incredible they made such a mistake since they had the opportunity to check the very same airframe used by DACO to produce the parts specific for the Italian variants! Edited November 28, 2013 by Paolo Maglio Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Paolo Maglio Posted November 28, 2013 Share Posted November 28, 2013 Hi Paolo, I really hope the sidewinder (at least) in the kit are good (I would have no other choice). OK for closing the gun mouth and the gun door (I already knew), but where is located the "the ejection port for fired ammunition" you said? (I had missed this particular) Thanks again! Luca Looking at the sprue the Sidewinders are just a bit too thin, a matter of microns in scale, don't worry. The ejection port is the hole showed here in one Hasegawa kit: Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tomcatfreak Posted November 28, 2013 Share Posted November 28, 2013 Kormorans anyone? I have the main body and fins mocked up. The pylon hasn't been started yet. It hasn't been a big priority. But maybe now, I could get motivated. Hi Harold, Kormoran missles would be very appreciated in 1/32 PLEASE Quote Link to post Share on other sites
onosendai Posted November 28, 2013 Share Posted November 28, 2013 .....then soon there will be two Kormoran on sale....... because I'm going to make all or most the loads for the 104 Italeri..... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
CF104 Posted November 30, 2013 Share Posted November 30, 2013 Just a few more observations based on the sprue shots. 1. Nose wheel flat spot is too flat. Looks like they viewed a stored F-104 that needed it's tires inflated. 2. Main wheel/tires totally wrong. The A/B/C/D wheels are a very rough approximation of the real thing. The G/S wheels are even worse. The wheel is too small and the tire is too bulbous. 3. I can't believe how poorly the cockpit tub is done. Completely fictitious and the included photo etch is useless. 4. The J79-GE-11A nozzle is molded in the closed position. Totally wrong for an in service shut down J79-GE-11A. The nozzle should be fully open. Also the detail is pretty loose as well. 5. The J79-GE-19 nozzle is almost as bad. Has no real resemblance to the real thing. 6. Lots of fictitious rivets and miss shaped panels along with areas with absolutely no detail at all. There seems to be a total lack of any crisp detail or continuity to what they were doing. The external tanks appear to have some form of crispness to the molds but that's about it. At the minimum, one would require aftermaket to replace the wheels, cockpit, exhaust nozzle, M-61 gatling gun and decals. To have this in the same price bracket as the 1/32 Tamiya Spitfires, Mustangs, Corsair and F-16 is a real insult to the hobby. As much as I love the F-104, I can't justify the money on this half hearted attempt at bettering the Hasegawa F-104. I'm really hoping that the AFV 1/32 F-104 is done right. Cheers, John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andre Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 Available for 88 euro here: http://www.model-making.eu/products/Lockheed-F-104G-Starfighter-Super-Decals.html HTH, Andre Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MoFo Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 Just a few more observations based on the sprue shots. 1. Nose wheel flat spot is too flat. Looks like they viewed a stored F-104 that needed it's tires inflated. 2. Main wheel/tires totally wrong. The A/B/C/D wheels are a very rough approximation of the real thing. The G/S wheels are even worse. The wheel is too small and the tire is too bulbous. 3. I can't believe how poorly the cockpit tub is done. Completely fictitious and the included photo etch is useless. 4. The J79-GE-11A nozzle is molded in the closed position. Totally wrong for an in service shut down J79-GE-11A. The nozzle should be fully open. Also the detail is pretty loose as well. 5. The J79-GE-19 nozzle is almost as bad. Has no real resemblance to the real thing. 6. Lots of fictitious rivets and miss shaped panels along with areas with absolutely no detail at all. There seems to be a total lack of any crisp detail or continuity to what they were doing. The external tanks appear to have some form of crispness to the molds but that's about it. At the minimum, one would require aftermaket to replace the wheels, cockpit, exhaust nozzle, M-61 gatling gun and decals. To have this in the same price bracket as the 1/32 Tamiya Spitfires, Mustangs, Corsair and F-16 is a real insult to the hobby. As much as I love the F-104, I can't justify the money on this half hearted attempt at bettering the Hasegawa F-104. I'm really hoping that the AFV 1/32 F-104 is done right. Cheers, John B-b-b-but... it comes with a book! AND PE. ;) (yeah, at a $50 retail? Maybe. $120+? Ha!) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
CF104 Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 B-b-b-but... it comes with a book! AND PE. ;)/>/> (yeah, at a $50 retail? Maybe. $120+? Ha!) Exactly! Sure pales in comparison to the new GWH 1:48 F-15B/D release. Which I will more than likely buy. Ciao Italeri! John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
randypandy831 Posted December 3, 2013 Share Posted December 3, 2013 thanks for the insight CF-104. your info made me steer clear. it's 2013 and companies still slack. I'm no manned missile expert but hows the hasegawa kit stack up? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Paolo Maglio Posted December 3, 2013 Share Posted December 3, 2013 1. Nose wheel flat spot is too flat. John more than this? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dave Williams Posted December 3, 2013 Share Posted December 3, 2013 Speaking of belly missiles, did the Italian F-104G (not 104S) CI models ever use the belly catamaran launcher as used on many European F-104s? I'm asking about the catamaran launcher that attached to the mount where the centerline pylon went, not the individual BL22 pylons as shown in the picture above. If so, did they use the Aero 3B rails like most other European F-104s, or did they use Red Dog type rails as shown above (and as used by Japan). TIA. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Paolo Maglio Posted December 3, 2013 Share Posted December 3, 2013 Speaking of belly missiles, did the Italian F-104G (not 104S) CI models ever use the belly catamaran launcher as used on many European F-104s? I'm asking about the catamaran launcher that attached to the mount where the centerline pylon went, not the individual BL22 pylons as shown in the picture above. If so, did they use the Aero 3B rails like most other European F-104s, or did they use Red Dog type rails as shown above (and as used by Japan). TIA. No, Italian F-104G inteceptors only used Red Dog Launchers and only at the wing tips. When the two missiles were on, they used to fly without any auxiliary fuel tanks and without any pylon! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RiderFan Posted December 3, 2013 Share Posted December 3, 2013 more than this? [snip] Maybe Italian aircraft were equipped with different forward tires. Could also be the result of fuel or weapons loads. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Finn Posted December 3, 2013 Share Posted December 3, 2013 When the fuel is low the nose wheel oleo is more extended. I've sat under many CF-104s unloading the spent ammo and felt the airframe getting lower when they were refueling. Jari Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Brad-M Posted December 3, 2013 Share Posted December 3, 2013 Thanks John for this posting. You helped me make my mind up. Cheers Brad Just a few more observations based on the sprue shots. 1. Nose wheel flat spot is too flat. Looks like they viewed a stored F-104 that needed it's tires inflated. 2. Main wheel/tires totally wrong. The A/B/C/D wheels are a very rough approximation of the real thing. The G/S wheels are even worse. The wheel is too small and the tire is too bulbous. 3. I can't believe how poorly the cockpit tub is done. Completely fictitious and the included photo etch is useless. 4. The J79-GE-11A nozzle is molded in the closed position. Totally wrong for an in service shut down J79-GE-11A. The nozzle should be fully open. Also the detail is pretty loose as well. 5. The J79-GE-19 nozzle is almost as bad. Has no real resemblance to the real thing. 6. Lots of fictitious rivets and miss shaped panels along with areas with absolutely no detail at all. There seems to be a total lack of any crisp detail or continuity to what they were doing. The external tanks appear to have some form of crispness to the molds but that's about it. At the minimum, one would require aftermaket to replace the wheels, cockpit, exhaust nozzle, M-61 gatling gun and decals. To have this in the same price bracket as the 1/32 Tamiya Spitfires, Mustangs, Corsair and F-16 is a real insult to the hobby. As much as I love the F-104, I can't justify the money on this half hearted attempt at bettering the Hasegawa F-104. I'm really hoping that the AFV 1/32 F-104 is done right. Cheers, John Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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