The Book Thread

[11bee]

11 Days of Christmas is outstanding. Greatly overlooked aspect of the airwar over Vietnam. Some of those B-52 crews were close to mutiny.

Ditto for Low Level Hell. Read the book when I was a kid, Mills was one of the reasons I opted to join the army. Would make a great movie IMO.

[Don]

Ditto for Low Level Hell...Would make a great movie IMO.

Agreed. It would make for an interesting and enlightening movie. My only worry would be Hollywood finding some way of fouling the whole thing up as they more often then not do.

[Antoine]

I read Revolt of The Majors by Michel III and utterly loved it. It's available FREE online and is superb.

Thanks a lot, I did really appreciate the two previous books written by Michel.

Currently (and slowly) reading this one.

A melting pot of souvenirs from various IRIAF pilot during the Gulf War.

Good read so far.

Then, I'll choose one of those two:

[airmechaja]

"Wings of Fury": From Viet Nam to the Gulf War. Very good read about US fighter pilots in the Navy,Marines and Air Force.

[TaiidanTomcat]

"Wings of Fury": From Viet Nam to the Gulf War. Very good read about US fighter pilots in the Navy,Marines and Air Force.

I read that and aces high from the same author... his vietnam top gun one as well. Boy that was a long time ago!

[RKic]

Agreed. It would make for an interesting and enlightening movie. My only worry would be Hollywood finding some way of fouling the whole thing up as they more often then not do.

:cheers:/>

I really enjoyed that one too. I can see Hollywood really crapping the bed with those memoirs. They'd have to add a love interest, a loose-cannon type who comes around in the end, a fun sidekick who dies 3/4 of the way in (following recent trends, this would likely be the only black guy in the movie), and a soundtrack with more CCR than you can shake a stick at.

Back to the topic at hand, I'm currently reading "The General in His Labyrinth" by Gabriel Garcia Marquez (on of my all-time favorite authors). Not an airplane book, but a really enchanting novel about the last days of Simon Bolivar. Its a haunting and sometimes painful read about aging, and how life can really beat a man to the ground, because the universe doesn't (and can't) care about you, no matter who you are.

[Ishthe47guy]

Just finished Low Level Hell by Hugh Mills. It's about scout helicopter pilots in Vietnam and was it ever a great read. Top notch in the cockpit type stuff down in the weeds scouting for signs of the VC and NVA. Highly recommended!

Just started To The Limit by Tom Johnson. It's a book about Huey 'Slick' drivers in Vietnam and so far its really good in the early stages of the read.

on Deck:

Apache by Ed Macy.

:cheers:/>

Being the former rotorhead that I am, I'll have to pick those up. I just started reading "Guts n Gunships", by Mark Garrison about flying Huey slicks and gunships during the late 60's era of the conflict.

[Don]

Halfway through this book:

Buckets of photographs, including then and now shots of places where period photos were taken and what those areas look like now. Some discussion on "Tiger Phobia" or "Tiger Fever" where allied tankers began seeing Tigers behind every bush and around every corner when in fact there were so few Tigers in Normandy. A discussion on Michael Wittmann with new details on his operations in Normandy and new evidence on his death. In all if you like Tiger's, photographs of Tiger's, studying Normandy, or World War II tanks you will like this one.

[Slartibartfast]

And these two are in the queue:

Chassis Design - Principles and Analysis -- Based on previously unpublished technical notes by Maurice Olley by William F. Milliken

Naval Fighters Number 101 Grumman S2F/S-2 Tracker -- Part One Development, Testing, Variants, and Foreign Users by Robert J. Kowalski and Tommy Thomason

Read the Tracker book last month and finished the Chassis book last night (actually 05:00 this morning). This quote from the book sums it up: "Now I'm confused at a more sophisticated level."

Gotta hit Amazon again.

[Rob de Bie]

Read the Tracker book last month and finished the Chassis book last night (actually 05:00 this morning). This quote from the book sums it up: "Now I'm confused at a more sophisticated level."

Slartibartfast, I'm intrigued by 'Chassis Design - Principles and Analysis' that you read. Because of the subtitle ('Based on previously unpublished technical notes by Maurice Olley') it sounds like dated knowledge. However, William F. Milliken also wrote 'Race Car Vehicle Dynamics' which I thought was a more than excellent book when I read it 15-20 years ago. And then there's a the old problem of what a chassis is, just the 'frame' or frame plus suspension. I'm doing some development work on Lotus 7 types frame, increasing torsional stiffness greatly. Would your book be useful for that?

Interestingly, it wasn't until I built a 1/10 model of such a chassis that I saw the possibilities:

More here: Scratchbuilt 1/10 scale Locost chassis

Rob

Edited June 13, 2016 by Rob de Bie

[Slartibartfast]

Olley's work is like Charles Fayette Taylor's on automotive combustion -- the basis on which everything else is built. Olley's book has a lot of math, specifically trigonometry and calculus. It it would be useful if you can do that math because you can then prove the validity of the mods you wish to make. The Millikens spent more than twenty years working with Olley as part of a joint venture between GM and Cornell Aero Lab and were the best choice for compiling Olley's monographs into a book. Several times Race Car Vehicle Dynamics was mentioned as a place to go to see elaborations of some points Olley made.

I haven't acquired Milliken's book yet so I can't advise if Olley's book is fundamentally different enough to warrant its purchase.

Does Milliken note how the roll axis is usually incline on street cars? How roll axis height vs CG height affects roll rates? Flat ride? Neutral steering point? How to design for anti-dive and anti-squat and how that affects shimmy and caster wobble and tramp and wheel hop?

Yes, Olley's work stops at about 1960 but he describes how automotive art became more like automotive science.

Hope this helps.

Edited June 13, 2016 by Slartibartfast

[fulcrum1]

I'm listening to the Dark Tower Series by Stephen King on audible and so far enjoy it....makes long dull runs not so dull.

[chomper]

Warpath Across the Pacific was one that I had a hard time putting down Another is High Noon over Haseluenne.

[Rob de Bie]

Olley's work is like Charles Fayette Taylor's on automotive combustion -- the basis on which everything else is built. Olley's book has a lot of math, specifically trigonometry and calculus. It it would be useful if you can do that math because you can then prove the validity of the mods you wish to make. The Millikens spent more than twenty years working with Olley as part of a joint venture between GM and Cornell Aero Lab and were the best choice for compiling Olley's monographs into a book. Several times Race Car Vehicle Dynamics was mentioned as a place to go to see elaborations of some points Olley made.

I haven't acquired Milliken's book yet so I can't advise if Olley's book is fundamentally different enough to warrant its purchase.

Does Milliken note how the roll axis is usually incline on street cars? How roll axis height vs CG height affects roll rates? Flat ride? Neutral steering point? How to design for anti-dive and anti-squat and how that affects shimmy and caster wobble and tramp and wheel hop?

Yes, Olley's work stops at about 1960 but he describes how automotive art became more like automotive science.

Hope this helps.

Slartibartfast, thanks for your comments on 'Chassis Design - Principles and Analysis'. I noted it down for future purchasing. It's 15-20 years ago that I read 'Race Car Vehicle Dynamics', and I don't recollect whether it touches the subjects you mention. I did not read it front to back - it's way too much to absorb for someone with a casual interest. But I do remember being very impressed with the overall approach. Maybe I'll get it again from the library for a second look.

Rob

[Slartibartfast]

Rob,

I too am a casual reader. However, I have done a little roadracing and tend to modify all the vehicles I own. Looking into replacing the suspension on my G37 and a vendor introduced me to concept of flat ride and Olley, so I bought the book. As for torsional rigidity, Olley's book won't help you. In all his work he assumes the body/frame is rigid though he acknowledges the assumption.

Chassis Engineering - Chassis Design, Building & Tuning for High Performance Handling by Herb Adams talks about frame stiffness. Adams was the Lead suspension guy for Pontiac in charge of the F-body (Firebird). I suspect you would benefit from information on materials (strength in shear and tension) and how to construct load paths, assuming you don't already have this background.

[Rob de Bie]

I too am a casual reader. However, I have done a little roadracing and tend to modify all the vehicles I own. Looking into replacing the suspension on my G37 and a vendor introduced me to concept of flat ride and Olley, so I bought the book. As for torsional rigidity, Olley's book won't help you. In all his work he assumes the body/frame is rigid though he acknowledges the assumption.

Thanks for checking the assumption of a rigid chassis, the effect of torsional rigidity is my main interest. I would love to know (for example) how much the road holding of a Lotus 7 would improve if you could increase the torsional stiffness from 1,000-2,000 Nm/deg (which is really low) to the tenfold value.

Modifying your own vehicle sounds really great, but that's a bridge too far for me :-)

Chassis Engineering - Chassis Design, Building & Tuning for High Performance Handling by Herb Adams talks about frame stiffness. Adams was the Lead suspension guy for Pontiac in charge of the F-body (Firebird). I suspect you would benefit from information on materials (strength in shear and tension) and how to construct load paths, assuming you don't already have this background.

That's a book I have. It's nice, with some scale models demonstrating deformations, but it's too casual, and only one chapter covers the 'frame'. 'The race car chassis' by Forbes Aird is much better, but still I'm looking for a lot more! But maybe it isn't out there.

Rob

[Slartibartfast]

The books most likely exist but would require you to enroll in vehicle design courses and become a member of the SAE.

[ChesshireCat]

I read Richard III by William Shakespeare. It's about Richard III (but you probably knew that).

I actually have a copy laying on the coffee table waiting for me to read it.

gary

[ChesshireCat]

Got this for x-mas:

Wings of the Luftwaffe - Flying the Captured German Aircraft of WW2 by Capt Eric Brown, RN

This guy flew more WW2 German aircraft than any other allied pilot. Very interesting to read his analysis of what it was like to fly a large number of Luftwaffe aircraft.

Also on my x-mas list:

The Good Soldiers by David Finkel

This guy was assigned to an Army infantry unit in Iraq during the worst phase of the war, at the beginning of "the surge". A very good read, although somewhat depressing. Definitely NOT an "oohrah" type of book but worth the time nonetheless. Best Book of the Year award by the NY Times and many others.

I read his book over the winter, and wasn't slightly impressed. Usual expected slant. On the other hand I read Alfred Price's book on the FW190 series. A very good read with an interview of Kurt Tank. Still Brown's book is OK, but must be taken lightly

gary

[ChesshireCat]

Awhile back I finished reading "The Glenn Miller Conspiracy." Read it with some doubt, but took what they wrote and started digging. This has lead me to Otto Skorzeny and a couple other books. All this has lead me to "The Winking Fox" by Defourneaux. That book takes to Ho Chi Mein.

Prior to the above I read "The War Diary of Hauptman Helmet Lipfert." Highly recommended! Also clashes with a lot of crap we've heard for the last seventy years. Also read "Hunting Hitler." Much different than the TV show; yet parallels it. This book takes you back over to Skorzeny, but also brings into light a couple sinister politicians from that era.

Read Bill OReilly's Killing Lincoln and Kennedy. Plus the Last Days of Lincoln. The first two are fairly good, and he's the first person to point out that there were errors in the investigation of the Lincoln assassination. The third book is a joke.

Gary

[11bee]

I read his book over the winter, and wasn't slightly impressed. Usual expected slant.

gary

Re- The Good Soldiers, I know three guys that were in Iraq at this time (grunts, not rear echelon troops). All three said this book nailed it. According to them, the general consensus amongst the troops was "WTF are we doing here, getting blown up every day, in the middle of a civil war where both sides hate us". They said morale was pretty bad.

This book seems to accurately reflect this. It also doesn't cut corners when discussing details about US casualties.

You want an "oohrah" book? Read something about SEALS.

[ChesshireCat]

Re- The Good Soldiers, I know three guys that were in Iraq at this time (grunts, not rear echelon troops). All three said this book nailed it. According to them, the general consensus amongst the troops was "WTF are we doing here, getting blown up every day, in the middle of a civil war where both sides hate us". They said morale was pretty bad.

This book seems to accurately reflect this. It also doesn't cut corners when discussing details about US casualties.

You want an "oohrah" book? Read something about SEALS.

I was not referring to Good Soldiers. I've heard that was an outstanding book. My comments were towards Brown's book on flying captured aircraft.

gary

[11bee]

I was not referring to Good Soldiers. I've heard that was an outstanding book. My comments were towards Brown's book on flying captured aircraft.

gary

My bad, thought you were referring to Good Soldiers.

You really didn't like Brown's book? In some quarters, he has close to God-like status. I'm in no position to pass judgement on his summaries of those aircraft but he seems pretty well respected by most folk.

Edited June 15, 2016 by 11bee

[ChesshireCat]

My bad, thought you were referring to Good Soldiers.

You really didn't like Brown's book? In some quarters, he has close to God-like status. I'm in no position to pass judgement on his summaries of those aircraft but he seems pretty well respected by most folk.

Just read better stuff, plus I used to have an eye witness to the testing done over here. Also had access to the government fish tape, and there was a lot of stuff on it (I don't think they ever delete anything). I wish somebody would publish it, as it would be a Malox moment beyond belief.

gary

[TaiidanTomcat]

I'm listening to the Dark Tower Series by Stephen King on audible and so far enjoy it....makes long dull runs not so dull.

Ive never been able to do that, It has to be music for me.