vince14 Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 (edited) Here is my Guess. I think one of the pilots wanted to commit suicide. He takes off Kills the other pilot. Turns off transponder, 10 minutes later forget there is second part to turn off. continues to fly normal and at same altitude.... does so for about 4-5 more hours... that time plus the hour to start is roughly ho long it take to fly to beijing BTW... Tell crew and passangers they have been cleared to desend into Beijing, continues to act normal and everyone expects they are getting ready to land, by the time they realize they are not going there it is too late..... that would answer why there was not Mayday, no cell usage.... by the time they got that far out, no cell would have service..... Everything I see leads to pilot..... Not a Conpiracy theory, just what I think.... Could be WAY off, but...... J The problem with that theory is - why would a suicidal pilot fly around for 4-5 hours before crashing? If you're going to do that, I'd assume you'd have some sort of 9/11 style attack planned. Otherwise you'd just make sure Pilot 2 couldn't interfere, push up the throttles and point the aircraft at the sea a la SilkAir 185 or EgyptAir 990. The other theory I've seen gaining momentum is that this is some sort of hostage situation, and doesn't hold water either. If you're going to hijack a 777 and kidnap 239 people, right now you'd be telling the world's media that you're such a badass, and how you'll start offing passengers if your demands are not met. Vince Edited March 14, 2014 by vince14 Link to post Share on other sites
shadoweng Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 I have no idea, Very good point.... another odd point i find is that the "pings" dont show it going very far in terms of miles.... 5 hours would get to Beijing, but it looks to be about 2 hours from KL.... Maybe it wasnt suicide, but a possible hijack and that was a way to guarentee a greater likelyhood of success..... This whole thing is very perplexing... I am also not completly convinced that Malaysia DOESNT know where it is... they are changing their story constantly... Link to post Share on other sites
Jennings Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 I think they had a big mirror to reflect their ACARS pings backward, and they were flying east, not west. They landed on an uncharted island (after a... three hour tour...) and are now setting up a utopian paradise. My scenario is just as likely as some of the crap that's been foisted off as "news" right now. It just KILLS the media that they essentially know nothing. Link to post Share on other sites
shadoweng Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 The problem with that theory is - why would a suicidal pilot fly around for 4-5 hours before crashing? If you're going to do that, I'd assume you'd have some sort of 9/11 style attack planned. Otherwise you'd just make sure Pilot 2 couldn't interfere, push up the throttles and point the aircraft at the sea a la SilkAir 185 or EgyptAir 990. The other theory I've seen gaining momentum is that this is some sort of hostage situation, and doesn't hold water either. If you're going to hijack a 777 and kidnap 239 people, right now you'd be telling the world's media that you're such a badass, and how you'll start offing passengers if your demands are not met. Vince Could they be keeping the plane and pax for a later part use? Hijack the plane.... land.... hold crew and pax, rig and load it with Chem weapons or god forbid a Nuke device, refuel and do SOMETHING REALLY BAD!! Link to post Share on other sites
shadoweng Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 That is a good theory Jennings!!!! LOVE it Link to post Share on other sites
Rank11 Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 The other theory I've seen gaining momentum is that this is some sort of hostage situation, and doesn't hold water either. If you're going to hijack a 777 and kidnap 239 people, right now you'd be telling the world's media that you're such a badass, and how you'll start offing passengers if your demands are not met. Vince What if all they wanted was money? Would you need to or even want everybody to know who you are or where you are if all you wanted was somebody to wire you a bazillion dollars to a swiss bank account? And if you were somebody being extorted or a government that has the means to rescue any hostages, would you want the hostage takers to know that you know where they are hiding? Link to post Share on other sites
11bee Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 From CNN: BREAKING NEWS: THE SEARCH FOR FLIGHT 370 Missing plane: Could it have landed? Well, I'm going to go way out on a very long limb and state for an absolute fact that the airplane has, in fact, landed. I don't think it's still flying around a week plus later. If your definition of "landed" is hitting a hard surface at a high rate of speed, I'd say this headline is probably correct. The longer this goes on, the crazier the press is going to get. I'm surprised we are not seeing more evil government conspiracies / UFO abduction stories. Link to post Share on other sites
shadoweng Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 If it is ransom related, Why would you wait? I guess maybe wait until the search dies down, so there arent as many assets around to come look for you then... Link to post Share on other sites
RCAFFAN Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 Heading towards Africa? The Somali pirates are expanding their business.....Just a theory as likely as all the others....If it was a mass kidnapping wouldn't we have heard demands by now? Crash somewhere still seems most likely unfortunately.... Link to post Share on other sites
JackMan Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 If it is ransom related, Why would you wait? I guess maybe wait until the search dies down, so there arent as many assets around to come look for you then... Maybe it isn't for ransom but for the cargo in the plane. We don't know what it was carrying...or who it was intended for. Link to post Share on other sites
shadoweng Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 Maybe it isn't for ransom but for the cargo in the plane. We don't know what it was carrying...or who it was intended for. Hey no that is very interesting........ Could it have been an eloborite heist? Link to post Share on other sites
Rank11 Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 If it is ransom related, Why would you wait? I guess maybe wait until the search dies down, so there arent as many assets around to come look for you then... Ransom demands do not necessarily have to be made in public. Link to post Share on other sites
shadoweng Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 True, very true! Link to post Share on other sites
Bigasshammm Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 (edited) I could see this as someone wanting the plane and everyone on board is collateral damage. There's definitely no hostage situation I can see coming out of this. If that plane did land intact there's probably no good outcome for those on board. Edited March 14, 2014 by Bigasshammm Link to post Share on other sites
Helidriver Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 I could see this as someone wanting the plane and everyone on board is collateral damage. There's definitely no hostage situation I can see coming out of this. If that plane did land intact there's probably no good outcome for those on board. That's what I'm afraid of as well. The way it is looking, and as horrid as it might sound, I think the passengers on board, the relatives left behind as well as the world in general would be better off with the plane in a thousand pieces in the South Vietnam jungle.(Or any other location...) The alternatives are just too horrible to contemplate to be honest. If that plane was hijacked and landed somewhere...the chances that those pax and crew met or will meet a comfortable end is nonexistent. If the 777 is filled with a dirty bomb or its like and flown somewhere within range....like middle east, Australia...China...the outcome will make 9/11 look like a flash in a pan, and the world will forever be changed. With the US bankrupt, and with a populace that wouldn't support another war in a far off land, even if it could be afforded, who would take up the baton as the world's police? China? Russia? Who would stand to gain? Who could use this as a stepping stone to superpower? In danger of making this sound like a Tom Clancy novel, IF this plane is resting hidden away on some island, or remote airfield, I doubt it was brought there by "common" terrorists. There would have been chatter online, some bad home video demanding something...release of Guantanamo's "guests" or something of its like. No, if this is an act of hijacking...it is way higher than an act of terrorism. This might be the beginning of something we can't even contemplate. So, I for one hope that the plane is found in a million pieces somewhere. Meaning the crew and passengers died reasonably quick and painless, the relatives get closure and the world gets to go on it's already screwed up way. Or...maybe...just maybe...there is now a plane wreck on some uncharted island somewhere. And just off the beach some of the passengers are wondering what the big hatch in the sand leads to.... Link to post Share on other sites
vince14 Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 What if all they wanted was money? Would you need to or even want everybody to know who you are or where you are if all you wanted was somebody to wire you a bazillion dollars to a swiss bank account? And if you were somebody being extorted or a government that has the means to rescue any hostages, would you want the hostage takers to know that you know where they are hiding? You wouldn't want anyone to know who you were, unless you were terrorists, but you'd sure as hell want people to know you'd taken them hostage. Sure, you could say they have been taken hostage and all the governments are covering it up*, but wouldn't you, as the hostage taker, want the public to know you're holding 239 people to ransom? The public and media would put pressure on the authorities to do a deal with you, especially if all you wanted was cash. Vince *Governments are not very good at covering things up. Link to post Share on other sites
vince14 Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 That's what I'm afraid of as well. The way it is looking, and as horrid as it might sound, I think the passengers on board, the relatives left behind as well as the world in general would be better off with the plane in a thousand pieces in the South Vietnam jungle.(Or any other location...) The alternatives are just too horrible to contemplate to be honest. If that plane was hijacked and landed somewhere...the chances that those pax and crew met or will meet a comfortable end is nonexistent. If the 777 is filled with a dirty bomb or its like and flown somewhere within range....like middle east, Australia...China...the outcome will make 9/11 look like a flash in a pan, and the world will forever be changed. With the US bankrupt, and with a populace that wouldn't support another war in a far off land, even if it could be afforded, who would take up the baton as the world's police? China? Russia? Who would stand to gain? Who could use this as a stepping stone to superpower? In danger of making this sound like a Tom Clancy novel, IF this plane is resting hidden away on some island, or remote airfield, I doubt it was brought there by "common" terrorists. There would have been chatter online, some bad home video demanding something...release of Guantanamo's "guests" or something of its like. No, if this is an act of hijacking...it is way higher than an act of terrorism. This might be the beginning of something we can't even contemplate. So, I for one hope that the plane is found in a million pieces somewhere. Meaning the crew and passengers died reasonably quick and painless, the relatives get closure and the world gets to go on it's already screwed up way. Or...maybe...just maybe...there is now a plane wreck on some uncharted island somewhere. And just off the beach some of the passengers are wondering what the big hatch in the sand leads to.... I think it'd be easier to buy an old airliner and convert it to your needs, rather than hijack one and have to deal with over 200 hostages. Even if you killed them all, you'd still have to dispose of the bodies somehow. Remember back in 2003, when a 727 was stolen from Angola? That'd be an easier option than hijacking a flight. Vince Link to post Share on other sites
vince14 Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 Of course, it could be similar to Helios 522 - a lack of oxygen, pilots confused and possibly changing systems without realising what they're doing, heck maybe even a Flight Attendant getting into the cockpit and trying to fly the thing before they are overcome and the aircraft follows its last heading until it runs out of fuel and crashes. Vince Link to post Share on other sites
Rank11 Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 Before we go any further with the speculation, I just want to make sure of one thing. Is that a cat in a shark outfit riding a roomba and a baby duck walking towards the camera? And if so, why? Link to post Share on other sites
FM-Whip Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 The timing of the course change/transponder shut-down was perfect, the 777 was leaving one controlled zone and entering another, it would take time for the second zone to realize they were missing an aircraft. The first was tracking the aircraft from take-off, so they were watching it's progress. I bet it didn't check in with the new controller. The problem with that is the controller handling a flight initiates the sector change (what is called a "handoff") with the controller who owns the next sector over, i.e. the receiving controller. The receiving controller IDs the aircraft before assuming control. The handoff is initiated and required to be complete PRIOR to the aircraft entering the receiving sector. The handoff is considered complete from the transferring controller's viewpoint if the receiving controller tells them they have "radar contact". At that point the transferring controller calls the aircraft and has them switch frequencies to call the receiving controller. If the aircraft does not check in with the receiving controller that controller would call the transferring controller back and ask what is up since they have no communications with the aircraft and at that point the aircraft is probably now entering their airspace, i.e. you have a possible NORDO aircraft and a "situation". If everything is working properly it should not be possible for an aircraft to disappear just at handoff due to the receiving jurisdiction failing to notice it. The handoff coordination works both ways. If the sector controllers are sitting next to each other in the same ATC facility they can use a finger (or automation) to point to a specific aircraft on a display to do the handoff between sectors. John Hairell (tpn18@yahoo.com) Link to post Share on other sites
Rank11 Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 (edited) The problem with that is the controller handling a flight initiates the sector change (what is called a "handoff") with the controller who owns the next sector over, i.e. the receiving controller. The receiving controller IDs the aircraft before assuming control. The handoff is initiated and required to be complete PRIOR to the aircraft entering the receiving sector. The handoff is considered complete from the transferring controller's viewpoint if the receiving controller tells them they have "radar contact". At that point the transferring controller calls the aircraft and has them switch frequencies to call the receiving controller. If the aircraft does not check in with the receiving controller that controller would call the transferring controller back and ask what is up since they have no communications with the aircraft and at that point the aircraft is probably now entering their airspace, i.e. you have a possible NORDO aircraft and a "situation". If everything is working properly it should not be possible for an aircraft to disappear just at handoff due to the receiving jurisdiction failing to notice it. The handoff coordination works both ways. If the sector controllers are sitting next to each other in the same ATC facility they can use a finger (or automation) to point to a specific aircraft on a display to do the handoff between sectors. John Hairell (tpn18@yahoo.com) That all sounds like how a typical handoff is done here in the US amongst different controllers in a nice radar environment over land. However, they were an international oceanic flight transiting FIR boundaries. How positive is such a handoff? I know that I have to follow the instructions on the enroute charts that tell me to call the approaching control area on a second radio while some distance from the boundary and advise them of my impending entry into their airspace. When I exit the limits of the control area that I am talking to, the controller terminates service. I am sure there is some form of coordination since each control area seems to know who I am and have a squawk code ready, but how soon would somebody actually begin to miss me if I don't establish contact with the next country after I've been terminated by the country I am exiting? Edited March 15, 2014 by Rank11 Link to post Share on other sites
Scooby Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 That all sounds like how a typical handoff is done here in the US amongst different controllers in a nice radar environment over land. However, they were an international oceanic flight transiting FIR boundaries. How positive is such a handoff? I know that I have to follow the instructions on the enroute charts that tell me to call the approaching control area on a second radio while some distance from the boundary and advise them of my impending entry into their airspace. When I exit the limits of the control area that I am talking to, the controller terminates service. I am sure there is some form of coordination since each control area seems to know who I am and have a squawk code ready, but how soon would somebody actually begin to miss me if I don't establish contact with the next country after I've been terminated by the country I am exiting? Correct, it is not the same positive handoff. It is even reported that most the active radars in that area of the world are turned off at night. So that is an example of another procedure that is not typical in the rest of the world, Link to post Share on other sites
Scooby Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 I feel this is still a suicide and the reason the aircraft flew five hours, is the person responsible didn't want any evidence found to link him to the crime and shame his family. Regardless, this was well planned out. The problem I have with this theory is the ELTs would still transmit a signal that would be detected. The biggest part that puzzles to me is why the ELTs didn't transmit on impact (there are two on the 777, one in the nose and one in the tail). You don't pull a cb to turn off an ELT. A UAB signal not being detected, I can understand that. Link to post Share on other sites
shadoweng Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 I feel this is still a suicide and the reason the aircraft flew five hours, is the person responsible didn't want any evidence found to link him to the crime and shame his family. Regardless, this was well planned out. The problem I have with this theory is the ELTs would still transmit a signal that would be detected. The biggest part that puzzles to me is why the ELTs didn't transmit on impact (there are two on the 777, one in the nose and one in the tail). You don't pull a cb to turn off an ELT. A UAB signal not being detected, I can understand that. But you could remove the batteries...... That would mean he needed help..... I am impressed how well thought out these responses have been. :) Link to post Share on other sites
Devilleader501 Posted March 15, 2014 Share Posted March 15, 2014 But you could remove the batteries...... That would mean he needed help..... I am impressed how well thought out these responses have been. :)/> Lol I was thinking the same thing. Link to post Share on other sites
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