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Malaysian airlines plane missing


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Just keeps getting more strange. If it crashed where they think it did I would think something would have been found by now. They are saying it had something like 7.5 hours of fuel on board. How far could it have flown with that much fuel?

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Just keeps getting more strange. If it crashed where they think it did I would think something would have been found by now. They are saying it had something like 7.5 hours of fuel on board. How far could it have flown with that much fuel?

Straits of Malacca are some of the busiest shipping lanes on the planet. You would think that if it went down in that area, somebody would have seen debris / fuel slick.

Nothing makes sense. If it was a case of pilot suicide, why fly low for hundreds of miles (assuming again that those reports are factual). If it was a hijacking (or even a 9/11 type suicide mission), the aircraft would have shown up somewhere.

This has to be torture for the families. Especially with no confirmed crash site, they could be thinking there is a tiny chance that the plane actually landed at some remote airport and their loved one(s) might still be alive.

Edited by 11bee
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There are so many conflicting reports, discrepancies, and withholding of information from the various government agencies, I'm not surprised that China and the relatives of the victims are starting to get frustrated towards the Malaysian authorities on the perceived lack of urgency towards the search operation.

Why did it take so long for the Air Force to share the information that the plane could have been flying in the opposite direction? Precious days and hours could have been lost because the SAR teams could have been searching in the wrong area.

The last thing that the relatives of the victims need to hear right now are more cryptic statements from the authorities like: "There are some things that I can tell you and some things that I can't." That doesn't help things one bit.

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The problem i have if the plane had turned around, flew in the other direction and was tracked by Air Force radar, shouldn’t they have ID’d it? If the transponder was off how did they know who it was and shouldn’t they have either tried to contact an unknown a/c crossing the county or least launch somebody to have a look at it. Does Malaysia have a QRA with aircraft on alert?

Jari

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The problem i have if the plane had turned around, flew in the other direction and was tracked by Air Force radar, shouldn’t they have ID’d it? If the transponder was off how did they know who it was and shouldn’t they have either tried to contact an unknown a/c crossing the county or least launch somebody to have a look at it. Does Malaysia have a QRA with aircraft on alert?

Jari

You are assuming somebody is watching the radar. And even if they are watching that doesn't mean that they are "seeing". So you get this happening: the airliner turns off the transponder, makes a sharp turn, and drops to a low altitude. Later it's missing. Nobody knows where it is. Authorities start to look at civilian radar tapes and interview controllers but nothing of value is found. Authorities then start to look at military radar tapes, but there's nothing much there because the aircraft dropped to low altitude. So you've got to look through a bunch of clutter to find what you are looking for, assuming you even know where to start. And that's assuming that there are radar tapes.

I can see where several days would elapse as people are going through this process. Add bureaucratic delays....

John Hairell (tpn18@yahoo.com)

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You are assuming somebody is watching the radar. And even if they are watching that doesn't mean that they are "seeing". So you get this happening: the airliner turns off the transponder, makes a sharp turn, and drops to a low altitude. Later it's missing. Nobody knows where it is. Authorities start to look at civilian radar tapes and interview controllers but nothing of value is found. Authorities then start to look at military radar tapes, but there's nothing much there because the aircraft dropped to low altitude. So you've got to look through a bunch of clutter to find what you are looking for, assuming you even know where to start. And that's assuming that there are radar tapes.

I can see where several days would elapse as people are going through this process. Add bureaucratic delays....

John Hairell (tpn18@yahoo.com)

The articles I've seen state that it only dropped from 35,000 down to 29,000 feet. Initially, it sounded like it was much lower.

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You are assuming somebody is watching the radar. And even if they are watching that doesn't mean that they are "seeing". So you get this happening: the airliner turns off the transponder, makes a sharp turn, and drops to a low altitude. Later it's missing. Nobody knows where it is. Authorities start to look at civilian radar tapes and interview controllers but nothing of value is found. Authorities then start to look at military radar tapes, but there's nothing much there because the aircraft dropped to low altitude. So you've got to look through a bunch of clutter to find what you are looking for, assuming you even know where to start. And that's assuming that there are radar tapes.

I can see where several days would elapse as people are going through this process. Add bureaucratic delays....

John Hairell (tpn18@yahoo.com)

Exactly, they are taking an educated guess by the cruise speed if that aircraft on the radar tapes is a 777.

Personally I think it was one of the pilots, the other likely went to the washroom or was incapacitated in some way (drugged his coffee?).

The timing of the course change/transponder shut-down was perfect, the 777 was leaving one controlled zone and entering another, it would take time for the second zone to realize they were missing an aircraft. The first was tracking the aircraft from take-off, so they were watching it's progress. I bet it didn't check in with the new controller.

The course turn was also away from the pervious patch and the intended path. In fact, it was likely the only direction they wouldn't look. Looks too well planned to me. I would only think that planning would have occurred in the cockpit. Hijackers would have had to gain access at the exact time to coordinate all of this.

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Exactly, they are taking an educated guess by the cruise speed if that aircraft on the radar tapes is a 777.

Personally I think it was one of the pilots, the other likely went to the washroom or was incapacitated in some way (drugged his coffee?).

The timing of the course change/transponder shut-down was perfect, the 777 was leaving one controlled zone and entering another, it would take time for the second zone to realize they were missing an aircraft. The first was tracking the aircraft from take-off, so they were watching it's progress. I bet it didn't check in with the new controller.

The course turn was also away from the pervious patch and the intended path. In fact, it was likely the only direction they wouldn't look. Looks too well planned to me. I would only think that planning would have occurred in the cockpit. Hijackers would have had to gain access at the exact time to coordinate all of this.

Again just pure speculation but - What would the point of all this be? If it's a case of pilot suicide, why go to the trouble of shutting down comms and reversing course? Just lock out / incapacitate the other guy(s) on the flight deck and push the stick forward.

If you are planning on doing some sort of 9/11 thing, we would have seen the plane impacting it's target. Unless we had a repeat of United 93, where the hijackers ended up being overpowered, causing the plane to go down.

And if the intent was to fly low to avoid radar contact, dropping from 35K to 29K isn't going to do much. It would be more telling if the plane descended to 10,000' feet or so. That could at least indicate loss of cabin pressure due to mechanical issues or something else.

Edited by 11bee
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Again just pure speculation but - What would the point of all this be? If it's a case of pilot suicide, why go to the trouble of shutting down comms and reversing course? Just lock out / incapacitate the other guy(s) on the flight deck and push the stick forward.

If you are planning on doing some sort of 9/11 thing, we would have seen the plane impacting it's target. Unless we had a repeat of United 93, where the hijackers ended up being overpowered, causing the plane to go down.

And if the intent was to fly low to avoid radar contact, dropping from 35K to 29K isn't going to do much. It would be more telling if the plane descended to 10,000' feet or so. That could at least indicate loss of cabin pressure due to mechanical issues or something else.

Wih the reported objects found on satellite today all theories are about to change yet again.

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Wih the reported objects found on satellite today all theories are about to change yet again.

Exactly - it's all speculation, including on my part. But let's say that whatever was found today close to Vietnam turns out to be parts from the missing aircraft - what was the supposed radar track showing on military radar to the west?

John Hairell (tpn18@yahoo.com)

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I will believe those latest satellite photos when they find the debris. The quality is so bad it could be anything in those pictures. Also it isn't very common to have an intact fragment from a plane crash that is 75 feet by 80 feet.

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I would bet that the release of information about the aircraft from different governments is being reviewed as to not let other governments know the radar capabilities. When the Korean 747 was shot down in the 80's by the Soviets, initially USAF survallence did not want to reveal all the information they had because fear of letting the Soviets know the capabilities of their tracking radar and how much information they could actually gather from listening post etc. I'm pretty sure something of this nature is probably going on. Fuzzy satellite pictures? I think it's common knowledge that satellites can read documents from space. Maybe that's why certain information is not being given out so quickly.

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I would bet that the release of information about the aircraft from different governments is being reviewed as to not let other governments know the radar capabilities. When the Korean 747 was shot down in the 80's by the Soviets, initially USAF survallence did not want to reveal all the information they had because fear of letting the Soviets know the capabilities of their tracking radar and how much information they could actually gather from listening post etc. I'm pretty sure something of this nature is probably going on. Fuzzy satellite pictures? I think it's common knowledge that satellites can read documents from space. Maybe that's why certain information is not being given out so quickly.

That was the Cold War though, I think things have change, at least in the western world.

I think the new info in regards to the ACARs is accurate, the aircraft did make the turn and flew a long time in that direction. The US is releasing that but Malaysia doesn't want to.

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That was the Cold War though, I think things have change, at least in the western world.

Not to suggest what he was saying about holding back so as not let on about technology is the reason or not...but I'd like to point out something in response to this. You do recall just very recently it was discovered that the NSA was essentially spying on not only would be foes but on supposed allies? May not be called a cold war anymore but I'd be willing to bet the secrets are still there...western world or elsewhere.

Interesting theories are coming up over this. Maybe we'll never know.

Bill

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Reuters is now reporting that military radar might have tracked the 777 heading towards the Anderman and Nicobar Islands, and it looks like it was deliberate...

Reuters

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It's all looking really strange now. There's only one airport in the Anderman and Nicobar Islands - Veer Savarkar International Airport - and that's controlled by the Indian Navy and only operates in daylight.

Vince

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It's all looking really strange now. There's only one airport in the Anderman and Nicobar Islands - Veer Savarkar International Airport - and that's controlled by the Indian Navy and only operates in daylight.

Vince

Especially since the linked report states that the plane was following established airways. It said that the last track of the plane had it on an airway that is typically used for flights to Europe. I wonder if that was supposed to be the aircraft's final destination (assuming it had sufficient fuel)? If the airport referenced above only operated in daylight, could that have meant there was no radar coverage that night and the aircraft could have made it even further into the Indian Ocean, undetected?

Crazy stuff.....

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Especially since the linked report states that the plane was following established airways. It said that the last track of the plane had it on an airway that is typically used for flights to Europe. I wonder if that was supposed to be the aircraft's final destination (assuming it had sufficient fuel)? If the airport referenced above only operated in daylight, could that have meant there was no radar coverage that night and the aircraft could have made it even further into the Indian Ocean, undetected?

Crazy stuff.....

At such low altitude, to avoid radar, fuel consumption increases dramatically so who knows.

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At such low altitude, to avoid radar, fuel consumption increases dramatically so who knows.

Maybe I missed something but I thought the last report stated that the aircraft was still at ~ 30k'.

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in the last report that says it was intentionally rerouted it may have actually have dropped altitude enough to slip past radar. I know this sounds weird but there is a possibility that hijackers never intended to crash the plane but steal it and kidnap the passengers. If it was low enough with 7.5 hours of fuel who knows where it could be. That being said, with the satellite imagery and the amount of vehicles searching for this aircraft there are tons of information to go through.

I have even been on the Tomnod website and looked around at satellite imagery. Whats funny about this whole thing is the two Iranians who were on board with stolen passports. The governments are saying they are not tied to organizations like terrorists but maybe they were in cahoots with the pilots and defected to another country and took the passengers with them for ransom. I still don't get why no one is searching land masses for this aircraft. If it weren't for this crazy flight path I would say OK lets concentrate on ocean. But after everything that has been found out I would defiantly start searching land as well. Just my 2 cents though. And no I am not a conspiracy theorist.

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I guess we are just waiting on someone with a 777 and 230 hostages to make their demands known to the world whenever they're good and ready. There are probably a few places to hide in Thailand or Myanmar until then. It may even have had enough gas to make it to Africa.

Edited by Rank11
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I guess we are just waiting on someone with a 777 and 230 hostages to make their demands known to the world whenever they're good and ready. There are probably a few places to hide in Thailand or Myanmar until then. It may even have had enough gas to make it to Africa.

The number of airports where a 777 could land and escape notice by both radar and the general public are probably... zero?

My WAG at this point is that the aircraft is on the bottom of the Indian Ocean or in pieces in a jungle.

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The number of airports where a 777 could land and escape notice by both radar and the general public are probably... zero?

My WAG at this point is that the aircraft is on the bottom of the Indian Ocean or in pieces in a jungle.

Think of all the big planes like 747s that have mistakenly landed at small uncontrolled GA airports recently. It doesn't take a lot of runway to land a big plane like that. There are also plenty of rural or lawless regions to land an airplane in that part of the world. The chances are small, but not zero.

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From CNN:

BREAKING NEWS: THE SEARCH FOR FLIGHT 370

Missing plane: Could it have landed?

Well, I'm going to go way out on a very long limb and state for an absolute fact that the airplane has, in fact, landed. I don't think it's still flying around a week plus later.

Edited by Jennings
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Here is my Guess. I think one of the pilots wanted to commit suicide. He takes off Kills the other pilot. Turns off transponder, 10 minutes later forget there is second part to turn off. continues to fly normal and at same altitude.... does so for about 4-5 more hours... that time plus the hour to start is roughly ho long it take to fly to beijing BTW... Tell crew and passangers they have been cleared to desend into Beijing, continues to act normal and everyone expects they are getting ready to land, by the time they realize they are not going there it is too late..... that would answer why there was not Mayday, no cell usage.... by the time they got that far out, no cell would have service..... Everything I see leads to pilot.....

Not a Conpiracy theory, just what I think.... Could be WAY off, but......

J

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