zark Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 Well...well...well...I just finished the "paint job" on my F-22 using a mix of Alcland and gunze paints. I am realy happy with the outcome...next step...decals...and thats my problem. How do I make the decals "Dissapear"??? What I am thinking of doing, apply the decals > mat varnish and then satin varnish to get the "shine" back...any other ideas so that I dont loose the Metal finish? what modelers do when they face the same problem in NM aircraft??? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Check Six Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 I'm guessing a gloss overcoat for the decals. And then whatever sheen for a final coat. Post a pic of the F-22's current paint progress. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChippyWho Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 (edited) FWIW, I found excellent results using Future/Klear instead of the usual softening/setting agents. No previous overall gloss coat, just soak the decal, dip it in Klear once it is free on the backing paper, apply to water-moistened surface. Position it and smooth out with a soft, wet paintbrush. Then leave it alone. Once set, there is no silvering or carrier film visible and the decal sucks down really tight into any surface detail. The Klear seems to disappear completely, more so under a clear flat/satin/gloss varnish. Now, that's OK for painted surfaces...when NMF finishes come into the picture, it may be a different story -I haven't tried that yet. Representing the distinctive sheen of the F-22 is an interesting challenge: I'd be tempted to try one of the 'pearlescent' finishes the civil guys use over the likes of Virgin Atlantic Grey or NorthWest Grey -Xtracolor (X368 Mica 1 or X369 Mica 2) covers this on the Europe side of t' water; there must be other types available too. In any event, try your chosen paint/decal/varnish processes on some spare plastic first, before committing your valuable kit and decals! Edited June 7, 2014 by ChippyWho Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kozlok Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 I think I would have done the decals over a glossy finish (just paint), and added the metalizer into the final clear coat. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Check Six Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 FWIW, I found excellent results using Future/Klear instead of the usual softening/setting agents. No previous overall gloss coat, just soak the decal, dip it in Klear once it is free on the backing paper, apply to water-moistened surface. Position it and smooth out with a soft, wet paintbrush. Then leave it alone. Once set, there is no silvering or carrier film visible and the decal sucks down really tight into any surface detail. The Klear seems to disappear completely, more so under a clear flat/satin/gloss varnish. Now, that's OK for painted surfaces...when NMF finishes come into the picture, it may be a different story -I haven't tried that yet. Representing the distinctive sheen of the F-22 is an interesting challenge: I'd be tempted to try one of the 'pearlescent' finishes the civil guys use over the likes of Virgin Atlantic Grey or NorthWest Grey -Xtracolor (X368 Mica 1 or X369 Mica 2) covers this on the Europe side of t' water; there must be other types available too. In any event, try your chosen paint/decal/varnish processes on some spare plastic first, before committing your valuable kit and decals! Now this is an interesting process! Use Future as the vehicle to soften and separate the decal PLUS still eliminate silvering of decal film. Have you tried it on really bumpy surfaces; like the Hasegawa F-22 surface? Man; Talk about killing a half dozen birds with only one stone ! So that means one less layer to spray; Or would I still need to spray an overcoat in order to do weathering? Thanks for sharing the tip, ChippyWho ! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
zark Posted June 8, 2014 Author Share Posted June 8, 2014 (edited) Well...I am going to use the microset/microsol combimation on the decals. The actual problem is that if you dont use somekind of overcoat, the decals will look "not painted" , and looking at the model in some "angles" they will show like "stickers"....HHHHmmmmm...problems...problems...and I am so happy with my "interpetation" of that metal shine on my model... Edited June 8, 2014 by zark Quote Link to post Share on other sites
toadwbg Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 (edited) Good advice with the Future above, I've used it literally hundreds of times successfully. I typically brush a layer on the model surface and let it harden before decaling also. One exception, I use warm water for releasing the decal from the paper. Please do post pics! Edited June 8, 2014 by toadwbg Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChippyWho Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 (edited) The actual problem is that if you dont use somekind of overcoat, the decals will look "not painted" , and looking at the model in some "angles" they will show like "stickers"....HHHHmmmmm...problems...problems...and I am so happy with my "interpetation" of that metal shine on my model... Again, without getting into the potential compromise of an NMF surface by a clear top coat, where painted surfaces are concerned you definitely should apply a clear layer of some kind between decal application and weathering. As an indication of the Klear application process, however, the best photo I have right now is of the old Sea Fury I did for the Latin GB here a couple of years ago: These are Aeromaster decals applied directly onto a silver lacquer effect (enamel metallic) paint; no other treatment was done at this time. The markings look more painted-on in reality than in the photo. The top point of the star, for example, doesn't look too solid where it intersects the horizontal panel line in the pic, but once clear-coated and line-washed it looked totally convincing from all angles. Edited June 8, 2014 by ChippyWho Quote Link to post Share on other sites
toadwbg Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 The best painted on markings I have yet developed were....(drum roll please).... painted on with the airbrush using masks! There are cottage-industry guys out there that make masks for common letters, insignia & such. I actually really enjoy painting my markings nowdays and do it for most major markings except tiny stencils. No worries with silvering clear decal film! I did is on my Stuka build here: Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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