Exhausted Posted September 23, 2014 Author Share Posted September 23, 2014 The bad guys in Syria have a wide range of AAA and relatively modern MANPADS. All one needs to do is to check out youtube for dozens of clips of Syrian AF jets being shot down by these weapons. I doubt we'll see a low and slow jet like the A-10 used over Syria, for the same reason we never saw it used in Libya. My thought was that the small force of A-10's being deployed would be used for CSAR support and possibly strikes in Iraq which is a bit safer than over Syria. The CSAR role is huge, given how ISIS treats it's captives. Loosing a pilot or special forces team to those animals would be a horrific (and unfortunately, well publicized) event. One must anticipate more advanced Russian weapons to be filtered through Tartus with the explicit purpose of seeing how effective they are against American aviation. SA-22s/-24s posed a threat to USAF F-15Es over Libya in 2011. In fact, one knocked down that bird that suffered "engine failure." Link to post Share on other sites
TaiidanTomcat Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 One must anticipate more advanced Russian weapons to be filtered through Tartus with the explicit purpose of seeing how effective they are against American aviation. SA-22s/-24s posed a threat to USAF F-15Es over Libya in 2011. In fact, one knocked down that bird that suffered "engine failure." And we sent Ospreys into that high threat area to get the crew out? I'd never heard that SAM story before, and the F-15E crash looks pretty intact (no large pieces missing, no shrapnel, no scorched parts other than what burned on the ground) When did I say they were being used? They're going over there of course they're going to be used for something at some point. Never did I praise them in Syria either. But read what you want. I read the report his morning that 12 A-10s were going over and commented thusly. It'd be naive to think they won't participate at all in this mission. Link to post Share on other sites
TaiidanTomcat Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Interesting, I thought I read that they either were not or were employed early and then pulled out due to the threat level. I stand corrected. They were employed, and then restricted later Link to post Share on other sites
fulcrum1 Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 And we sent Ospreys into that high threat area to get the crew out? :jaw-dropping:/> I'd never heard that SAM story before, and the F-15E crash looks pretty intact (no large pieces missing, no shrapnel, no scorched parts other than what burned on the ground) And Harriers, Vipers, ISR, etc. However, a SAM didn't bring down that F-15E. Link to post Share on other sites
taylorde Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 What will be Russia's take on all this, they are a close Ally of Syria....Who would they support, if they chose to show up? DaveT Link to post Share on other sites
fulcrum1 Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 What will be Russia's take on all this, they are a close Ally of Syria....Who would they support, if they chose to show up? DaveT It'll be a Catalina wine mixer! Link to post Share on other sites
Grey Ghost 531 Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Separating hearts from minds, one 30mm shell at a time. Only after ISIS/ISIL started separating hearts from minds with a knife. Link to post Share on other sites
TaiidanTomcat Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 (edited) It'll be a Catalina wine mixer! Lost it. Edited September 23, 2014 by TaiidanTomcat Link to post Share on other sites
Exhausted Posted September 23, 2014 Author Share Posted September 23, 2014 What will be Russia's take on all this, they are a close Ally of Syria....Who would they support, if they chose to show up? DaveT Interesting, but I read from an admittedly inconclusive source that the Russian base at Tartus has been reduced in personnel. Is it possible that ships and facilitators were moved to respond to crisis in Ukraine? If so, this may degrade Russia's ability to respond. This doesn't mean that they can't send support through Iran. Link to post Share on other sites
Exhausted Posted September 23, 2014 Author Share Posted September 23, 2014 And Harriers, Vipers, ISR, etc. However, a SAM didn't bring down that F-15E. Actually, I've heard three stories on it. 1) Engine failure, 2) many posters on Tom Cooper's board claimed a MANPAD strike caused the engine failure, and 3) today I read on Wiki that the plane went down in a flat spin with a full load. So many claims.... all are possible.... I approach this murky issue with a mind open to the possibilities until conclusive information arises. Tomcat, I think it's worth noting that the 26th MEU established something of a safe zone in cooperation with Libya rebels who aided in the crew's rescue. Also, a heater doesn't necessarily break off big pieces on a two-engine bird. On a Harrier it would have been devastating, though. Link to post Share on other sites
11bee Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 They were employed, and then restricted later Which I believe was due to perceived vulnerabilities from Libyan air defenses. So I guess I still stand by my opinion that we probably won't see many A-10's over Syria. Link to post Share on other sites
fulcrum1 Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 (edited) Actually, I've heard three stories on it. 1) Engine failure, 2) many posters on Tom Cooper's board claimed a MANPAD strike caused the engine failure, and 3) today I read on Wiki that the plane went down in a flat spin with a full load. So many claims.... all are possible.... I approach this murky issue with a mind open to the possibilities until conclusive information arises. Just go straight to the source. http://www.usafe.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123283276 Edited September 23, 2014 by fulcrum1 Link to post Share on other sites
TaiidanTomcat Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Just go straight to the source. http://www.usafe.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123283276 There you go. I had never heard of any missile until today. Link to post Share on other sites
TaiidanTomcat Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Tomcat, I think it's worth noting that the 26th MEU established something of a safe zone in cooperation with Libya rebels who aided in the crew's rescue. thats one way of putting it. At 1:33 a.m. Tuesday (Libya time), 13 minutes after the Harriers arrived over the crash scene -- the F15E pilot saw a crowd moving toward him. The Harriers dropped two 500-pound laser-guided bombs between the pilot and the crowd. At least five Libyans in the crowd were injured by shrapnel. http://www.cnn.com/2011/US/03/22/libya.rescue.timeline/ Link to post Share on other sites
fulcrum1 Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 The rear seat guy's story is a bit different, but the details are not releasable. Link to post Share on other sites
82Whitey51 Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 What will be Russia's take on all this, they are a close Ally of Syria....Who would they support, if they chose to show up? DaveT Apparently Assad is all cool n' the gang with this...hey, we're taking care of his enemies. But Russia (Putin) has still come out in opposition. No surprise. Link to post Share on other sites
11bee Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Apparently Assad is all cool n' the gang with this...hey, we're taking care of his enemies. Assad has to be the happiest guy in the region. He can publicly slam us to keep his street quiet while at the same time, he can sit back and let the US and it's allies take out a bunch of the baddest fighters in the country. Syria is known to have a pretty efficient domestic intelligence service. I would not be at all surprised to find out that he has been providing targeting info to us through back channels. We've got great airborne and electronic surveillance capabilities but there is no substitute for some spies on the ground. Link to post Share on other sites
TaiidanTomcat Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Assad has to be the happiest guy in the region. He can publicly slam us to keep his street quiet while at the same time, he can sit back and let the US and it's allies take out a bunch of the baddest fighters in the country. And to think,just a year ago we wanted to bomb him! LOL Link to post Share on other sites
Exhausted Posted September 23, 2014 Author Share Posted September 23, 2014 Just go straight to the source. http://www.usafe.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123283276 Thanks for posting this. Link to post Share on other sites
chuck540z3 Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Again, no A-10s have deployed and are attacking to my knowledge as of yet. Maybe soon? The "Blacksnakes" no less. By Kristina Wong - 09/22/14 01:39 PM EDT The Pentagon is deploying 300 airmen and 12 A-10 combat jets to the Middle East in early October, according to the Indiana Air National Guard. The six-month deployment from the 122nd Fighter Wing is not specifically part of President Obama’s fight against the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria, but the airmen and jets could provide air support to troops battling ISIS on the ground. "I don't know of a time in Blacksnake history we have taken this kind of aviation footprint forward," said Col. Patrick R. Renwick, 122nd Fighter Wing commander, in a statement. "The A-10 'Warthog' is uniquely suited for the Combatant Commander's needs, and the Blacksnakes are the right team to bring that capability to combat." The airmen have been through "extensive preparation," the statement said, ranging from "cultural awareness to weapons qualification to medical training." Renwick called the deployment "historic for its length and size relative to previous Air National Guard deployments, which in the past have ranged from 30 to 90 days." "While it is common for the active duty Air Force to deploy a base overseas for an extended amount of time, the 122nd Fighter Wing is one of the only Air National Guard bases in history to take on a mission of this size and length," Renwick said. "We have the best training, equipment and aircraft in the world; we've been preparing and training for this deployment for the past few months; and I am fully confident in our ability to deploy one of the country's most lethal fighting forces to support and defend US efforts abroad," Col. Craig E. Ash, 122nd Fighter Wing Maintenance Group commander, said in the statement. The 122nd Fighter Wing will send 303 airmen, and the Terre Haute Air Guard base will send five as part of the mission, The Journal Gazette reported. Second Lt. Christopher Myers, public affairs officer for the 122nd Fighter Wing, told The Journal Gazette that the A-10 jets would be “in a support role.” Although A-10s generally are used to support ground combat troops with close air support, Obama has repeatedly said that U.S. troops would not have a combat mission. But Gen. Martin Dempsey, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said last week that recommendations on using ground troops would be handled on a case-by-case basis. The United States has 1,700 military advisers in Iraq. Myers told the local newspaper that time would tell how the forces would be used. “We are available for whatever mission the commander in chief really needs us for,” Myers told The Journal Gazette. “So time will tell. But our airmen are always ready and prepared.” "The Airmen of the 122nd Fighter Wing are trained and ready to answer our nation's call to duty," said Renwick. "The Air National Guard and the Blacksnakes are a proven choice in combat, I have no doubt we can accomplish any mission assigned!" — This post was updated at 2:30 p.m. Link to post Share on other sites
ChesshireCat Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Maybe soon? The "Blacksnakes" no less. By Kristina Wong - 09/22/14 01:39 PM EDT The Pentagon is deploying 300 airmen and 12 A-10 combat jets to the Middle East in early October, according to the Indiana Air National Guard. The six-month deployment from the 122nd Fighter Wing is not specifically part of President Obama’s fight against the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria, but the airmen and jets could provide air support to troops battling ISIS on the ground. "I don't know of a time in Blacksnake history we have taken this kind of aviation footprint forward," said Col. Patrick R. Renwick, 122nd Fighter Wing commander, in a statement. "The A-10 'Warthog' is uniquely suited for the Combatant Commander's needs, and the Blacksnakes are the right team to bring that capability to combat." The airmen have been through "extensive preparation," the statement said, ranging from "cultural awareness to weapons qualification to medical training." Renwick called the deployment "historic for its length and size relative to previous Air National Guard deployments, which in the past have ranged from 30 to 90 days." "While it is common for the active duty Air Force to deploy a base overseas for an extended amount of time, the 122nd Fighter Wing is one of the only Air National Guard bases in history to take on a mission of this size and length," Renwick said. "We have the best training, equipment and aircraft in the world; we've been preparing and training for this deployment for the past few months; and I am fully confident in our ability to deploy one of the country's most lethal fighting forces to support and defend US efforts abroad," Col. Craig E. Ash, 122nd Fighter Wing Maintenance Group commander, said in the statement. The 122nd Fighter Wing will send 303 airmen, and the Terre Haute Air Guard base will send five as part of the mission, The Journal Gazette reported. Second Lt. Christopher Myers, public affairs officer for the 122nd Fighter Wing, told The Journal Gazette that the A-10 jets would be “in a support role.” Although A-10s generally are used to support ground combat troops with close air support, Obama has repeatedly said that U.S. troops would not have a combat mission. But Gen. Martin Dempsey, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said last week that recommendations on using ground troops would be handled on a case-by-case basis. The United States has 1,700 military advisers in Iraq. Myers told the local newspaper that time would tell how the forces would be used. “We are available for whatever mission the commander in chief really needs us for,” Myers told The Journal Gazette. “So time will tell. But our airmen are always ready and prepared.” "The Airmen of the 122nd Fighter Wing are trained and ready to answer our nation's call to duty," said Renwick. "The Air National Guard and the Blacksnakes are a proven choice in combat, I have no doubt we can accomplish any mission assigned!" — This post was updated at 2:30 p.m. think the Black Snakes have already cleared out. Maybe a week or ten days ago. Have not seen them in the air for several weeks. Thoughts and prayers are always with them, and will miss them buzzing us while standing in the middle of a river! gary Link to post Share on other sites
chuck540z3 Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 think the Black Snakes have already cleared out. Maybe a week or ten days ago. Have not seen them in the air for several weeks. Thoughts and prayers are always with them, and will miss them buzzing us while standing in the middle of a river! gary I would not want to be an ISIS coward driving around with my gun in the air in the back of a pickup when this thing came over the horizon. I'd sure like the video though! Link to post Share on other sites
Exhausted Posted September 23, 2014 Author Share Posted September 23, 2014 (edited) Here is everything that's been posted by US Central Command's Youtube channel. Can anyone identify the targeting devices or determine which aircraft the videos were recorded from? Edited September 23, 2014 by Exhausted Link to post Share on other sites
Exhausted Posted September 23, 2014 Author Share Posted September 23, 2014 (edited) In the next video it seems that either cluster munitions were used or a separate GPS coordinate was given to several PGMS to hit every portion of that truck park. Edited September 23, 2014 by Exhausted Link to post Share on other sites
fulcrum1 Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Can anyone identify the targeting devices or determine which aircraft the videos were recorded from? Then it becomes classified again. Link to post Share on other sites
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