Joel_W Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 (edited) Tommy, Paul Budzik has done a great video tutorial on scribing. One of his methods is scribing primer and even paint for a thinner, more in scale appearance. This sounds like your best course to achieve the type of panel lines you're looking for. http://paulbudzik.com/tools-techniques/Scribing/scribing.html Joel Edited February 9, 2015 by Joel_W Quote Link to post Share on other sites
twhite80 Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 Amazing! I would recommend doing a 1/48th C-17 next. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dnl42 Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 Paul Budzik has done a great video tutorial on scribing. ... Joel Looks like the URL got mangled by some ellipses. It's correct in this post :) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Joel_W Posted February 9, 2015 Share Posted February 9, 2015 Sorry about the bad link. I just corrected it. Works fine now. Here it is again. http://paulbudzik.com/tools-techniques/Scribing/scribing.html Joel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TommyP Posted February 18, 2015 Author Share Posted February 18, 2015 Afternoon all! Time for an update on the C-17 project... Progress has slowed a little on this build as it's getting to the really fiddly parts, and scribing the surface detail was no exception. I've spent many enjoyable hours adding in the multitude of panel detail found on the C-17, using plans as well as the Revell 1/144th scale kit as a guide. It's quite slow scribing, but is well worth it as it adds a lot of life to the model and in this scale wouldn't look right if I left it devoid of detail. Tools of the trade are as follows: Two thin metal rulers from PP models, electrical insulation tape (for those difficult to scribe curves,) craft knife, dental scribe, a pencil (for marking the surface before committing the scriber) and finally some old, worn wet and dry paper to give everything a good polish once the scribing is complete. I find the key is to run the sciber over the position of the line lightly on numerous occasions, rather than trying to get it deep enough on the fist go. This helps control the scriber, and if you do muck it up it's far easier to fill and sand a shallow panel line than a deeper one! When you're happy with the line, a quick once over with the worn sandpaper ensures the edges are smooth where the scriber has 'gouged out' the material. On this build, I scribed just deep enough to see the filler-primer coats beneath the grey as on the real aircraft the panel detail is very fine indeed. I started at the front of the aircraft and worked my way towards the rear. The radar housing on the extreme nose has had the static strips present on the real aircraft made from very thin plastic strip, and the straps added earlier have been reduced in height by sanding. The electrical tape was really handy in getting the complex shape of the radome scribed on - it would have been almost impossible to do the same with the metal rulers: The underside of the nose has had the nose gear door hinges added as well as panel lines scribed in: The centre section of the aircraft where the wings join the fuselage has a very complex series of panel lines, so the Revell kit was really helpful here. It was just a case of measuring the 1/144th scale kit and doubling up to give me the positions of the panel lines in 1/72nd scale. This was the most challenging area to scribe, but the outcome is pleasing on the eye: The underside has had the flap details added as well as some details on the sponsons: The rear fuselage has once again had the straps sanded to reduce them in height and the panel lines added - there aren't many in this area so this took the least amount of head scratching: And a couple of 'overall' shots - the extra surface detailing has really started to bring the model to life and in my opinion was well worth the effort: So, until next time, Tom Quote Link to post Share on other sites
taggor Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 The scribing came out so clean! It looks as if a machine made them. I usually have to go back over or correct my scribing mistakes. Well done. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Aigore Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Fantastic results! Looks kind of funny with all those yellow lines criss crossing it..almost like a 3D- linedrawing in CATIA :P Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Joel_W Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Tom, Absolutely, one of, if not the most impressive scribing jobs I've ever seen. Not a mistake, and every scribed line looks exactly like the others. A true masters touch. BTW, I was wondering when your next update would be posted as it's been a while. But the wait was really worth it. Joel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TommyP Posted February 18, 2015 Author Share Posted February 18, 2015 Tom, Absolutely, one of, if not the most impressive scribing jobs I've ever seen. Not a mistake, and every scribed line looks exactly like the others. A true masters touch. BTW, I was wondering when your next update would be posted as it's been a while. But the wait was really worth it. Joel Many thanks Joel. Having built a fair few kits like this I've managed to get the scribing process down to a fine art. It has taken a lot of practise though. They key is just to progress slowly and don't be tempted to rush it. I did this over a few sessions and it probably took about five or six hours in total. There's still a few bits to add here and there but I think the overall effect looks pretty good and has certainly livened up a rather blank surface. The reason it's been a while between updates is due to the fact I simply fancied a break from this build - I'm re-motivated again now though and have been pondering making a start on the engines. Should be fun... Tom Quote Link to post Share on other sites
I.Martin Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 (edited) Superb, Tom!! In my opinion, the panel lines adds a beautiful extra for the overall external appearance and you have done it perfectly!! Are you going to add some rivest? I.Martin Edited February 19, 2015 by I.Martin Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TommyP Posted February 19, 2015 Author Share Posted February 19, 2015 Superb, Tom!! In my opinion, the panel lines adds a beautiful extra for the overall external appearance and you have done it perfectly!! Are you going to add some rivest? I.Martin Many thanks! I don't plan on adding any rivets to be honest. The real aircraft is flush riveted and they're pretty much invisible unless you're standing less than a few feet away. Tom Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TommyP Posted February 26, 2015 Author Share Posted February 26, 2015 I've been putting off starting the engines for as long as possible simply because I am dreading them! The kit provided parts are fairly basic, as can be seen below: The shape of the pylons is a little suspect and these will probably have to go! The intake rings and exhaust cones are also somewhat lacking in detail, and that's being generous: However, fortune favours the brave and all that - fortunately I have a set of resin engine fronts and fans from Aircraft in Miniature's 1/72nd 747 left over so I am planning to modify them as a starting point - I really don't fancy having to scratch-build individual fan blades etc! Hopefully, by the end of this process I've have something that resembles these: (used for illustrative purposes only) It's going to be a lot of hard graft, but I'll let you know how I get on! Tom Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Aigore Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 You've got your work cut out for you :) I know you'll impress the heck out if us with your skills! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Joel_W Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 Tom, Taking a quick look at those vac. engines and pylons, it's just amazing that they can offer something like that as buildable. Your AM parts are certainly the way to go. What ever mods you will have to make certainly will be much easier then trying to upgrade the kit crude engines. Joel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jenshb Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 Sounds like a very good excuse to get a set of casting starter sets from Sylmasta. It's only about £40 and you will get silicone rubber and polyurethane resin enough to do all four engines. Jens Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TommyP Posted February 27, 2015 Author Share Posted February 27, 2015 Tom, Taking a quick look at those vac. engines and pylons, it's just amazing that they can offer something like that as buildable. Your AM parts are certainly the way to go. What ever mods you will have to make certainly will be much easier then trying to upgrade the kit crude engines. Joel Hi Joel, They are buildable... just about. They are certainly as far removed as you can get from your latest Tamiya or Airfix release however! I'll get there in the end... Sounds like a very good excuse to get a set of casting starter sets from Sylmasta. It's only about £40 and you will get silicone rubber and polyurethane resin enough to do all four engines. Jens Hi Jens, Not a bad idea - if I knew even the smallest thing about resin casting! It's something I've never attempted and I know I should one day as it'll save be a great deal of work. In the meantime it'll just be a lot of old fashioned head scratching and copious amounts of filler! Tom Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ST0RM Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 Tommy, I was refueling a C-17 on Tuesday, and began thinking about the strips you have on the fuselage. Yours are too prominent. Even with the jet being 30 feet from my face, they were barely noticeable. And it needed some sun to cast a bit of shading to notice them. Hope it helps. Jeff Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TommyP Posted February 28, 2015 Author Share Posted February 28, 2015 Tommy, I was refueling a C-17 on Tuesday, and began thinking about the strips you have on the fuselage. Yours are too prominent. Even with the jet being 30 feet from my face, they were barely noticeable. And it needed some sun to cast a bit of shading to notice them. Hope it helps. Jeff Hi Jeff, Thanks for the input! You're right, they are too prominent and have had a good sand and thin down since the last set of photos. It is interesting though... many have commented on the strips being too visible, and yet very few people ever comment on panel lines on models that are given dark washes and highlights and also look waaaaayyyyyy out of scale! I'm wondering what the difference is!? Tom Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Joel_W Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 (edited) Hi Jeff, Thanks for the input! You're right, they are too prominent and have had a good sand and thin down since the last set of photos. It is interesting though... many have commented on the strips being too visible, and yet very few people ever comment on panel lines on models that are given dark washes and highlights and also look waaaaayyyyyy out of scale! I'm wondering what the difference is!? Tom Tom, My feelings exactly. I've had from time to time discussions with various modelers about over emphasizing panel lines and rivets, where they actually become one of the prominent features rather then just part of the whole package. Like so many others, I've gone from stark Black pin washes in re-scribed recessed lines. to just a few shades darker or as part of the dirt filter. Personally, I think the overall effect is more natural. Here's how I handled my recently finished F-15C with that concept. At 1st the panel lines and rivets are barely visible, but if you look for a few seconds, your eyes start to focus on them and they become that "part of the total package" concept I was referring to. To me, this looks as about as natural as my limited skills will allow. Joel Edited February 28, 2015 by Joel_W Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ST0RM Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 (edited) Yes, I agree the stark black panel washes are too much. Joel's Eagle is spot on. Using a pencil seems to replicate the shade that I strive for. But prominent structural details are often overdone and not to scale on larger aircraft. I can't figure out why the QA doesn't catch it. Looking forward to your future progress. Jeff P.S. I posted this for the fellow building the Anigrand kit. Maybe it's of use for you too. Edited February 28, 2015 by ST0RM Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TommyP Posted February 28, 2015 Author Share Posted February 28, 2015 Joel that Eagle looks great - you've captured a lovely subtle effect and as you say it just looks natural. I see so many well built models ruined by ridiculously over-done panel lines that look more like a map of a rail network than the surface of an aircraft! And Jeff - that's a cracking image! Some progress has been made on the engines... I've decided to remove the pylons as these will need lots of work... I thought it easier if I tackled the engines and pylons separately and then bring them back together before installation on the wings. The original vacformed nacelle parts were assembled in the usual manner, but the profiles of the engines were out so I have had to build up the shapes of the nacelles with copious amounts of P30 car body filler. The 747 intakes have been reduced in size slightly and added to the fronts of the nacelles - the filler will help blend them in: The nacelles have each had a good rub down with wet'n'dry paper and to my eye the shape now looks a good deal better: The kit parts also lack the runners for the thrust reversers on the lower part of the nacelles (and the top for that matter but they'll be tackled along with the pylons) so these have been sculpted from Milliput. Here is a test fit of the exhaust cone: And from the front: Considering what I started with, they're starting to come together. Still a long way to go though and some subtle re-shaping required still. Tom Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Joel_W Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Tom, Simply amazing work. They already don't look like the crude vacuformed parts you started with. And thank you for appreciated my most modest efforts on the F-15C build. Joel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
TommyP Posted March 1, 2015 Author Share Posted March 1, 2015 I've been having lots of 'fun' today and have more or less got the nacelles where I want them. Shapewise the intakes are probably too round, but once they're on the pylon and have had further details added to draw the eye, they're passable to my not-too-bothered-about-total-accuracy approach to modelling! And when I consider what I started with I'm fairly happy with how they're shaping up. Halfords' filler-primer has once again given them a nice and smooth surface for the painting process which will follow later. All four are now looking pretty much identical, which is always a bonus: I can now turn my attention to making the pylons, and then the exhaust comes will need some work, too. Plenty to keep me busy... Tom Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Joel_W Posted March 1, 2015 Share Posted March 1, 2015 Tom, Absolutely an impressive update. All four engines look great. What drew my eye was just not being ready for how big they are. Once I saw your fingers next to them, I realized just how big they are, or should I say massive. Joel Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Devilleader501 Posted March 5, 2015 Share Posted March 5, 2015 + ^ what Joel said. I know it was going to be big but looking at the nacel in your hand compared to my 1/144 that thing is a monster. Christ whats the wing span on the thing. Has to be about 2 foot 6 across. I just did calculations and yup It's Big. Great job so far more talent than I have by far. Can't wait for more updates. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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