Mstor Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 2 minutes ago, zerosystem said: Seriously? you experts just "discovered" something new? Look at all of the pics of the plastic, don't cherry pick. Better yet just wait for the plastic. The spine is fine and it extends past the wing plate area, look at the bare plastic photos as the painted versions hide the curvature. <iframe src="https://giphy.com/embed/12UMa0PQ2pL8LC" width="480" height="217" frameBorder="0" class="giphy-embed" allowFullScreen></iframe><p><a href="https://giphy.com/gifs/axe-12UMa0PQ2pL8LC">via GIPHY</a></p> No reason to jump on him. If he sees an issue, let him present evidence. He could be in error or not. That's why I asked for photos (btw, I'm not seeing the photo you posted). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shion Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 12 minutes ago, Mstor said: Bill, could you post some pics that illustrate this? For some reason I'm not seeing it. Take a look at the spine and where it ends. Take as a reference both inclined lines. Now look at a real tomcat: Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mstor Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 I think it is the lighting on the top view pic you show. The one above that shows the spine of the Tamiya kit on top with the spine of the AMK on not really visible underneath it. Here is a better view of the AMK spine. You can see that it extends further. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
zerosystem Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 Mstor has it right, There are some other images on the AMK fan page on Facebook that better illustrate it. The spine on the real thing (in most photos) stops just ahead of the trailing edge of the inner strakes, both the AMK and Tamiya kits show similar ending locations. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shion Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 (edited) Look page 183, there are numerous pics in every angle of a built kit. It's not the lighting. Side: Top Last pic shows it the most. Edited August 21, 2019 by shion pics provided Quote Link to post Share on other sites
skuki Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 (edited) well, I've spotted that before, and It was my greater concern that "the curve". It really look on some pictures that it isn't there, but it is, although it looks to be too shallow, will be interesting to see it in person Edited August 21, 2019 by skuki Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 And yet, the last photo of the real plane posted by Shion above shows the spine go beyond the trailing edge. It's not a huge deal and it's only short by a bit. BUT it is off a little. You can see where the shadow actually curves around the curve on the very back of the spine. It's further back. It's not a slam against a company so there's no reason to see it as such. Just a casual observation. And no, I'm NOT an F-14 expert but I can look at a photo and tell when two things are the same. Bash away at me all you need to. I'm good with that or whatever. Bill Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 And as far as Tamiya showing that area the same? That's all fine. But I'm not intending to buy a scale model of another scale model. It's a scale model of an actual plane. Comparing it to Tamiya to determine accuracy is kind of pointless isn't it? Just sayin' BTW, I'm not saying that I am definitely right. Only that it's how it appears to me. Take it for what it's worth. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
skuki Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 (edited) again various photos, dots and lines.... we need to get the kit to conclude something by looking at the picture from previous post it is total fail, and from this pictures it look like it is spot on Edited August 21, 2019 by skuki Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Zactoman Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 Regarding the ongoing debate... Niart has already pretty much nailed it here. Research and analysis can be a fun hobby in itself. I've learned a lot about the Tomcat both from other members doing their analysis and from doing my own analysis. My Tomcat photo reference library has gone from a couple hundred pics, mostly of intakes and fuel tank pylons, to well over a thousand pics covering all areas of the plane. In essence, I've learned about the Tomcat in part because of this conversation. That's a good thing isn't it? There are lots of members here that appreciate knowing the issues with kits, so that they can decide to fix them on their builds, so that they can decide to make a purchase, so that they can learn more about the actual aircraft. Some people simply have a harder time seeing shapes and details than others, particularly when they are subtle details. But those subtle details can be the difference between a kit that looks right or one where something just looks off a bit. This is where comparative photos, red lines and illustrations can really help. Unfortunately making those illustrations and red line comparisons can be very time consuming. Thank you to those who take the time to do them. Also a big thank you to the subject matter experts, ordies, mechanics, pilots, etc, that share their wealth of knowledge with us. This is a modelling discussion forum where we discuss plastic models and the subject that they are depicting. Focus on the plastic and not the participants of the discussion. None of us would prefer an inaccurate kit to a more accurate kit. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DIO Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 (edited) My only concern is that I have never seen such a long debate before for a model that is still unreleased. Which is making me think that firstly there is a reason for it and secondly that the bad marketing practices of AMK gave space to this happening... I honestly hope that this is a lessons learnt session for them. Finally, for all my rivet counting friends, I am pretty sure that issues can be found with every single model out there. So plenty of space for them to enjoy! Edited August 21, 2019 by DIO Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shion Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 Remember the discussion about both canopies? Single part option: Both options Multipart option showing the problem underlined previously: Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 Great pics. It does also show that the break in angle at the rear of the canopy may be slightly under-defined, but that's pretty minor. (ducking for cover) True, no kit is perfect. And I for one am glad. How much fun would it be to measure a kit and say "Yup, everything is exactly where it is."? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Zactoman Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 45 minutes ago, niart17 said: It does look like the kit spine goes flat where you have the red line: That panel line should have a very slight curve: I'd consider this a minor flaw compared to some of the other issues. I will say this, the areas that don't have problems do look nice. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 (edited) I agree Zacto, there are some really beautiful things happening with this kit. I'm still hoping for a good way of making the frame-to-glass canopy assembly work well. To me if you can pull that off it really would sell that there is an aircraft metal to glass transition there. Something that even the best painting can't quite get the look of. I'm curious, is there a weather stripping material that's visible on some F-14's that one could paint the very edge of the glass to represent and it take away that "thick clear edge" effect? I'm Jonesing to play with that. Edited August 21, 2019 by niart17 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
foxmulder_ms Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 1 hour ago, shion said: Look page 183, there are numerous pics in every angle of a built kit. It's not the lighting. Side: Top Last pic shows it the most. You are not correct. Spine continues further down than you "see". Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 This is NOT a great pic to use and this could be completely imagined...BUT to me, in some pics it appears that the spine may actually go past that panel line and there is a slightly raised area aft of it that is curved. That's why the panel line may appear curved. Again, this is VERY minor, but I would be curious to compare to a real plane. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shion Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 34 minutes ago, foxmulder_ms said: You are not correct. Spine continues further down than you "see". Prove it. 2 minutes ago, niart17 said: This is NOT a great pic to use and this could be completely imagined...BUT to me, in some pics it appears that the spine may actually go past that panel line and there is a slightly raised area aft of it that is curved. That's why the panel line may appear curved. Again, this is VERY minor, but I would be curious to compare to a real plane. We need to find pics of the real A/C showing how the transition spine/fuselage is, it's tricky because we need the good angle between A/C fuselage and the sun/ Maybe this pic describes very well the transition (high res and cliquable as always): Same here: So on the real A/C, the turtleback stay notably curved very far till the red line you drawed. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mstor Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 I agree with Zactoman, the spine does go flat a little before it should. It is not as bad as first stated. The spine curve does almost go all the way to the end of the inner strakes and perhaps a little past that point. That much is evident from photos of the real thing. It is also evident that the panel line near the end of the spine should have a curve to it and it appears that the AMK kit's panel line is flat. So, the kit's spine is "almost" there, but not quite. This is a minor issue to me. Can't wait till we have kit in hand and can put to rest (yea like that's going to happen) the wide/curved aft fuselage and the IFR probe issue. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Neo Posted August 21, 2019 Share Posted August 21, 2019 10 hours ago, Dave Roof said: Omg i love how a ultra sofisticated machine drop the result in a cardboard box Quote Link to post Share on other sites
foxmulder_ms Posted August 22, 2019 Share Posted August 22, 2019 2 hours ago, shion said: Prove it. But... you can check zerosystem and Mstor's post 🙂 You think the spine ends a panel too early 😉 But it is almost perfect match to the real think. It may a be a little tat too shallow but that is it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
GW8345 Posted August 22, 2019 Share Posted August 22, 2019 For the record, the spin ends about half way down the number 5 turtleback panel on a real Tomcat, it's very subtle but it does end on the #5 TB. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mstor Posted August 22, 2019 Share Posted August 22, 2019 32 minutes ago, GW8345 said: For the record, the spin ends about half way down the number 5 turtleback panel on a real Tomcat, it's very subtle but it does end on the #5 TB. That's what I like. Someone who knows the panel numbers of an aircraft. Now that's my kind of OCD. Well done Sir! Now all I need is a diagram showing all the panels and their numbers . Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sleepy Posted August 22, 2019 Share Posted August 22, 2019 10 hours ago, niart17 said: Yup. And also as the old saying goes, there's no such thing as bad press. This thread is helping AMK in many many ways. Some who would never even consider buying an F-14 might get this kit just to see what the hubbub is all about. The thread that just keeps on giving. Ya' can't stop it. 300 300 300 300 300 You realize, of course, that probably about 0.00000000000144298% of modelers worldwide have ever heard of ARC, much less read this entire 208 (and counting) page thread, right? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.