niart17 Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 13 hours ago, Dave Roof said: I think you're giving this thread, and ARC in general, too much credit. I know of several dozen modelers on Facebook that don't frequent any of the modeling forums (LSP/HS/ARC, etc.) and I personally know of several that have never even heard of ARC, much less care to join. I worked at the local Hobbytown and the majority of the modeling customers didn't visit any of the on-line forums. Hell, one of my best friends here is one of the most well known modelers in the Atlanta area and he doesn't visit any of the forums or FB. This thread has only kept the kit on the radar for the members of this forum. The kit is popular because of the length of time it's taken to be released and the constant discussions about it on dozens of platforms. The scale modeling world does not revolve around this site. Ok perhaps, but we were told not too long ago that word on the street is this site, or rather this thread in general, has become the laughing stock of the whole modeling community. That people in the real world are talking about it. So, either it is or it isn't. Point is, this thread has I believe last I checked, well over 1/2 a million views. Somebody is looking at it right? Again, not suggesting that's the sole reason why the kit sold so well. But it certainly could have contributed. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
delide Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 (edited) 16 hours ago, masanissa said: The kit is selling well but how many will get built because of fit issues? So yes, the kit is popular. People buy Justin Bieber and Adele albums. They both sell out huge stadiums. Everyone has different tastes. Now I'd buy a ticket to see Adele, if she performed in Adelaide Australia with Adélie penguins, and a pack of howling dogs as her backup vocalists. LOL, I'm not interested in Adele's music at all either, but I'd in for a live stream at least :-) I'd be more cautious if I was Dave Roof, as it might be just in the US that this kit is selling particularly well. Anyway that certainly doesn't mean the issues with the kit do not exist, some are really bad IMO... Plus VW probably sell way more cars than Ferrari. Edited December 10, 2019 by delide Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hubbie Marsten Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 4 hours ago, Solo said: Ok, I have just sold my F-14D AMK. Farewell to the king, looking forward to F-14 GWH. 🙂 That's quite a smart move, Solo. Congratulations on a very good decision. It makes one less frustrated modeller who only got sold a shapeless, infamous and lame cloud-of-smoke hype - with beautiful dirty wings, that is. Had I been in the AMK camp, I'd have cancelled the F-14D kit flop forever and had just released the dirty wings as a set for the Tamiya kit instead, in order to try and compensate for the awful losses. The dirty wings and the ordnance crap. But that's just me. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ElectroSoldier Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 On 12/9/2019 at 2:46 PM, Mstor said: If "Looks like an F-14" was the only requirement, then we'd all be satisfied with the Monogram and Revell kits. But, we have never been "satisfied" with the status quo and the kit manufacturers have known this for a long time. Each company has striven to make their kits more accurate and more detailed. This is one of the things that has fueled competition within the industry and hence, we have new F-14 kits being released. Each company trying to outdo the other in detail and accuracy. Sure, the AMK kit looks like an F-14. I've seen kids toys that "look like an F-14". That's not the point and some of us here on this forum want the kit to be as accurate a representation of the F-14 as possible. Heck, why do we buy aftermarket parts or scratch build other parts. It is to improve accuracy and detail. So, to that end we analyze kits' accuracy because some of us want to most accurate kit (or at least would like to know which is most accurate). I will admit that the AMK is a special case. AMK stated that it would be the most accurate and most detailed F-14 model every made. Big words and we have called them to task on them. In my mind, they have fallen woefully short of the mark. We know the major problems with the kit due to the careful analysis of some very knowledgeable persons here (that does NOT include me). I think that now we are into more of an intellectual exercise to determine exactly where AMK went wrong in the design of their kit. If you are not interested, that's fine. Some of us are interested. Zactoman has hinted that there may be some fixes that may correct some of the AMK kits errors. That may be of interest to anyone who bought the kit but is dissatisfied with the what they bought. So, as others have pointed out, if you are tired of listening to the analysis of this kit, then don't read this thread. Please let those that want to do so in a a civilized manner. Oh, and one more thing... 300 here we come! Yeah and most them wasted... Like this very post proves there is little about analysing problems now. You like to think it is but theres little of that. No Im not forced to read the thread, and in fact I havent bothered to read more than a dozen posts as its an exhaustive collection of groans cries and grievances. The way I see the kit is basically to give you the answer you gave to me about this thread. "if you are tired of listening to the analysis of this kit, then don't read this thread" If you dont like the kit then dont buy it. And if you do then do it. This thread is now way to long to be of any real use to somebody who wants to know about the kits problems. So far Ive got from this thread, this kit has some problems and a lot of people are put out by that as AMK owed them a good kit. As to the actual problems good luck finding them here in this thread. Its a step up from the others and adds something to the modelling world. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Solo Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 3 hours ago, Hubbie Marsten said: That's quite a smart move, Solo. Congratulations on a very good decision. It makes one less frustrated modeller who only got sold a shapeless, infamous and lame cloud-of-smoke hype - with beautiful dirty wings, that is. For sure I was not a frustrated modeller, because I liked this kit very much and I don't care about it inaccuracies.I sold it because I have a lot of Tomcats in my stash, so I will not going to fix all of those fitting issues and inaccuracies, althought I like dirty wings. Following that I decided to sell it, keeping the set of weapons, and I additionally earned some money for this whole mess. 🙂 And I am waiting for GWH kit, hoping it the best Tomcat kit on the market, I believe. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
salomon Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 I would like to share my thoughts on this model, in fact I'm not attracted to the new tomcat model kit just because I had built all version of the Hasegawa's model before and there are some trouble with the fit but I didn't complain anyway, it's just a killing time hobby and I were happy with it. The model of AMK has its strengths and of course, it remains a model with the defects on authenticity but the work by AMK is really fabulous. So I ordered (preorder) one out of curiosity and I had already mounted the models of this manufacturer as Kfir, Fouga Magister and the Mig 31 and I had a nice moment building those kit. An today I use to work on the Tomcat. Somebody said the engraving is a little heavy and I'm agree with but once painted and wearthering the result is just fine. Pieces fit well and I spend my time looking at the so many details of the pieces and I don't need any aftermarket for this build, Everyone can add or even modify all the details for a question of authenticity, so why buy plastic kits? the scratch building is the only solution. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
salomon Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 (edited) We did not complain when Trumeterp took out their SU-34 with many faults of shapes not counting the details. So why we complain for this F-14? The Tamiya F-14 is fine but the surface of the plastic is so smotth, did you already see the real F-14? take a look to so many walkaround with google or going to the museum to see it, the AMK's tomcat isn't that bad at all, in my own opinion it's the best tomcat kit so far, by the way I just order an other one for my collection and won't build it. I do not want to offend anyone, if you wanna build the Tamiya, so get it and build it, same for the Trumpeter's, Hasegawa's, Academy's, Revell's, Monogram's, you have choices. Edited December 10, 2019 by salomon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hubbie Marsten Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 13 minutes ago, salomon said: We did not complain when Trumeterp took out their SU-34 with many faults of shapes not counting the details. I think that we didn't complain because: first, there is no manufacturer going by the name of Trumeterp...? Secondly, perhaps Trumeterp wouldn't have incurred in the marketing campaign HORROR that the AMK Tomcat kit was? Thirdly, perhaps Trumeterp wouldn't have affirmed that their Su-34 was going to be so good that the kit would bring working jet engines, right from the start? Fifthly, because Trumeterp hadn't impossed a 5000-mark pre-order prerrogative scam to then disappear from this forum, only to reappear on Facebook to make a pathetic farce of their own? Sixthly, because Trumeterp would have dismissed the awful shape on the Su-34 radome as being an optical illusion? I could just go on, and on, and on, but I'll just leave it at there. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
salomon Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 (edited) Sorry for the wrong typing, I mean Trumpeter...my bad😀 I agree with your point for the preorder stuff, it wasn't cool but I think AMK is a small business and we can't compare with Tamiya or the others. No any communication after the pre order doesn't make credit for the manufacture. After all the kit is here and it's fabulous so I won't complain. Edited December 10, 2019 by salomon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tapchan Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 3 minutes ago, Hubbie Marsten said: I think that we didn't complain because: first, there is no manufacturer going by the name of Trumeterp...? Secondly, perhaps Trumeterp wouldn't have incurred in the marketing campaign HORROR that the AMK Tomcat kit was? Thirdly, perhaps Trumeterp wouldn't have affirmed that their Su-34 was going to be so good that the kit would bring working jet engines, right from the start? Fifthly, because Trumeterp hadn't impossed a 5000-mark pre-order prerrogative scam to then disappear from this forum, only to reappear on Facebook to make a pathetic farce of their own? Sixthly, because Trumeterp would have dismissed the awful shape on the Su-34 radome as being an optical illusion? I could just go on, and on, and on, but I'll just leave it at there. Ten point shot. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hubbie Marsten Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 Meaning you need more becauses from me? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hubbie Marsten Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 13 minutes ago, salomon said: No any communication after the pre order doesn't make credit for the manufacture. After all the kit is here and it's fabulous so I won't complain. Okay then? Don't complain when you pay the butcher in advance for some fine sausages, and then you're handed with cheap bologna. Don't complain, Sal; just dooooooon't complain. Blame my double post on Mr Salomon above. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tapchan Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dave Roof Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 4 hours ago, delide said: I'd be more cautious if I was Dave Roof, as it might be just in the US that this kit is selling particularly well. Anyway that certainly doesn't mean the issues with the kit do not exist, some are really bad IMO... Plus VW probably sell way more cars than Ferrari. Why would I need to be "more cautious"? I also never said the kit didn't have issues. I said that many people simply don't care. Me personally, I don't care. I have one, I'll build it and I more than likely won't "fix" anything (unless it's a fitting issue). Now, the Kittyhawk UH-1N? The fact it has the wrong main rotor bothers me. I have a few and will fix each one. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hubbie Marsten Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 3 minutes ago, Dave Roof said: Now, the Kittyhawk UH-1N? The fact it has the wrong main rotor bothers me. I have a few and will fix each one. Now THIS I'm interested in; do you mind elaborating on how to fix the rotor issue in the Kitty Hawk UH-1N, Dave? Is this issue carried out in the UH-1D kit as well? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shion Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 1 hour ago, salomon said: I would like to share my thoughts on this model, in fact I'm not attracted to the new tomcat model kit just because I had built all version of the Hasegawa's model before and there are some trouble with the fit but I didn't complain anyway, it's just a killing time hobby and I were happy with it. The model of AMK has its strengths and of course, it remains a model with the defects on authenticity but the work by AMK is really fabulous. So I ordered (preorder) one out of curiosity and I had already mounted the models of this manufacturer as Kfir, Fouga Magister and the Mig 31 and I had a nice moment building those kit. An today I use to work on the Tomcat. Somebody said the engraving is a little heavy and I'm agree with but once painted and wearthering the result is just fine. Pieces fit well and I spend my time looking at the so many details of the pieces and I don't need any aftermarket for this build, Everyone can add or even modify all the details for a question of authenticity, so why buy plastic kits? the scratch building is the only solution. Please show us. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
salomon Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 23 minutes ago, Hubbie Marsten said: Okay then? Don't complain when you pay the butcher in advance for some fine sausages, and then you're handed with cheap bologna. Don't complain, Sal; just dooooooon't complain. Blame my double post on Mr Salomon above. Relex, I wasn't happy maybe a little bit mad but it was ok, I use to build other kits and as I said the tomcat wasn't THE model that I'm waiting for so that's fine for me. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
salomon Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 (edited) https://imgur.com/7IAEvWV https://imgur.com/DXjTfIs No any trouble fit until now. Edited December 10, 2019 by salomon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shion Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 34 minutes ago, salomon said: https://imgur.com/7IAEvWV https://imgur.com/DXjTfIs No any trouble fit until now. If you don't have assembling problems yet, why didn't you follow the instruction manual build sequence? And if you look the build photos I posted 2 pages ago, the aera you are showing is one with fewer issues, the builder only used surfacer 1000 to fill the lateral gaps and some polyputty for the beaver tail. Show us how you deal with the whole intakes-bottom fuselage assembly or the joint front fuselage-main body. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
zerosystem Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 Enough Shion, if the guy says he hasn't had any issues yet leave it alone rather than compare it with hearsay. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shion Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 17 minutes ago, zerosystem said: Enough Shion, if the guy says he hasn't had any issues yet leave it alone rather than compare it with hearsay. Modelers engaged by AMK to promote the kit, struggle with it, to the point they had to choose the right pictures and weirdest angles to not show accuracy issues and assembling issues. Normal modelers struggled with the kit and very few completed the build. Pretty experienced and talented modelers struggle actually with the kit, despite one just having completed the HAS Tomcat, a kit notorious for his fitting issues. And now, we're supposed to believe someone who is claiming the opposite, because he'd posted some pictures of a aera with few fit issues? Let's follow his build and see at the same aeras others had problems, if there's a real problem with the kit or it's a lack of experience/competence of the others builders. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
zerosystem Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 You think that there is a conspiracy with the builders? You really want to bury the company don't you... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jonbryon Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 2 hours ago, Hubbie Marsten said: Is this issue carried out in the UH-1D kit as well? No. Because the UH-1N and UH-1D have different rotors. Jon Quote Link to post Share on other sites
niart17 Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 (edited) 7 minutes ago, zerosystem said: You think that there is a conspiracy with the builders? You really want to bury the company don't you... I agree, Shion I think you're pushing this a little too far now. I'm all for open discussions and letting pretty much any conversation about the KIT go. But you're starting to attack the integrity of a fellow modeler and member (yes, he's new but still, not cool) Please tone down the aggressive posting towards other modelers. That's not going to help anyone and frankly comes across as petty. Edited December 10, 2019 by niart17 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shion Posted December 10, 2019 Share Posted December 10, 2019 (edited) 14 minutes ago, zerosystem said: You think that there is a conspiracy with the builders? You really want to bury the company don't you... No, I've just want to see a build of the kit here. It's pretty paradoxal, despite the hype about it, no build on this forum, very few builds elsewhere. What happened? I perfectly understand some people who preordered the kit but got problems on the way decided to sell theirs. But it's still paradoxal that a kit with this hype finally have this few WIP and completed builds. Edited December 10, 2019 by shion Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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