Manuel J. Armas S. Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 (edited) The panel line need some adjustment… 😄 Edited April 30, 2019 by Manuel J. Armas S. file... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
habu2 Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 This thread needs some adjustment..... 😎 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shion Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 12 hours ago, Darren Roberts said: You totally miss the point. The point is there's no signs of change or correction on the relatively few parts presented at the Moson show. It is the same parts we saw at Eday2018 et cetera. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Darren Roberts Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 10 hours ago, shion said: You totally miss the point. The point is there's no signs of change or correction on the relatively few parts presented at the Moson show. It is the same parts we saw at Eday2018 et cetera. I didn't miss the point. That's just it. They weren't going to change anything because of cost and because they feel they will still sell enough to make it worthwhile. The kit is what it is. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dehowie Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Darren Roberts said: I didn't miss the point. That's just it. They weren't going to change anything because of cost and because they feel they will still sell enough to make it worthwhile. The kit is what it is. The issue for them is they wont sell many at all. The serious F-14aphile wont touch it...the casual guy wont ever becable to buy it with Amk’s poor distribution network. They have succesfully isolated two key markets to only sell F-14’s to the Amk devotees who realistically would not even care if it looked like the Concorde. Even then most failed to put there money where there mouth is. Seriously how many will you buy with its massive panel lines, distorted aft end and various other issues when we have the beautiful Tamiya kit? I mean seriously how many will you buy? I will buy one to go with my 7 Tamiya F-14D’s...and only because i like Amk and have a big pile of Mig-31’s. I am not sure they even deserve 1 sale but i will anyway. Edited April 30, 2019 by dehowie Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Manuel J. Armas S. Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Falconxlvi Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 15 minutes ago, dehowie said: The issue for them is they wont sell many at all. The serious F-14aphile wont touch it...the casual guy wont ever becable to buy it with Amk’s poor distribution network. They have succesfully isolated two key markets to only sell F-14’s to the Amk devotees who realistically would not even care if it looked like the Concorde. Even then most failed to put there money where there mouth is. Seriously how many will you buy with its massive panel lines, distorted aft end and various other issues when we have the beautiful Tamiya kit? I mean seriously how many will you buy? I will buy one to go with my 7 Tamiya F-14D’s...and only because i like Amk and have a big pile of Mig-31’s. I am not sure they even deserve 1 sale but i will anyway. Not me. The Tamiya kit is a dream. I had high hopes for this kit and the extended flaps and slats wing, but I will just build the Tamiya kit when I get around to building a D. The A kit was the easily the best fitting and engineered kit I’ve ever built. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dave Williams Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 24 minutes ago, dehowie said: The issue for them is they wont sell many at all. The serious F-14aphile wont touch it...the casual guy wont ever becable to buy it with Amk’s poor distribution network. They have succesfully isolated two key markets to only sell F-14’s to the Amk devotees who realistically would not even care if it looked like the Concorde. Even then most failed to put there money where there mouth is. Seriously how many will you buy with its massive panel lines, distorted aft end and various other issues when we have the beautiful Tamiya kit? I mean seriously how many will you buy? I will buy one to go with my 7 Tamiya F-14D’s...and only because i like Amk and have a big pile of Mig-31’s. I am not sure they even deserve 1 sale but i will anyway. To be honest, even if they fixed the issues, they aren’t likely to sell many more than if they didn’t fix anything. The issue about the casual modeler and pricing/distribution still holds, and for the hard core F-14 modeler, there probably aren’t that many of them out there, especially those who would spend another $100 or so for an AMK kit that at best would only be incrementally better than the Tamiya kit they likely already have. The cost/benefit of fixing just may not work out. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Don Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 At this stage, I say just release the kit and let the modeling community decide its success or failure. I think many in all camps and all sides of this seemingly never ending saga are tired of looking at CAD shots, sprue pictures, box art, red lines, fizzling model show rollouts, idle promises, never ending announcements etc and... for better or worse... hate it or love it...buy it or don't buy it... just want to see the kit released. No more "soon", no more "it gets here when it gets here"... get it on the shelves and let the market take its course. It's hard to believe we're about four or five weeks away from the four year anniversary of AMK's announcement and we still have no kit... and this thread is still going... Happy modeling all! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Darren Roberts Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 44 minutes ago, dehowie said: The issue for them is they wont sell many at all. The serious F-14aphile wont touch it...the casual guy wont ever becable to buy it with Amk’s poor distribution network. They have succesfully isolated two key markets to only sell F-14’s to the Amk devotees who realistically would not even care if it looked like the Concorde. Even then most failed to put there money where there mouth is. Seriously how many will you buy with its massive panel lines, distorted aft end and various other issues when we have the beautiful Tamiya kit? I mean seriously how many will you buy? I will buy one to go with my 7 Tamiya F-14D’s...and only because i like Amk and have a big pile of Mig-31’s. I am not sure they even deserve 1 sale but i will anyway. I consider myself to be a serious F-14aphile, and I will be purchasing one. You make many good points in your post, but it is tainted with the hyperbole of someone who seems to have an ax to grind against AMK. Unless you put money down, AMK has done nothing to harm you personally. Why waste energy venting against a company that produces plastic toys? As I've said, the kit is what it is. If you don't like it, don't purchase it. If you still want to pick one up to see what it's like, go for it. I just don't understand the passion that's being leveled against the kit and company. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shion Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 56 minutes ago, Darren Roberts said: I didn't miss the point. That's just it. They weren't going to change anything because of cost and because they feel they will still sell enough to make it worthwhile. The kit is what it is. Take a look at their FB page, not the fanclub. People who made preorders, complain about the exact same things people talk here. Worst, people there talk about the fact Sincere Hobby (i.e AMK) refuse to cancel preorders and refund them. So no, if AMK release this kit as it is now, it will not end well, I don't think free kits for reviewers will hide the truth this time. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Gun_Metal Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 I am looking forward to a side-by-side review of Tamiya vs AMK vs GWH in this year 😄 It will be a lot of fun. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Solo Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 This year? 😄 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Laurent Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 3 minutes ago, Solo said: This year? 😄 In 2020 perhaps ? I may have missed something but I didn't see anything about the GWH project for a long time. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
madcop Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 22 hours ago, Darren Roberts said: I'm not defending the model at all. It is what it is. I'm merely stating a fact that from a production/cost point of view, they aren't going to change all of the listed items because only a very small minority of builders will really care about it. There are errors with every kit released. There are things that could have been done better with every kit released. I can knitpick the Tamiya kit like you wouldn't believe. I never expected AMK to change anything because of above stated reasons. It should surprise no one that it's not been changed. The reason this has blown up in AMK's face is because they made the claim this would be the best Tomcat ever and then kept delaying. If they simply released it, people would have been much more forgiving and much happier with the final result. They would have noted the errors and moved on. Look at the Academy F-4. There are a myriad of errors, but you don't see 173 pages hashing it out over and over again. People still think it's a decent kit, even with the errors. That's what the AMK Tomcat should have been. Alas, we have this thread that never ends... Thanks for this Darren If it weren't for you and some other people who still have some good old common sense, we could believe this threat only concerns some mentally ill people….I think that this community deserves a better image. Madcop Quote Link to post Share on other sites
IAGeezer Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 (edited) 4 hours ago, Manuel J. Armas S. said: Ummm... Manuel, your red lines (for scale?) are off. Check the panels below the cockpit and behind the radome. Also, the camera angle is much different, enough to introduce optical distortion. PS: What Darren said... Edited April 30, 2019 by IAGeezer Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dustiepal Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 His red lines are not even close! Dave Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shion Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 2 hours ago, madcop said: Thanks for this Darren If it weren't for you and some other people who still have some good old common sense, we could believe this threat only concerns some mentally ill people….I think that this community deserves a better image. Madcop Is this really necessary? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Manuel J. Armas S. Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 2 hours ago, IAGeezer said: Ummm... Manuel, your red lines (for scale?) are off. Check the panels below the cockpit and behind the radome. Also, the camera angle is much different, enough to introduce optical distortion. PS: What Darren said... Yes, but the angle of IFR is off. The kit needs to be corrected Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Darren Roberts Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 5 hours ago, shion said: Take a look at their FB page, not the fanclub. People who made preorders, complain about the exact same things people talk here. Worst, people there talk about the fact Sincere Hobby (i.e AMK) refuse to cancel preorders and refund them. So no, if AMK release this kit as it is now, it will not end well, I don't think free kits for reviewers will hide the truth this time. You misunderstand my post. I never said it WOULD sell well. I said they THOUGHT it would sell well. It may very well end badly for them, and they would only have themselves to blame. With that said, if they went back and changed everything, do you think that would change anybody's mind? I would surmise very few. So it does them no good to fix anything. They probably wouldn't pick up enough sales to recoup the cost. They are in a very difficult (self-imposed!) situation. Do nothing and get raked over the coals for not listening to input. Change the mistakes and delay the release even longer, and they lose more money. The best thing they can do is bring it market and let the market dictate what happens. The more they delay, the worse it gets. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dylan Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 (edited) 59 minutes ago, shion said: Is this really necessary? Jeroen Burger aka the white knight has ridden to the rescue. as for Darren's comments I wholeheartedly agree. AMK claims that they are "working on the kit" but obviously they haven't changed/fixed anything. so the question I have been asking for many months now, why hasn't the kit been released? the molds are cut, the decals were done last September, the test shots were out a year ago. it just doesn't make any sense. I have said before that there is something else going on in the background, like AMK is the pet project of SIO and his dad owns the actual molding corporation. and dad only lets him do model stuff on his own time. Edited April 30, 2019 by dylan Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sleepy Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 Just now, dylan said: as for Darren's comments I wholeheartedly agree. AMK claims that they are "working on the kit" but obviously they haven't changed/fixed anything. The obviously haven’t changed/fixed anything that you’re aware of. From what I’ve heard there’s a whole LOT of the tooling that they’ve scrapped and started over on, most of which has never even been shown. I’m going to be really (really, really) surprised if this kit is anything but a total bomb. The Tamiya kit is superb, and the GWH kit is more than likely to be superb. Sadly their 1/72 kit is due out before their 1/48 kit, but probably sometime later this year. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dylan Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 4 minutes ago, Sleepy said: From what I’ve heard there’s a whole LOT of the tooling that they’ve scrapped and started over on, most of which has never even been shown. where did you hear that? if that is the case then why has the ifr probe door not been fixed? the rear fuselage is still wrong and the easiest of all fixes would be the aft end of the TARPS pod. all of these issues have not been dealt with. as far as I can tell there has been no retooling at all. I will be happy to have AMK prove me wrong. I am not going to hold my breath Quote Link to post Share on other sites
shion Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 19 minutes ago, Darren Roberts said: You misunderstand my post. I never said it WOULD sell well. I said they THOUGHT it would sell well. It may very well end badly for them, and they would only have themselves to blame. With that said, if they went back and changed everything, do you think that would change anybody's mind? I would surmise very few. So it does them no good to fix anything. They probably wouldn't pick up enough sales to recoup the cost. They are in a very difficult (self-imposed!) situation. Do nothing and get raked over the coals for not listening to input. Change the mistakes and delay the release even longer, and they lose more money. The best thing they can do is bring it market and let the market dictate what happens. The more they delay, the worse it gets. My post isn't about "sell well", but "end well". If they release the kit as it is now, it will impact their image, which was already not the best before and became worse with this Tomcat's kit and the numerous PR stunts they performed. And I talk about an impact with the public, and with the distributors and shops. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
madmanrick Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 Darren, I respect what you have to say and I agree wholeheartedly with most, if not all you have had to say. However, trying to beat back this mob is fruitless work at best. The ironic part about most of the detractors here, is that as I have pointed out many times, almost to a man (person) they not only haven't got any skin in the game, they would not have purchased this kit under any circumstances. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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