sharkmouth Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 (edited) I am publishing these photographs for a discussion on the subject, Trumpeter's 48th scale MiG-23BN. Please refrain from posting opinions of the company since it is not the reason for this post. The best critical responses are those that are constructive. Feel free to use these photographs and write on them to discuss points on the kit (as long as my copyright is acknowledged and not covered up, obliterated, or cropped out). Next ten following... Regards, Edited November 13, 2015 by sharkmouth Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sharkmouth Posted November 13, 2015 Author Share Posted November 13, 2015 As I wrote before. I am publishing these photographs for a discussion on the subject, Trumpeter's 48th scale MiG-23BN. Please refrain from posting opinions of the company since it is not the reason for this post. Feel free to use these photographs and write on them to discuss points on the kit (as long as my copyright is acknowledged and not covered up, obliterated, or cropped out). Next ten: The next set will be of the decals, PE , and some details. After that, I will cut and tape together the parts to get an idea how a build will look. Regards, Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jennings Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 Thanks for posting! What a terrible shame. The kit will require a completely new fuselage (or at least a new front end) and a new canopy, and thus probably a new cockpit in order to be remotely accurate. The only MiG-23 variant I was really interested in. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Dmanton300 Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 Did they even LOOK at a Mig-23BN before tooling this?!? Utterly worthless. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jennings Posted November 13, 2015 Share Posted November 13, 2015 Trumpeter's committment to quality. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
zerosystem Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 did you guys even bother to read the post? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wayfarer 30 Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 (edited) Thanks for sharing Saul. I look forward to receiving my kit on Tuesday. It will be Way better than my ESCI kit. Question, did they ever place R-73's on the BN? I noticed they included them. Also, I noticed they included an IP on the vertical stab sprue, and fuselage sprue. Which one is used in the build? Thanks again Mike Edited November 14, 2015 by Wayfarer 30 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mingwin Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 thank you for posting those photos of the sprues can't wait to see more... particularly curious to see how the canopy/nose shape is. (see if its as it was pictured on their instructions...) do you also own any other Trumpeter mig-23 kit to compare some sprues, sees if there is any changes or improvements? thanks again Saul for this thread. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andre Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 Question, did they ever place R-73's on the BN? I noticed they included them. AFAIK: no. These are leftovers from other kitted versions, like the undrnose IR seekeers on the clear sprue. Cheers, Andre Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wayfarer 30 Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 (edited) AFAIK: no. These are leftovers from other kitted versions, like the undrnose IR seekeers on the clear sprue. Cheers, Thanks Andre, I was wondering about that. Not as bad as KH including them in the MiG-25 kit I guess😉 Edited November 14, 2015 by Wayfarer 30 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andre Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 Not as bad as KH including them in the MiG-25 kit I guess😉 Well,some sources claim that the MiG-25 can carry the R-73... Cheers, Andre Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Wayfarer 30 Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 Well,some sources claim that the MiG-25 can carry the R-73... Cheers, Andre 😲 wow. I did not realize that. Thanks for informing me. Mike Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andre Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 😲 wow. I did not realize that. Thanks for informing me. Well, just because some sources claim something, like Gershwin already said - "It Ain't Necessarily So". One of the sources also claims the MiG-25 can carry the R-23 Apex, for instance... Cheers, Andre Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Laurent Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 see if its as it was pictured on their instructions... Bulged top nose is there, so is the sloping down canopy base and the not-so-sloping down windscreen base. Real thing ref Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sharkmouth Posted November 14, 2015 Author Share Posted November 14, 2015 do you also own any other Trumpeter mig-23 kit to compare some sprues, sees if there is any changes or improvements? I do and I might. Photos coming... my apologies but I took a moment of silence for the events in Paris. Regards, Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sharkmouth Posted November 14, 2015 Author Share Posted November 14, 2015 (edited) Decals, PE, and some details... More to come... Edited November 14, 2015 by sharkmouth Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sharkmouth Posted November 14, 2015 Author Share Posted November 14, 2015 Last set: Regards, Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Laurent Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 Thanks Saul ! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sharkmouth Posted November 14, 2015 Author Share Posted November 14, 2015 (edited) Did they even LOOK at a Mig-23BN before tooling this?!? Utterly worthless. Drewe, I have this kit in my hands, paid for by me, posted the photographs for all to see, and the LAST thing I am interested is in 'worthless' comments from anyone. Why not tell me what you see wrong? This is what I want and the reason I stated in my original post; Please refrain from posting opinions of the company since it is not the reason for this post. The best critical responses are those that are constructive. If this kit was yours, what would you do to fix it? Don't tell me I wasted my money without an explanation. It was mine to spend and a simple thank you for helping you not spend your money would be far better than what you wrote. I buy kits like Kitty Hawk, Trumpeter, and so on because the subjects released are of interest to me and better than what was out there previously. I do get burned. While I have the satisfaction of correcting my Foxbat, it seems that AMK will have a far better one before I complete the work on my kit. Could the reason for another company to agree to release another kit of a subject recently released be that they saw the responses (with what was wrong) on the original kit? How did these responses come about? Simply by looking at CAD images or photographs for the real kit sprues with constructive criticism? Had only successful builds come about, would AMK even care about releasing the MiG-25? Trumpeter's committment to quality. Jennings, I had hoped better from your response. I don't mind it when you point out what you see wrong. Even the disappointment you related is fine since you have a personal desire to build a model of this subject (as I do). Again, if this kit was yours, what would you do to fix it? Question, did they ever place R-73's on the BN? I noticed they included them.Also, I noticed they included an IP on the vertical stab sprue, and fuselage sprue. Which one is used in the build? Mike, I don't know of the MiG-23BN using the R-73. They are there because Trumpeter is re-using many of the weapons sprues. For example, the WE sprue (of which four are included in the kit) was first seen by me in their Su-24 kit. The IP on the Fuselage sprue (Sprue A) is specific to the MiG-23BN. I am not stating it is accurate but specific to this release. See the new photos I posted for a close up. ... particularly curious to see how the canopy/nose shape is. (see if its as it was pictured on their instructions...)do you also own any other Trumpeter mig-23 kit to compare some sprues, sees if there is any changes or improvements? Images posted Simon. I didn't post any comparisons as the MiG-23 sprues are unaltered. Sprue A was swapped with the MiG-23BN specific Sprue A concerning the fuselage, nose and instrument panel. Sprues E (specific to ground attack variant details) and Sprue Q (ground attack variant canopy & windscreen) are also new tool. Sprues B, C1, C2, D, F, L, M1 (clear sprue included for light lenses), N, WB, and WC are unaltered from previous releases. Two sprues labeled WA with the R-23 are replaced with four sprues labeled WE with bombs and triple ejector racks (TERs). Regards, Edited November 15, 2015 by sharkmouth Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ya-gabor Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 Hi Sharkmouth? Well if you take a look at the side view of the nose section that you have posted and the side view of the real aircraft few post above, the main problem of the overall nose contours will be evident. What to do about this????? A lot of work to make it almost in line as on the BN. If I remember right the 27K had a more rounded (so it could be that they are preparing for that and will have the same nose part) top to the nose section. Sorry I could not give much support for this project . . . Best regards Gabor Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Andrea Bolla Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 Why not tell me what you see wrong? This is what I want and the reason I stated in my original post; Nose and canopy profile totally wrong: kit upper nose is curved till the canopy and the canopy bottom is not parallel to the fuselage datum I would try a major surgery of the nose to correct the profile: Canopy need reworks too... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
sharkmouth Posted November 14, 2015 Author Share Posted November 14, 2015 (edited) Sorry I could not give much support for this project . . . Gabor, actually, you have. You stated why you think it will be hard. Looking at Sprue E (Ground Attack variant details), we find parts molded for the MiG-27 series (seen below) so perhaps this will be their target? Nose and canopy profile totally wrong: kit upper nose is curved till the canopy and the canopy bottom is not parallel to the fuselage datum I would try a major surgery of the nose to correct the profile: Canopy need reworks too... Thank you Andrea. I will check to see if the top of the nose line is straight. Since it is from an angle, it may be why you see the curve. While a new canopy was included, it does seem like it is not enough since the windscreen won't match the canopy after corrections. [EDIT - looking again at my other images, the curve is there...] Regards, Edited November 14, 2015 by sharkmouth Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jennings Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 The entire front end of the fuselage, canopy, windshield, and nose are COMPLETELY wrong. Look at any photo of a MiG-23BN. What "better" response were you hoping for? If you want me to praise an utterly worthless waste of effort by Trumpeter, you're going to be disappointed. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ya-gabor Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 Hi Saul, Sorry I did not plan for this project. Few weeks ago I was in Prague with the compulsory visit to the Kbely museum. :) :) They have a front section of the aircraft. Sorry I was more preoccupied with the ejection seat :) in it and with the fine details instead of overall dimensions and outlines. :( It would have been so easy to put a straigh piece of wood/metal/anything on top of the nose to show what it should look like. Best regards Gabor Quote Link to post Share on other sites
mingwin Posted November 14, 2015 Share Posted November 14, 2015 thank you Saul for answering my questions and posting those nice photos. much appreciated. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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