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Zoukei-mura 1/48 F-4J Phantom II


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36 minutes ago, randypandy831 said:

I just don't see these selling like hot cakes since most of the phantom guys have hasegawa and academy kits in the stash. 

i've got 5 hasegawa phantoms and 3 academy ones, and the only thing that prevent me from buying  many of the ZM phantoms is the price... and the rather limited (and esoterical) distribution... when it'll be available in places like HobbyEasy, i'll get at least one of every variant ZM bring! ...and maybe more if the price is (more) reasonable...

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8 hours ago, randypandy831 said:

I just don't see these selling like hot cakes since most of the phantom guys have hasegawa and academy kits in the stash. 

I disagree. I have both makers kits in the stash and am eliminating them, in favor of the Z-M kits. I have 2 J's already on pre-order and will probably get an S when it released. For me it seems to be more cost effective to buy the Z-M kit for $75, than say an Academy for $40 and then add another $40-$50 in aftermarket.

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On 11/21/2016 at 2:19 AM, JeffreyK said:

Ok, here are some issues with the Academy kit:

  • Nose A/C intake wrong shape and wrong position (too low)
  • radome joint line is vertical where on the real one it should be perpendicular to the radome centreline, which is pointing downwards
  • canopy proportions wrong - front one too short, rear one too long and too narrow, very thick plastic, possible issue with armoured glass part
  • scribing on main wing tops not correct for the "B" version
  • lower wing part has "wobbly" surface on the thick wing versions (never established whether it's a tooling or manufacturing issue)
  • horizontal stabilators (both slotted and unslotted) have wrong proportions of the painted vs. unpainted areas and many completely fictional panel lines
  • slotted stabilators have got the leading edge connecting tabs perpendicular to the leading edge, while they should be in line with the airflow
  • tail section between the stabs ill-shaped - it should be a smooth shallow curve in plan view with vertical sides, the kit has all sorts of shapes going on there and is a bit too thin as well
  • refuelling probe door position a bit off, missing refuelling light
  • aft cockpit bulkhead should be vertical, not slanted in line with the ejection seat rails 
  • no Mk. H5 seats contained in the kit (although for a '71/72 VF-111 the H7 seats are likely correct)

For me, the stabilators, tail, canopy and A/C intakes are the biggest visible issues.

Jeffrey

God! Makes me want to toss it in a wood chipper........

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5 hours ago, adamitri said:

Still havent figured out why someone hasnt made a resin update for the academy kits.

Well, it is true that nobody has produced a "comprehensive" resin set, there are a number of updates made by individual resin companies. Hypersonic makes a number of corrections to fix the Academy Phantom kits. The canopy hasn't been fixed by anybody that I know of and at the end of the day you have to decide if the issues are important to you. If you decide they are, then you are probably better off with the Z-M kit imho.

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18 hours ago, randypandy831 said:

I just don't see these selling like hot cakes since most of the phantom guys have hasegawa and academy kits in the stash. 

 

IMO it doesn't matter which kits or both of the Hasegawa & Academy kits we have. Most will still purchase this kit-especially if it's better/more correct out of the box. Part of the fun of this hobby is to have much variety when at all possible. Granted, a lot of builders will buy based on lowest price no matter which new kit is released * might be deemed to be better. I have about 25 1/48 Hasegawa Phantoms, 10 Academy & just as many 1/32 Tamiya & Revell Phantoms. I will still purchase this kit. YMMV.

 

Semper Fi,

Masterguns

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23 hours ago, randypandy831 said:

I just don't see these selling like hot cakes since most of the phantom guys have hasegawa and academy kits in the stash. 

 

That same thing could be said about the F-14, but the Tamiya Tomcat, even being on the pricey side, has sold a whole bunch in just the first couple of months of sales. I've personally bought four and will be getting more. They are that good!

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I have not put together a Phantom build in many years.....maybe even 20 years (Hasegawa F-4E Late), but I think this kit will be one to buy when it lands in the USA. Growing up enamored with the F-4, I sure hope they expand on the complete series to include gun phantoms and RAF/RN birds as well.

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18 hours ago, madmanrick said:

Well, it is true that nobody has produced a "comprehensive" resin set, there are a number of updates made by individual resin companies. Hypersonic makes a number of corrections to fix the Academy Phantom kits. The canopy hasn't been fixed by anybody that I know of and at the end of the day you have to decide if the issues are important to you. If you decide they are, then you are probably better off with the Z-M kit imho.

What i was getting at was a resin set to make it an E or a G.

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1 hour ago, adamitri said:

What i was getting at was a resin set to make it an E or a G.

That would be quite a comprehensive and expensive set then. You'll need a completely new forward fuselage, cockpit, wing slats, wing fences, pylons and all the smaller details like aerials and antennas etc. I'd just add some details to the Hasegawa kits. Or wait for a new kit.

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On 11/26/2016 at 7:34 AM, adamitri said:

I am just waiting for the "E" and "G" kits to come around. Still havent figured out why someone hasnt made a resin update for the academy kits.

 

I can think of a bunch of reasons:

 

  • it would take hundreds of hours to develop the masters
  • it would take a ton of rubber and resin to produce the parts
  • so the retail price would easily top $200, probably closer to $500
  • Academy will probably release the subject themselves
  • ZM have said they will release the subject themselves
  • Hasegawa have already released the subject
  • there is a crap-ton of aftermarket already for the Hasegawa kit
  • you can add all of it to a Hasegawa kit for less than what a conversion would cost
  • Hasegawa + aftermarket is probably better than the Academy kit anyway
  • even if Academy and ZM *don't* do an E, you probably couldn't sell more than a handful of $500 conversions
  • there is basically zero reason to invest that much time, effort and money into THAT big of a risk when you could just release a few simpler detail sets that will sell in bigger numbers, instead
  • seriously.  it'd be nice to see an Academy E, but in the real world, *nobody* is paying for an aftermarket conversion to get one.
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6 hours ago, Pete said:

That would be quite a comprehensive and expensive set then. You'll need a completely new forward fuselage, cockpit, wing slats, wing fences, pylons and all the smaller details like aerials and antennas etc. I'd just add some details to the Hasegawa kits. Or wait for a new kit.

I forgot about about most of those. Lack of coffee. At least thats the excuse i will use.

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32 minutes ago, adamitri said:

Lack of coffee. At least thats the excuse i will use.

 

That's always a good excuse, I use it too, sometimes.

bth_smiley_drinkcoffee.gif

Edited by Pete
giraffes
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I'm going to skip this one, spent some time looking at the photos, I don't think it captures the the look of a phantom that well. The most obvious issue to me is the transition between the spine and fuselage around the exhaust area.

 

There is the line between the spine and the fuselage, on the kit it doesn't really blend in till right below the beginning of the vertical tail:

Zoukei-Mura-F-4J-Phantom-1-48-Nuremberg-

On the real thing the line starts to blend in before the end of wing root, after that it's pretty much smooth curved surface only(no clear line to be seen):

1280px-F-4_Phantom_II_VF-301.jpg

 

Hasegawa and Academy look better in this regard:

f-4b_04.jpg

 

Sure there must be other improvements in shape, like The intakes looks very good indeed(but the intake duct is misshapen), but the overall shape seems to be worse or at least not better than the hasegawa kit IMO. 


The airfix phantam looks very good(check their latest workbench article), I think it's far easier to nail the shape with the help of LIDAR then with 2D drawing/photos, shame it's the wrong scale for
me though.

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Hmm, interesting observation. It looks like you're correct, hard to tell how misshapen it is without a kit in hand though. The scab plate/doubler on top of the vertical fin looks a little overly thick too. That comparison photo reminds me just how awful Academy's stabilators are...Looks like all kits still maintain their pros and cons...

Edited by Nathant
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5 hours ago, phantomdriver said:

sorry yo are both wrong....

My  kit has the correct rear slope towards the cans, what you are basing it on, is a pre production model

as for the scab plate, I can't see any such issue...

 

Can you post a good photo of the fuselage from your kit? From what I've seen on the ZM blogs it looks like the crease extends the same as the test shots. 

 

As for the scab plate on the V-Stab, it looks like it was tooled proud of the surrounding surface. This is a flush access panel on the real aircraft. It is also molded on the right side of the V-Stab which isn't there on the real aircraft either. 

 

One thing that catches my eye is how thick the main landing gear trunnion cover is on the upper wing surface. 

 

This definitely looks like a nice kit of the F-4J but I'd like to see a few more details before labeling it the perfect kit of the Phantom II.

 

Cheers,

 

John

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9 hours ago, delide said:

I'm going to skip this one, spent some time looking at the photos, I don't think it captures the the look of a phantom that well. The most obvious issue to me is the transition between the spine and fuselage around the exhaust area.

There is the line between the spine and the fuselage, on the kit it doesn't really blend in till right below the beginning of the vertical tail:

On the real thing the line starts to blend in before the end of wing root, after that it's pretty much smooth curved surface only(no clear line to be seen):

Hasegawa and Academy look better in this regard:

Sure there must be other improvements in shape, like The intakes looks very good indeed(but the intake duct is misshapen), but the overall shape seems to be worse or at least not better than the hasegawa kit IMO. 

The airfix phantam looks very good(check their latest workbench article), I think it's far easier to nail the shape with the help of LIDAR then with 2D drawing/photos, shame it's the wrong scale for
me though.

 

 

Two things.

 

First, from someone that actually has a kit in hand and not relying on photos, I can tell you with 100% certainty that the blend begins at the end of the wing root.

 

Second, the overall shape is much more accurate than what Hasegawa and Academy have done. I would suggest looking at photos of the built up model instead of grainy photos of a test shot.

 

Having spent the better part of four months pouring over hundreds of photos while designing decal sheets for the kit, as well as comparing it to the Hasegawa and Academy kits in my collection, I am convinced that Z-M has captured the look of the Phantom better than any other manufacturer to date. No, it may not be perfect. However, it is better than all of the other kits available.

 

11204410_1757502187844732_24673094806807

 

14724356_1759936207601330_76897094331566

 

14716359_1759936237601327_64483876876252

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