11bee Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 Recently, I was pondering building a large-scale AD-4N Skyraider. As part of some upfront gathering of information on this project, I was a bit surprised to find that there really isn't much out there from a modeling standpoint for Korean War subjects. Very few aftermarket decals and not nearly as many kits as one would have thought. The subject hasn't been completely ignored by kit manufacturers but I still would have thought there would be more out there. Just look at aftermarket decals. Hundreds of decals for ETO P-51's, next to nothing for Korean War F-51D's. Same applies for Corsairs. Go into a Barnes and Noble. WW2, Vietnam and our current conflicts are very well covered. At best maybe 3-4 books on the shelf about Korean War subjects. What is it about the Korean conflict that drives this lack of interest? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tony Stark Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 (edited) Korea has been called a “forgotten war” since at least October 1951 when U.S. News & World Report gave it that moniker. In reality, Americans did not so much forget the Korean War as never think about it at all. When the war first broke out, people worried that American involvement would usher in the same type of rationing and full mobilization that had characterized the Second World War. That failed to occur and within a few months most Americans turned back to their own lives, ignoring the conflict raging half a world away. About one-fourth of Korean War veterans also served in World War II and many went on to serve in the Vietnam War. Perhaps the most distinctive characteristic of the Korean War generation is their silence. Veterans of both World War II and the Vietnam War came back to talk about what they did and to form and join veterans organizations, but Korean War veterans came home and tried to pick up their old lives and forget their wartime experiences. And because both WW2 and Vietnam were "larger" conflicts (WW2 in size, Vietnam in duration), there simply were fewer vets who served only in the Korean War. This has manifested itself within the pop culture zeitgeist, as we're brow-beaten by books, movies and TV series set in WW2 and Vietnam. Band of Brothers, Saving Private Ryan. The Pacific... Part of that is, in no small way, because Hitler and the Nazis are the perfect villains. They're real, they did horrible things, anyone shouting in German sounds extra bad, and even to this day, there are people who identify with them. You couldn't write better villains if you tried. And in fact, some of the best cinematic baddies are modeled on Nazis. With Vietnam, this phenomenon was even more pronounced in the two decades that followed that war. First Blood (a totally different movie from both the book and it's sequels), Platoon, Tour of Duty, China Beach, Bat 21, Hamburger Hill, Casualties of War, We Were Soldiers, Apocalypse Now, Full Metal Jacket, The Deer Hunter, Born on the Fourth of July, Good Morning Vietnam, Rescue Dawn, Tigerland, Forrest Gump, Flight of the Intruder, Air America, etc... There was a lot of money to be made from telling those stories. And it got so big that, screw history. 1980's The Final Countdown provides an "AMERICA! F-YEAH!" catharsis by suggesting that F-14s would avenge the attack on Pearl Harbor (directly responsible for the masturbatory reaction that so many modelers have towards Jolly Rogers Tomcats. As a squadron, they don't have a particularly distinctive history, but they're movie stars, so now it's "ERMAGERD! JRRY RGERZZ"). 1984's Missing in Action and 1985's Rambo: First Blood Part 2 retroactively "wins" the Vietnam War for us barely a decade after the fall of Saigon. That was easier to do so soon afterwards because the war was still on the minds of the Americans Because the Korean War never technically ended, and because it's been a lifetime ago, one cannot apply this same application of Hollywood heroics to North Korea. Instead, the hermit kingdom has been relegated to be object of ridicule. Today, 63 years after the cease fire, the Korean War is something that ran for 11 seasons and had a couple of spin-offs. Within American culture, WW2, the Vietnam War, the Civil War, Iraq 2003 and Afghanistan will be our most "remembered" wars. The 1991 Gulf War will end up in a similar category as Korea as a "forgotten war." It was short, there weren't a lot of casualties, it was a clear and decisive victory, the American people had a "hero" in Gen. Schwarzkopf. In many ways, it exorcised the demons of the Vietnam War. in fact, this "purging" has already started to happen. Over in the AI thread, the topic has shifted to a variation preaching "don't forget the lessons of Vietnam." while simultaneously, totally ignoring the lessons of the Gulf War Edited July 3, 2016 by Tony Stark Quote Link to post Share on other sites
fulcrum1 Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 Much has been written about why the forgotten war was forgotten. In the Shadows of the Greatest Generation, the author does justice to this topic if you want to read about it. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChesshireCat Posted July 3, 2016 Share Posted July 3, 2016 Recently, I was pondering building a large-scale AD-4N Skyraider. As part of some upfront gathering of information on this project, I was a bit surprised to find that there really isn't much out there from a modeling standpoint for Korean War subjects. Very few aftermarket decals and not nearly as many kits as one would have thought. The subject hasn't been completely ignored by kit manufacturers but I still would have thought there would be more out there. Just look at aftermarket decals. Hundreds of decals for ETO P-51's, next to nothing for Korean War F-51D's. Same applies for Corsairs. Go into a Barnes and Noble. WW2, Vietnam and our current conflicts are very well covered. At best maybe 3-4 books on the shelf about Korean War subjects. What is it about the Korean conflict that drives this lack of interest? I stand with you! Had Tamiya or ZM came out with a Korean War Corsair or Mustang; I been all over it! I'd love to do an accurate A26 Invader in a Korean War theme. Never liked the Monogram kit, as it just looks wrong to my eyes. Then they come out with 1/32 scale F86 Sabers, but the wrong airframes for Korea. There are a few choices in the armor category, but still not a huge inventory. Asuka did a Korean War M4a3e8, and Tamiya, Dragon, and Hobby boss all do M26's. There are several arty pieces, and you can use WWII figures for the most part. But still lacking in my book. gary Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Jay Chladek Posted July 4, 2016 Share Posted July 4, 2016 If I had to guess, it probably is due to the perceived appeal of air to air fighters compared to air to ground. The P-51D of WW-2 has a mystique about it since it was the allies air superiority escort fighter. By the time it got to Korea, it became a bomb truck. By comparison, the F-86 and the MiG-15 get fairly good coverage in kits and aftermarket due to them being used in aerial combat. Kit manufacturers likely see that in kit sales as I imagine in the case of companies who have done both P-51D and F-51D variants (Tamiya in 1/48 and Airfix in 1/72), the WW2 era P-51s likely sell better while the F-51s tend to sit on the shelf for a longer period of time. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
11bee Posted July 4, 2016 Author Share Posted July 4, 2016 (edited) If I had to guess, it probably is due to the perceived appeal of air to air fighters compared to air to ground. The P-51D of WW-2 has a mystique about it since it was the allies air superiority escort fighter. By the time it got to Korea, it became a bomb truck. By comparison, the F-86 and the MiG-15 get fairly good coverage in kits and aftermarket due to them being used in aerial combat. Kit manufacturers likely see that in kit sales as I imagine in the case of companies who have done both P-51D and F-51D variants (Tamiya in 1/48 and Airfix in 1/72), the WW2 era P-51s likely sell better while the F-51s tend to sit on the shelf for a longer period of time. From a modeling standpoint, I'd have to say you are right. It's too bad. The F-51 in Korea took horrific losses because it really wasn't the best platform for those missions. Brave pilots but I guess they didn't have the "cool factor" of the pilots flying the same aircraft during wW2. Stark - you are dead on about Korean vets not really talking. I've met more than a few and they all have this trait (most combat vets do but Korean vets more so it seems). Met an older gent at a few family cookouts. Quiet guy, he mentioned once he was a Marine. Chatted with him each time I saw him, he talked about partying in Japan, antics at Camp Lejune and stuff like this. Finally after quite a long time, he mentioned in passing that he spent a bit of time in Korea. I asked where, he said a place called Chosin. The guy was an infantryman at Chosin Reservoir. He seemed shocked that I even heard of the place. He wouldn't talk about the battle except that it was "pretty cold" and mentioned that out of approx 300 troops in his company who deployed from Lejune, less than a dozen of the original guys made it onto the evacuation ship. He wasn't one of them, he was wounded a week into the retreat and medevaced out. That's all he ever said on the subject and I wasn't going to push for more. Edited July 4, 2016 by 11bee Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Fubuki4 Posted July 5, 2016 Share Posted July 5, 2016 Modelling wise, there isn't a lot of diversity for colour schemes. You've got a majority of aircraft silver, blue, black and the RN aircraft in EDSG and duck egg. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Scotsman Posted July 5, 2016 Share Posted July 5, 2016 Its funny this topic coming up now , I've been working on a project to build as many 32nd Korean war allied aircraft as I can for some time now , It started with the Fisher Panther, and has gone on to F4U-4, Skyraider, Sabre, AT-6d , Seafire 47, F-80 lurking on the horizon is an F-51D and F-84 .. and if Paul Fisher ever gets his Firefly released I'm in for that too.. nor to mention a Banshee... Ah well I can only dream! If someone would just Produce a B-26 as well, I'd be a Very happy bunny The whole "forgotten War" thing is odd, to me the Korean war is very much the transition between WWII tactics and the coming of the jet age, ColinR Quote Link to post Share on other sites
11bee Posted July 5, 2016 Author Share Posted July 5, 2016 Modelling wise, there isn't a lot of diversity for colour schemes. You've got a majority of aircraft silver, blue, black and the RN aircraft in EDSG and duck egg. As opposed to all those really interesting OD over grey or natural metal USAAC color schemes from WW2? From an AF perspective, unit markings were just as colorful as their WW2 counterparts, same for personal markings. I'll agree on US Navy / Marine aircraft (pretty much any color scheme you like as long as it's gloss sea blue) but they have always been pretty tame, at least from a personal markings standpoint. I just watched "Bridges at Toko-Ri" a few weeks back, maybe that's why I'm so gung-ho about Korean War subjects. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
D Bellis Posted July 5, 2016 Share Posted July 5, 2016 What "Korean War"? ;) ;) ;) D Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Finn Posted July 5, 2016 Share Posted July 5, 2016 In the mean time, some aircraft related Life pics of the Korean War to look over: http://images.google.com/hosted/life/9b59cf81b4e4fece.html http://images.google.com/hosted/life/78013a81a049dd1a.html http://images.google.com/hosted/life/c541bb3d80b7d88f.html http://images.google.com/hosted/life/ec66bd78268812bb.html keep on clicking on the thumbnails under Related images for more photos. Jari Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ChippyWho Posted July 5, 2016 Share Posted July 5, 2016 It seems to me that the Vietnam war has a bigger profile in 'popular' history, but personally I'm all over the Korean air subjects! Shooting Stars, Thunderjets, Sabres and Panthers -what's not to like?! First jet-on-jet kill, flashy markings* and guys transitioning from service in WWII to a very different arena. Not so much 'forgotten' as underrated! (*For example, check out Quiddy's brilliant F-84G right here... :wub: ) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
11bee Posted July 5, 2016 Author Share Posted July 5, 2016 I'll add some pics as well: F-51's galore. Had to be a brave guy to fly these things in combat. No chrome-like faux finishes on models of these aircraft. I've been yearning to building a 1/32 F-51 just so I could take a crack at a heavily weathered NMF finish. IMO, that's one of the hardest finishes to replicate. https://jetpilotoverseas.wordpress.com/category/f-51-mustang/page/3/ Nice shot of a Marine jet. Note the interesting weathering to the GSB finish. Never seen this replicated on a model either. https://navypilotoverseas.wordpress.com/ By the way, both of these sites are well worth perusing. Some really nice pics of 40-60's USN and USAF aircraft. Neither site has been updated in a while so I'd check them out while you can. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
11bee Posted July 5, 2016 Author Share Posted July 5, 2016 I'll add some pics as well: F-51's galore. https://jetpilotoverseas.wordpress.com/category/f-51-mustang/page/3/ Had to be a brave guy to fly these things in combat. No chrome-like faux finishes on models of these aircraft. I've been yearning to building a 1/32 F-51 just so I could take a crack at a heavily weathered NMF finish. IMO, that's one of the hardest finishes to replicate. Nice shot of a Marine jet. Note the interesting weathering to the GSB finish. Never seen this replicated on a model either. https://navypilotoverseas.wordpress.com/ By the way, both of these sites are well worth perusing. Some really nice pics of 40-60's USN and USAF aircraft. Neither site has been updated in a while so I'd check them out while you can. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Don Posted July 6, 2016 Share Posted July 6, 2016 Lots of great nose art to be found on aircraft (and tanks!) from the Korean War. My favorite F-86 nose art...the ever popular "The Huff": Corsair nose art...love that snake: And come on...I know this is ARC but the art on these tanks trumps all IMO: Good stuff! As to why Korea doesn't get the love that other wars get in the modeling community...I have no idea. I dabble in it every now and again but my interests are spread throughout many subjects and eras. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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