Airbrush issue (Iwata HP-CS Eclipse)

[galileo1]

Hi all,

 

I consider myself pretty informed when it comes to airbrushes and the mechanics normally involved but I'm having an issue I just cannot solve, no matter what I do.

 

The just of it is, my Iwata Eclipse sprays fluid when the needle is fully closed.  From experience, having this issue usually means two main things...1) the nozzle is split/broken/damaged somehow or 2) a bent needle.

 

I replaced the nozzle and the needle with brand new parts but fluid still comes out when the needle is supposed to be fully closed.  When I insert the needle, I push it all the way until I feel it touch the nozzle.  I don't know what else may be going on at this point!  Is there something I'm missing?  Is there something that isn't aligned properly?

 

I took the entire airbrush apart to check on the components but nothing seems out of the ordinary.  I even checked the nozzle and needle for damage under magnification and I don't seen anything.

 

Anything anyone could think of?

 

Thanks!

[Bob Beary]

Unlikely..but did you tighten the needle locking nut? I've had the same AB for years and never had that issue. I also put bees wax on all the threads to ease disassembly and to seal the areas.

 

Again..unlikely, but is something stopping the needle from seating all the way forward? Just because it feels seated doesn't necessarily mean it is seated.

 

Let us know what the solution is.

 

Bob

Edited October 13, 2016 by Bob Beary
Additional info

[Thommo]

When my Iwata HP-CP does this, it is always because I have some gunk in there stopping the needle going fully forward.

 

It used to happen a bit because I cleaned out the colour cup with tissues, which deposited little fibres of tissue in there and eventually caused a tiny little wad of tissue in the nozzle or just behind it.  But the needle would still come through the end OK and look like it was seated.

 

Now I remove the nozzle and clean it by sticking a a few hairs of a course brush dipped in lacquer thinner through it and twirl them around.  I'm amazed at how often a tiny blob of gunk comes out.  I also fully clean/flush the section between the paint cup and where the nozzle screws on.  I also clean the needle in thinner and lubricate the end of it with the special lubricant.

 

These days I take the needle out via the front (by removing the needle nozzle) rather than by the back as that prevents dragging gunk right through the body of the airbrush.

 

I've also stopped using tissues in the paintcup - now clean it with an old piece of t-shirt which sheds less fibres.

Edited October 14, 2016 by Thommo

[Brutus]

Thommo has it covered as that was the exact issue I have regularly after a period of usage.
I keep forgetting not to use paper towels/tissues to clean the cup, so those tiny fibres will end of their way to the tip of the needle.

Do what he did and you should be spraying well after this.

[viper730]

having the same AB when I encounter this I simply remove the needle. and reinsert it. when I do I give the needle a few twists as I insert it to help it seat a bit better. I understand you have new parts but even so I would try it and see what happens. Just an FYI Iwata customer service has been very  helpful to me when I call...can't hurt to give them a try...

Good luck

Edited October 14, 2016 by viper730

[galileo1]

Thanks for the feedback guys.  The problem persists no matter what I do.  I ordered more new parts for this to see if it can rectify the issue.  There seems to clearly be some sort of alignment issue here but I can't tell where.  The airbrush is spotless (after having been cleaned like never before these past few days) so I'm hoping the parts solve this.

 

 

[Thommo]

The other thing I do sometimes is blast lacquer thinner or Vallejo airbrush cleaner, followed by water through it at 50 psi (I paint at just 15psi).  This has also helped clear stubborn bits of gunk.

 

Also, sometimes when I remove the needle to clean, the trigger mechanism does not quite seat properly when I re-assemble.  I always know when this is an issue as the trigger becomes a bit floppy.  I remove the needle again, push the trigger down a bit so it is in the correct position, then put the needle etc back in.  If I've got it right, the trigger has good resistance again right from the start of pulling it back. Could that be you problem?

[galileo1]

I went through every single thing you mentioned and checked every component multiple times.  I bought and tested a brand new nozzle and TWO brand new needles and the problem is still there.  There's no paint anywhere in this brush now and the trigger sits right.  It's just odd that I can't get it to work.  It's become so frustrating I'm about to through this thing in the bin!  I ordered a new nozzle cap and needle guard so I'm hoping this solves the issue.

 

Thanks for the help!

 

Rob

[Bob Beary]

The fact that you have tested multiple new parts leads me to believe that it is not the parts that are causing the problem.

 

The nozzle consists of two parts..a brass part and a very tiny chrome part that screws onto that. I never take that off as it is far to easy to lose. Is that part screwed tightly onto the brass part?

 

When I reassemble the A/B I seat the nozzle and loosely tighten the large threaded part that holds it in place, insert the needle all the way (but don't lock it in place) and then tighten it (the large threaded part) up all the way. I think it helps with any minor misalignment of the nozzle and its seating. This is very unlikely considering the precise fit of the parts. At this point you can see the tip of the nozzle (the chrome part) and the tip of the needle. Look at it under magnification....does the needle tip tightly fit into the opening?

 

I hope you get this sorted out as it is a very nice A/B

 

Bob

Edited October 17, 2016 by Bob Beary

[Bob Beary]

One more thought..do you by any chance have a mis-matched needle/nozzle combination?  Such as a 0.35 needle in a 0.5 nozzle?

[Thommo]

Yes, it sounds like for some reason the needle is not fully sealing inside that tiny little brass nozzle and so a little fluid can leak past it (I do remove that tiny noxxle with the little wrench they give you and clean it & always apply a little of the lubricant supplied to the front section of the needle).

 

But if you have brand new nozzle and needle, cleaning should not be the issue,  For some other reason the needle is not seating fully forward or as Bob suggests the needle is too small for the nozzle?

Edited October 17, 2016 by Thommo

[viper730]

Have you called Iwata. The AB has a 5 year warranty. Just a suggestion...........

[Janissary]

16 hours ago, galileo1 said:

I went through every single thing you mentioned and checked every component multiple times.  I bought and tested a brand new nozzle and TWO brand new needles and the problem is still there.  There's no paint anywhere in this brush now and the trigger sits right.  It's just odd that I can't get it to work.  It's become so frustrating I'm about to through this thing in the bin!  I ordered a new nozzle cap and needle guard so I'm hoping this solves the issue.

 

Thanks for the help!

 

Rob

 

I had a similar problem years ago. In my case, it was the trigger. Someone suggested that I put two drops of machine oil where the trigger pin seats at the air inlet of the A/B and that solved the problem.

[galileo1]

Thanks very much for the feedback, all!  As it turned out, the issue with it was the head.  Somehow it got damaged and wasn't letting the nozzle sit correctly.  Once I replaced the head it worked flawlessly again.

 

Rob

Edited October 19, 2016 by galileo1

[Thommo]

That's good news Rob.

 

I'm still stunned I put up with an A470 Aztek for 15yrs as my first AB.  My Iwata is so much easier to use, clean, change colours and trouble-shoot.

 

I was watching an old Brett Green video the other day and noticed his A470 was filthy.  Mine used to get like that as no matter what I did, it would clog and get paint blowing backwards thru everything requiring a warranty-voiding dismantle & clean.  The only things I did not try with it were:

 

1. Using Bunnings lacquer thinner to flush it;

2. Blasting cleaners thru it at 50psi.

 

I do both of These things with my Iwata and it runs smooth.  Maybe that is the trick for the Aztek?  But regardless, a plastic AB is much harder to keep clean than a metal one.  I now find myself using more enamel/lacquer based paints as the cleanup is faster and easier in the Iwata....and TBH they give a smoother finish than Tamiya acrylics even though those are still my mainstay paints.

Edited October 21, 2016 by Thommo

[Brutus]

Glad it turn out well for you Rob. I got 2 Iwata pieces and that's the best investment I ever did.

[galileo1]

Thanks again guys.  Coming to think of it, I may have over tighten the head cap when I out the airbrush back together.  This may have deformed the cap' ring - which butts against the nozzle.