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UH-1B question

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Does anyone know if this particular UH-1B, 14040, 1st Air Cav Div, Vietnam, 1966, 'Have Gun Will Travel' has the wide chord tail and 540 rotors or does it have the original tail and rotors?

 

Link to the Revell 1/24 kit with the same decal markings. The Revell kit has the original thin chord tail but was wondering if the real UH-1B had the new upgraded wide chord tail and 540 rotors? Thanks for any help you can provide.

https://www.cybermodeler.com/hobby/kits/rm/kit_rm_5633.shtml

 

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14040 was in the FY64 block.  I have a 540-B manual which states the PRODUCTION 540-Bs started with serial 64-14101 and subsequent.  However that's not 100% proof that 14040 didn't have the 540 rotor system.  One of the issues it seems is that some of the Bs were converted in RVN with just the 540 system and no fat tail, or later both the 540 system and fat tail, prior to full production.  This is an area of UH-1 history that needs more research.

 

John Hairell (tpn18@yahoo.com)

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Posted (edited)

Every illustration or reference to 64-14040 'Have Gun Will Travel' 1st Platoon, Battery C, 2nd Battalion, 20th Aerial Artillery, 1st Cavalry Division Airmobile, An Khe, RVN 1966 shows a standard B model in all respects. I've never seen it otherwise or seen photographic evidence that 2/20 ARA in 1966 was upgrading to Charlie model tails at that stage in RVN.

 

Note illustrator Don Greer got the tail number wrong in "Airmobile: The Helicopter War in Vietnam" 1984 but corrected it in the "Walk Around UH-1 Huey Gunships" 2004 both by Squadron Signal.

 

33481924266_df6fa7c63e_b.jpg

 

The late Pete Harlem did some of this research already when he published "The Huey: UH-IC Crewchief 1" in 1985 when he owned The Cobra Company

 

"Bell had experimented with a rigid rotor head on its YUH-lB (Model 533) test bed aircraft. The hub was much simpler in most all respects when compared to the standard Huey hub. It was stronger, required less maintenance, and provided the performance needed in the high-speed test aircraft. The same format rotor hub was fitted to a modified YUH-10 in 1964 and allowed this aircraft to break several world records for speed. The new hub on the YUH-10 was called the 540 Doorhinge rotor hub because the pivoting mechanism that provided blade pitch resembled a doorhinge. The hub worked so well that it was decided to add it to the UH-1B line.

 

To accommodate the new hub other changes were needed. The 540 rotor used 27 inch chord blades instead of the B model's 21 inch blades. The rotor diameter was unchanged at 44 ft 3.2 in, but with the bigger blades it yielded more lift. The new 540 B models would also get a more powerful engine since the new rotor would take the extra horses. The T53-L-5 (made by Lycoming) of the current Bs would be replaced by the T53-L-9 then in use in the UH-1D; ultimately the T53-L-11 would be used. With larger, heavier blades and 1100 shaft horsepower the new B would have a different torque curve, therefore the new Huey would need a different vertical stabilizer to offset the torque increase, and Bell added larger synchronized elevators. The new engine was a bit thirstier so more fuel was required in order to maintain loiter time. Fuel capacity would be changed from 165 gallons of JP-4 to 243 and this, plus the additional armament the new rotor could pull, added to the gross weight. For an increase in basic weight of about 300 pounds (4523 to 4827) the new B had increased gross weight by 1000 lbs (8500 to 9500 lbs).

 

The resulting aircraft looked like the UH-1B in most respects except for the new tail boom with large cambered fin and enlarged elevators . In fact, Bell would continue to refer to the new Huey as a UH-lB even after the Army changed its designation to UH-lC. Initial production batches carried the title UH-1B in their data block stencil even though they were UH-lC in all respects.

 

Some confusion exists on the part of Huey spotters since many photo captions misidentify the UH-1C as a UH-1B. Compounding the problem is that the B model suffered a number of crashes because of tail boom failures, and many received new booms after 1965. These were often replaced with Charlie model booms so it became impossible to use the enlarged fin as a recognition factor.

 

The larger sync elevators of the C model have an inverted airfoil shape when viewed on end while the B had symmetrical section elevators with a spanwise spoiler. Most B models with a C tail boom retain the early elevators. Serial numbers assigned to the UH-lC are listed in table 1.

 

TABLE 1: UH-lC SERIAL NUMBERS
64-14101 thru 14191 U.S . Army (USA)
64-17621 " 17623 Royal Australian
Navy (RAN)
65-9416 " 9564 USA
65-12738 " 12744 USA
65-12759 " 12764 USA
65-12772 RAN
65-12846 RAN
65-12853 thru 12856 Royal Norwegian
Air Force
66-491 " 745 USA
66-15000 11 15245 USA
66-15358 USA
66-15360 thru 15361 USA"

 

64-14040 would be a standard B IMHO.

Edited by snake36bravo

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Trust me, UH-1C 64-14101 was the first true UH-1C.  Have Gun Will Travel was a straight up B model.  It is possible she could have had a UH-1C tailboom replacement, but would have had none of the other UH-1C mods like 540 rotor, left handed fuel filler. roof mounted pitot or wide asymmetrical sync elevators.  Here are some pics that the group might find interesting. They are from Bell Helicopter and the US Army Aviation Museum.  

First off how about a good ole UH-1B.  This is UH-1B 64-14057 from Terry Love. This bird was one of the last few B models produced.  Note the number is later than Have Gun Will Travel.  She has all the standard UH-1B mods including narrow symmetrical sync elevator, narrow chord 204 main rotor, right handed fuel filler, and nose mounted pitot, narropw tail and single poistion light on the end of the tail.

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Here is the most elusive helo I have ever hunted for UH-1B 63-8684, a 540 B model.  She lacks the left handed fuel filler characteristic of true UH-1Cs and the tail is a highly modified UH-1B tail.  The missing left hand fuel filler is important because it was necessary to move the fuel filler to the left side when duel hydraulics were added to the UH-1C.  Both the pitot and sync elevators ahve been upgraded to the C model configurations though.  If you are very observant you may also notice that the position lights on the side of the tail found on the true UH-1C are also missing on the 540B.

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 No automatic alt text available.

 

Here's another pic of the 540B showing the right handed fuel filler:

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Here is the very first UH-1C 64-14101, known as Bearcat 4 by the Army Aviation Test Board.  You can clearly see the left hand fuel filler on this bird.  She also has all the other UH-1C mods, including the position light on the side of the tail.

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Here's 64-14101 on display at the Helena, Montana airport.  I visited her in 2015.

 

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Just for completeness here is a 2/20th ARA UH-1B armed with the M3 rocket system. She has a UH-1C tailboom replacement and this photo was clearly taken at Ft. Rucker (you can see a trainer in the background).  You'll note she still has all the UH-1B mods including, narrow symmetrical sync elevator, narrow chord 204 main rotor, right handed fuel filler, and nose mounted pitot.  Only the wide chord cambered tailfin and the position lights on the side of the tail are UH-1C mods.  The reason for the UH-1C tailbooms on UH-1Bs is that after 65 when UH-1Cs went into production, B model production ceased and thus all replacement tailbooms were C model tails.No automatic alt text available.

 

I hope that helps clear of some of the issues regarding the UH-1B and UH-1C.  To my knowledge Have Gun Will Travel should be a straight up Bravo model.

   Ray

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Posted (edited)

Thank you all for the great information and history of the UH-1B/C. I knew some of that info already and it is nice to have the full information on the history of the UH-1B/C. Greatly appreciated!

 

Mostly, the reason I was asking specifically about 14040 "Have Gun Will Travel" is because I have a very old Miocroscale decal sheet with it and also because I found a photo Ray posted on Finescale showing an early UH-1C with the bell mouth intake, wide chord tail and 540 rotors from the same squadron as "Have Gun Will Travel" and was wondering if it was either upgraded to the C standards or was eventually switched to the early UH-1C as shown in the photo.

 

Here is the photo Ray posted to Finescale. Does anyone have BuNo's for the early C's with the bell mouth intake, wide chord tail and 540 rotors for this same squadron? I have the Microscale sheet 48-146 with the 14040 "Have Gun Will Travel" markings and was planning to use them but can switch the BuNo to make an early C instead of a standard B.

4-77tharagriffons_zpsdfdh7k6l.jpg

 

I have a couple of the old Fujimi UH-1B's and a couple of the Monogram UH-1B kits. I am planning to kit bash them with the Monogram/Revell Huey Hog kits and Cobra Company UH-1C upgrade sets. I will be cutting the bell mouth intakes off the Fujimi and Monogram UH-1B kits and add them to the Monogram/Revell Huey Hog kits and use the Cobra Company tails. I was also planning on using the Hobby Boss UH-1C as well and already started a kit bash with the Hobby Boss kit dry fitting the bell mouth intake to it. I already plan to do a standard UH-1B in HAL-3 markings so I wanted to do the US ARMY UH-1B either with the upgraded wide chord tail or an early UH-1C. I also plan to do a USMC UH-1E with the bell mouth intake and wide chord tail.

 

Here is my Hobby Boss UH-1C with the Fujimi bell mouth intake taped on for test fitting. The Hobby Boss kit has the wide chord tail but the original thinner main rotors. I will be using the Huey Hog 540 main rotors on the Hobby Boss kit to do my early UH-1C and UH-1E.

DSC_0471_zpsugwqklrf.jpg

DSC_0472_zpsikyi0qel.jpg

 

These are the old Fujimi and Monogram UH-1B kits I have and will be cutting the bell mouth intakes from.

Monogram%20%206810%20UH-1B_zpshqhskahs.j

Monogram%206809%20HueyUH-1_zpsrvjvsplz.j

241938-11483-78_zpssobxlfex.jpg

FUJIMI5A16UPOT-1_zpssea6lmwh.jpg

Edited by twong

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47 minutes ago, twong said:

Thank you all for the great information and history of the UH-1B/C. I knew some of that info already and it is nice to have the full information on the history of the UH-1B/C. Greatly appreciated!

 

Mostly, the reason I was asking specifically about 14040 "Have Gun Will Travel" is because I have a very old Miocroscale decal sheet with it and also because I found a photo Ray posted on Finescale showing an early UH-1C with the bell mouth intake, wide chord tail and 540 rotors from the same squadron as "Have Gun Will Travel" and was wondering if it was either upgraded to the C standards or was eventually switched to the early UH-1C as shown in the photo.

 

Here is the photo Ray posted to Finescale. Does anyone have BuNo's for the early C's with the bell mouth intake, wide chord tail and 540 rotors for this same squadron? I have the Microscale sheet 48-146 with the 14040 "Have Gun Will Travel" markings and was planning to use them but can switch the BuNo to make an early C instead of a standard B.

4-77tharagriffons_zpsdfdh7k6l.jpg

 

I have a couple of the old Fujimi UH-1B's and a couple of the Monogram UH-1B kits. I am planning to kit bash them with the Monogram/Revell Huey Hog kits and Cobra Company UH-1C upgrade sets. I will be cutting the bell mouth intakes off the Fujimi and Monogram UH-1B kits and add them to the Monogram/Revell Huey Hog kits and use the Cobra Company tails. I was also planning on using the Hobby Boss UH-1C as well and already started a kit bash with the Hobby Boss kit dry fitting the bell mouth intake to it. I already plan to do a standard UH-1B in HAL-3 markings so I wanted to do the US ARMY UH-1B either with the upgraded wide chord tail or an early UH-1C. I also plan to do a USMC UH-1E with the bell mouth intake and wide chord tail.

 

Here is my Hobby Boss UH-1C with the Fujimi bell mouth intake taped on for test fitting. The Hobby Boss kit has the wide chord tail but the original thinner main rotors. I will be using the Huey Hog 540 main rotors on the Hobby Boss kit to do my early UH-1C and UH-1E.

DSC_0471_zpsugwqklrf.jpg

DSC_0472_zpsikyi0qel.jpg

 

These are the old Fujimi and Monogram UH-1B kits I have and will be cutting the bell mouth intakes from.

 

 

OK, there is a lot here to address.  First off, NO UH-1Bs were upgraded to UH-1Cs.  You can take that to the bank.  With the possible exception of the two 540B model used experimentally.  However, you mentioned doing a UH-1E with the 540 and Bell mouth intake.  While these certainly did exist, keep in mind the first batch of UH-1Es were actually built after the UH-1B. Here is the second UH-1E built and you can see the B model heritage.

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 Here's a 540 UH01E with the bell mouth intake in Vietnam from the Wayne Mutza collection. Note that this bird has a USAF 19 shot rocket pod mounted to the TK-2 system and has the guns minus the barrels of the M60C on the TAT 101 chin turret. The TAT 101 proved very unreliable and most were scrapped fairly early after their introduction.

 

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While i noted that no UH-1Bs were updated to UH-1Cs, early UH-1Es were updated to the 540 rotor with all it's UH-1C mods.  The first 34 UH-1Es were built after the UH-1B,  Here is a photo of 151268,the third UH-1e built, much later after the Marines had turned all of their echos over to the Navy. I believe this photo was taken at China Lake. Notice she has the 540 rotor with a 27 inch chord, left handed fuel filler, roof mounted pitot, wide chord asymmetrical sync elevators and wide chord tail with the position lights on either side of the tailboom. All UH-1C/M characteristics.

 

Image may contain: airplane, sky and outdoor

The photo I posted of the UH-1C with 2/20th ARA in 1965 is from the Reese collection and shows the earliest UH-1C in Vietnam that In know of.  The photo was most likely taken in November/December 1965.  Something else that might be worth mentioning is that the bell mouth intake vs the improved particle separator depends on the time frame.  By 1968, while it is still possible, it is highly unlikely that a UH-1B would not have been fitted with the particle separator.  Here's UH-1C 64-14101, the first UH-1C, testing the particle separator at Yuma July 20 1966. This is the earliest documentation I have of the particle separator on a Huey. From The Army Aviation Test Board archives.  By 68 though virtually all B/Cs in country had been upgraded to the particle separator

 

Image may contain: sky, airplane and outdoor

 

So the question is, are you really building Have Gun Will travel from 68 as you mentioned in the original post or from 66 as shown in the artwork?  Also, was she still even in the unit in 68? HTH

   Ray

    

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Thanks again!

 

My original intent was to do UH-1B, 14040 "Have Gun Will Travel" from the Microscale decals but I would prefer to do an early C as in the photo below. I already have the specific squadron markings from the Microscale sheet but all I need now is the BuNo.

 

The reason for not doing UH-1B 14040 "Have Gun Will Travel" is because I already plan to do a USN HAL-3 UH-1B so I wanted to have different UH-1 models. I have a few US ARMY UH-1C's with the particle filter separator planned from the Hobby Boss kits using the Monogram Huey Hog interior, main rotors and weapons. I like the look of the bell mouth intake and wanted to do the different versions like the original UH-1B, the early UH-1C and the UH-1E.

1 hour ago, twong said:

4-77tharagriffons_zpsdfdh7k6l.jpg

 

Here is the progress on my Hobby Boss UH-1C using the Monogram Huey Hog parts. Lots of cutting and grinding to get the Monogram parts to fit inside the Hobby Boss kit but it works. I cut the Hobby Boss doors off as they are molded shut. Everything is taped on for test fitting. I am cutting the ammo canisters off the Monogram floor and attaching it to the Hobby Boss floor as the Monogram floor is a bit shorter than the Hobby Boss floor.

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DSC_0455_zpspzupuxvx.jpg

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DSC_0709_zpsbgcohuf3.jpg

 

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Posted (edited)
Quote

 

 

Ray, an interesting observation about that UH-1C 64-14101 Bearcat 4 profile is the missing towel rack antenna just in front of the doghouse on the USAAM image. This was eventually resolved as evidenced by the Helena Airport pole display where the towel rack antenna is clearly present.


Also 540-B 63-8684 has the short mast prevalent on the UH-1A. It's my understanding that no 540-B made it to Vietnam and they were a test bed only. Like you said the B model production stopped in '65.

 

I absolutely agree that 'Have Gun Will Travel' will be a standard B model. If it got the tail mod in Vietnam I would not be too surprised although with this unit Im not seeing that for whatever reason. (Supply most likely, I have misplaced some slides of the boneyard at An Khe - they went through gunships there)

 

Here are a couple of images from SSG Russell Warriner who was with C Battery ARA from 67 to 69! They were fielding both the UH-1B and UH-1C during his tour. The interesting thing here is that the Charlies 2/20 ARA got have the old Bell mouth intake. The new kits had to make their way to Vietnam and disbursement by unit was willy nilly. 

 

33403202761_5bebfa0569_b.jpg

 

In SSG Warriner's slide of an Alpha Co 2/20 UH-1C they are also fielding the old Bell Mouth Intake. This is 1967 and 2/20 ARA was still waiting on the new improved particle separator. In 1966 it is certain UH-1B 64-14040 Have Gun Will Travel will sport the Bell mouth intake.

33403203541_23f4054cd2_b.jpg

 

In this slide taken in 1968 you can see an old B model with M3 system still flying with 2/20 ARA. This is 1968 and 2/20 hasn't swapped out the tail or moved to the newer armaments either.

33148356240_0a76576aba_b.jpg

 

Another from SSG Warriner showing stock B models in 1967

33491188246_6891691275_b.jpg

 

Here is a nice overhead from one of the slides in my collection of 64-03607 that shows lots of those features Ray mentioned. Note though that this B got the improved particle separator. Also no high vis markings flat OD 43087

 

33402498921_c62ce8af1c_b.jpg

 

Love the kit bashing you are doing. Way to go.

 

 

Edited by snake36bravo

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Twong that is looking awesome. I have started to do the same thing over in the Helicopter group build. I plan on leaving the filters and wide cord tail on mine and was going to leave the doors closed. I may incorporate your idea (hope you do not mind:rolleyes:) for the aft cabin and open it up now. You should enter this build in the group build.

 

 

Brandon

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1 hour ago, twong said:

Thanks again!

 

My original intent was to do UH-1B, 14040 "Have Gun Will Travel" from the Microscale decals but I would prefer to do an early C as in the photo below. I already have the specific squadron markings from the Microscale sheet but all I need now is the BuNo.

 

The reason for not doing UH-1B 14040 "Have Gun Will Travel" is because I already plan to do a USN HAL-3 UH-1B so I wanted to have different UH-1 models. I have a few US ARMY UH-1C's with the particle filter separator planned from the Hobby Boss kits using the Monogram Huey Hog interior, main rotors and weapons. I like the look of the bell mouth intake and wanted to do the different versions like the original UH-1B, the early UH-1C and the UH-1E.

 

Here is the progress on my Hobby Boss UH-1C using the Monogram Huey Hog parts. Lots of cutting and grinding to get the Monogram parts to fit inside the Hobby Boss kit but it works. I cut the Hobby Boss doors off as they are molded shut. Everything is taped on for test fitting. I am cutting the ammo canisters off the Monogram floor and attaching it to the Hobby Boss floor as the Monogram floor is a bit shorter than the Hobby Boss floor.

 

I agree, with Lloyd, the kitbashing is awesome.  I think this is what I will do with all the Huey Hog kits I have accumulated. You can pick up the HB kit for less than $20 so it's not a huge investment.  Regarding the 2/20th UH-1C pic, here is the only other photo I have of her and as you can see the tail is not visible.  However, you can see the M16 quad M60C system.  You hould be able to use this from the Huey Hog kit.  I think if you go with any of the early 64 serial numbers, it would be OK.  I even checked the 2/20 helos on the VHPA DVD and ffor some reason none of them are listed there.

    Ray

Image may contain: sky, outdoor and nature

 

 

1 hour ago, twong said:

 

 

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Posted (edited)

Thanks Ray and Lloyd! Greatly appreciated!

 

Ray, I got two Hobby Boss 1/48 UH-1C kits shipped for $24 from one of the online hobby shops, I forgot which one though. It was a Christmas special and they only had the two left that I ordered. I tried to get more but they were sold out. I got two more from a friend though. I picked up those old Fujimi and Monogram UH-1B's real cheap too. The Fjuimi and Monogram UH-1B's are not 1/48, they are bigger than both the Hobby Boss UH-1C and Monogram Huey Hog kits. I would put them at about 1/46 scale.

 

I have a ton of comparison photos of the Fujimi UH-1B and Monogram UH-1B. I also have a ton of comparison photos of them with the Hobby Boss UH-1C and Monogram Huey Hog kits. The Fujimi and Monogram UH-1B's are very similar and might be copies of each other. 

 

Thanks Brandon! Great you are doing a Hobby Boss kit as well. I will take a look at the group build. I barely get any builds done. I start them but then never finish them. I am stuck in a small room due to unfortunate circumstances and have barely any room to display my builds. I sold about 1/2 my stash so far and am trying to mostly build helicopters now as they are nice and thin and I can fit more on the tiny shelf space I have.

 

Everyone is familiar with the Monogram/Revell Huey Hog and know that it is a mix of different versions and is not perfect. The Hobby Boss isn't perfect either. Where Monogram gave the 540 main rotors but the thin chord tail and horizontal stabs, Hobby Boss gave the wide chord tail and horizontal stabs but included the original thin main rotor blades. The easiest way to make a nicer UH-1C is to use the Monogram main rotors on the Hobby Boss kit. If you want more detail then the only other option is to do what I am doing by cutting the cabin doors off and adding the Monogram interior to the Hobby Boss kit.

 

The Hobby Boss kit is pretty nice but lacking in the interior detail department and no weapons. It has some very fine and crisp engraved panel lines and the fit on mine is really good unlike on the Monogram/Revell where most of the parts are warped and require a lot of filling and sanding. Monogram molded two refuel door caps, one on the port side and one on the starboard side where there should only be one refuel door cap depending on the model type. Hobby Boss molded two vents on the doghouse where only one should be on the port side only. I cut the vent off and filled it in with sheet plastic. I just need to fill and sand flush now.

 

In this photo below, you can see the two vents on the doghouse.

DSC_0710_zpsjwte8x1b.jpg

 

In this photo, I cut out the vent and glued a piece of very thin sheet plastic on the back and filled in with more sheet plastic. I just need to fill with putty and sand flush.

DSC_0711_zpstmlk6ms8.jpg

 

The fit of the Hobby Boss is quite good as I said earlier and you can see where the clear piece sits on the fuselage halves. I might not need to fill and sand the clear piece at all.

DSC_0494_zps5xl4sonb.jpg

 

To address the ejector pin holes on the bottom of the Monogram main rotors, I used a hole punch on some thin sheet plastic and filled in the holes.

DSC_0496_zps5bqr8iea.jpg

 

I am scratch building the Sagami mounts to add some weapons. Also scratch built the cradle mounts for the M134 miniguns. The ammo feed chute is from the Eduard UH-1N set. Also adding some Fireball Modelworks 3D printed rocket tubes. Two different types shown, later version loaded and earlier version unloaded.

DSC_0115_zps7lgitln9.jpg

DSC_0103_zpseqoaerog.jpg

DSC_0356_zps7ucoobq9.jpg

Edited by twong

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Thanks for the info on the vent. I will fill mine in as well. I am going to use the same rockets from Fireball. Mine are the loaded version. I agree that the fit in the HB kit is awesome. It goes together a lot like their 1/72 kit, and the fit on that kit was awesome. Here are a couple of pics of my attempt at the 1/72 version.

 

015_zpsb63ed377.jpg

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Very nice! Great job on that Huey.

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Brandon, here are the minigun cradle mounts I am scratch building. The miniguns are from the Italeri UH-1N.

DSC_0091_zpsizl45ayg.jpg

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Here are the Monogram M60's. I cut them off leaving just the mount part. The M134 will go on that part.

DSC_0716_zpsqkjki9vm.jpg

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Here is the M134 on the mount.

DSC_0722_zps3oahbt4b.jpg

 

Hope to get it to look like this.

m21_1_zpsiriizept.jpg

 

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That cradle looks awesome. I need to build one like that for my 1/48 OH-6.

 

 

Brandon

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On ‎3‎/‎19‎/‎2017 at 3:06 PM, rotorwash said:

Trust me, UH-1C 64-14101 was the first true UH-1C.  Have Gun Will Travel was a straight up B model.  It is possible she could have had a UH-1C tailboom replacement, but would have had none of the other UH-1C mods like 540 rotor, left handed fuel filler. roof mounted pitot or wide asymmetrical sync elevators.  Here are some pics that the group might find interesting. They are from Bell Helicopter and the US Army Aviation Museum.  

First off how about a good ole UH-1B.  This is UH-1B 64-14057 from Terry Love. This bird was one of the last few B models produced.  Note the number is later than Have Gun Will Travel.  She has all the standard UH-1B mods including narrow symmetrical sync elevator, narrow chord 204 main rotor, right handed fuel filler, and nose mounted pitot, narropw tail and single poistion light on the end of the tail.

Image may contain: outdoor

Here is the most elusive helo I have ever hunted for UH-1B 63-8684, a 540 B model.  She lacks the left handed fuel filler characteristic of true UH-1Cs and the tail is a highly modified UH-1B tail.  The missing left hand fuel filler is important because it was necessary to move the fuel filler to the left side when duel hydraulics were added to the UH-1C.  Both the pitot and sync elevators ahve been upgraded to the C model configurations though.  If you are very observant you may also notice that the position lights on the side of the tail found on the true UH-1C are also missing on the 540B.

Image may contain: shoes and outdoor

 No automatic alt text available.

 

Here's another pic of the 540B showing the right handed fuel filler:

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Here is the very first UH-1C 64-14101, known as Bearcat 4 by the Army Aviation Test Board.  You can clearly see the left hand fuel filler on this bird.  She also has all the other UH-1C mods, including the position light on the side of the tail.

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Here's 64-14101 on display at the Helena, Montana airport.  I visited her in 2015.

 

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Just for completeness here is a 2/20th ARA UH-1B armed with the M3 rocket system. She has a UH-1C tailboom replacement and this photo was clearly taken at Ft. Rucker (you can see a trainer in the background).  You'll note she still has all the UH-1B mods including, narrow symmetrical sync elevator, narrow chord 204 main rotor, right handed fuel filler, and nose mounted pitot.  Only the wide chord cambered tailfin and the position lights on the side of the tail are UH-1C mods.  The reason for the UH-1C tailbooms on UH-1Bs is that after 65 when UH-1Cs went into production, B model production ceased and thus all replacement tailbooms were C model tails.No automatic alt text available.

 

I hope that helps clear of some of the issues regarding the UH-1B and UH-1C.  To my knowledge Have Gun Will Travel should be a straight up Bravo model.

   Ray

Question about the gloss era OD scheme Ray,

Did the color looked more green or brown cos color photos from that period seems to alternate between the 2. Your pic above shows a dark green hue but I have seen some browner looking birds even when listed as fresh from factory. I use gunze paints over here and theirs has a definite brown tone to it.

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7 minutes ago, torchf4 said:

Question about the gloss era OD scheme Ray,

Did the color looked more green or brown cos color photos from that period seems to alternate between the 2. Your pic above shows a dark green hue but I have seen some browner looking birds even when listed as fresh from factory. I use gunze paints over here and theirs has a definite brown tone to it.

Great question!  Personally, I try to find a photo of the individual aircraft I'm building and mix the paint to match it.  I have not found anything out of the bottle that looks like true gloss OD.

Here is how my gloss "Big Train" build came out.  This one has blue and brown mixed into standard OD:

Image may contain: outdoor

 

And here's a recent UH-1A I built that has mainly blue added to standard OD:

 

Image may contain: outdoor

 

Finally, here's my build of the first UH-1C and I pretty much just painted gloss over standard OD:

 

Image may contain: sky and outdoor

 Looking at the original, you can see it was too light, even taking into account the angle of the sun:

Image may contain: sky and outdoor

 

However, it looks pretty close to her sister ship, Bearcat 6:

Image may contain: sky and outdoor

 

So, what you can learn from all of this is that while I may know a bit about Hueys, I apparently don't know a lot about the proper way to mix up gloss OD!  Anyway, those are my observations for what they are worth.  

 

Ray

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It's always an interesting question when it comes up. Time of day and weather are a large factor on appearance of shade of OD.

 

Same UH-1M 64-14185 on Redstone Arsenal, AL - I took the images on two different days at different times of day.

 

Which shade of OD is it? The darker OD Gloss or lighter OD?

 

The top image matches Ray's mix of blue added to standard OD (I'm guessing FS 34087 to darken it).

 

33459709211_5692839f68_b.jpg

 

Color chips I made in Photoshop using the Federal Standard colors for the Huey early to mid/late war.

33459860931_d84345ecba_z.jpg

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Interesting, Lloyd.  Plus the models look different depending on how they are lit as well.  

   Ray

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That is too cool about the OD on the models being affected by the varying light spectrum as well. Also I'm highly impressed with that OD you mixed with the blue for the early High Vis Hueys. 

 

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22 hours ago, rotorwash said:

Great question!  Personally, I try to find a photo of the individual aircraft I'm building and mix the paint to match it.  I have not found anything out of the bottle that looks like true gloss OD.

Here is how my gloss "Big Train" build came out.  This one has blue and brown mixed into standard OD:

Image may contain: outdoor

 

And here's a recent UH-1A I built that has mainly blue added to standard OD:

 

Image may contain: outdoor

 

Finally, here's my build of the first UH-1C and I pretty much just painted gloss over standard OD:

 

Image may contain: sky and outdoor

 Looking at the original, you can see it was too light, even taking into account the angle of the sun:

Image may contain: sky and outdoor

 

However, it looks pretty close to her sister ship, Bearcat 6:

Image may contain: sky and outdoor

 

So, what you can learn from all of this is that while I may know a bit about Hueys, I apparently don't know a lot about the proper way to mix up gloss OD!  Anyway, those are my observations for what they are worth.  

 

Ray

As expected! Looks like I will use gunze's tank OD which is more dark green compared to their brown US Army helo OD and eyeball from there. Those are excellent builds by the way!

Now to hope someone reissues Cobr's B parts and colorful decals! Fingers crossed!

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