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TaiidanTomcat

Air Force officially hates F-15s now

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The F-15C/Ds will need a fuselage replacement sometime in the mid 2020s and the cost estimate right now is $40 million/aircraft.  And with so many competing demands and given the age of the aircraft by then, USAF likely won't think it's worth the money by that time.  Here's a link that explains things a bit better: http://www.popularmechanics.com/military/aviation/a25889/f-15-eagle-retirement-rumors/.

Here's another link, too, from a slightly different angle: http://www.defensenews.com/articles/f-15c-d-retirement-likely-not-a-possibility-until-2020s-officials-say.

 

Tom

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For now it is just a suggestion. Remains to be seen if this really pans out...

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It makes sense.  It already has a replacement with the F-22.  It is a single mission aircraft and one that we don't need in the current fight.  By the mid 2020s the F-35 will be the main fighter and these will be 40+ years old.  

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1 hour ago, nspreitler said:

It makes sense.  It already has a replacement with the F-22.  It is a single mission aircraft and one that we don't need in the current fight.  By the mid 2020s the F-35 will be the main fighter and these will be 40+ years old.  

 

By keeping the A-10 around it proves once and for all the air forces secret love of this aircraft, while retiring the F-15s just goes to show that the air force was just never really into the F-15. A real marriage of convenience. Former F-15 pilots like Moseley were dismissed In humiliation while A-10 guys like Welsh excelled. Coincidence? Obviously not

 

 

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I'm convinced there is not an apolitical answer to force structure questions like F-15 vs A-10 vs F-35, etc.

 

I think it mostly comes down to the USAF and other services simply having to play the hands they are dealt.

 

Jonah

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Wow, I thought the Golden Eagle plan was pretty well set, to keep 179 F-15s flying alongside the F-22.  I talked to some F-15C pilots last summer , and they said the F-15C program was still going strong with plenty of updates, even thought there aren't any with ACC.  But, I guess, at $40 million each to keep them going, that isn't worth it.  Although I would think some new builds of the F-15E would be a better investment.

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20 hours ago, habu2 said:

We'll always have Paris B-52s...

KC-135s

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Looks like the AF's (or I guess the Pentagon to be more accurate)  love/hate relationship with the F-15 may be going back towards the "love" end of the spectrum.

 

https://about.bgov.com/blog/pentagon-billion-new-boeing-fighters/

 

I recall on one of these threads some experts saying this would never happen.   Obviously, it still has a long ways to go before anything is finalized  (especially since it appears that our recent defense spending orgy may be coming to a crashing halt in the near future).  Still, I'd love to see some of these new-build Eagles in service to compliment the relatively small F-22 fleet. 

Edited by 11bee

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I'm a believer that it would make more sense than anything else at the moment. As the article stated, so far the idea is for only 12 aircraft and it would not be that hard to insert them into the Eagle supply and maintenance train. Another thing that the article stated is that Israel even realize s that relying solely on a F-35 community isn't viable.

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What I don't understand is why the USAF doesn't have the latest versions of both the F-15 and the F-16. That should have been a requirement for sales to foreign nations...they cover the R&D cost and the USAF reaps the benefits of a newer, more advanced platform. As it stands, there are foreign countries with Eagles and Falcons more capable than our own. That's just not right.

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1 hour ago, Darren Roberts said:

What I don't understand is why the USAF doesn't have the latest versions of both the F-15 and the F-16. That should have been a requirement for sales to foreign nations...they cover the R&D cost and the USAF reaps the benefits of a newer, more advanced platform. As it stands, there are foreign countries with Eagles and Falcons more capable than our own. That's just not right.

Completely agree. the F-15SA and (soon) the F-15QA are LIGHT YEARS ahead of the F-15E, and yet we are giving them to countries that are not really the best US allies right now. The main reason we would not export the F-22 was because we did not want any of our allies...Even our STRONG allies like Japan and Israel, to have parity with the US...Yet, we will export F-15's and F-16's that not only give them parity, but ADVANCEMENT over our models. 

 

Hoping the F-15X does come true. I think that Boeing would be able to pitch more than 12 to the USAF, and I know Israel and probably Japan would be interested in them as well. 

 

Aaron 

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12 airframes wont be enough. Thats barely enough for one squadron, let alone replacements for high hour or replenishment aircraft.

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50 minutes ago, adamitri said:

12 airframes wont be enough. Thats barely enough for one squadron, let alone replacements for high hour or replenishment aircraft.

I took it to mean 12 per year - at least the first year. 

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5 hours ago, Darren Roberts said:

What I don't understand is why the USAF doesn't have the latest versions of both the F-15 and the F-16. 

 

Because F-35 funding.

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20 hours ago, Whiskey said:

I'm a believer that it would make more sense than anything else at the moment. As the article stated, so far the idea is for only 12 aircraft and it would not be that hard to insert them into the Eagle supply and maintenance train. Another thing that the article stated is that Israel even realize s that relying solely on a F-35 community isn't viable.

 


Most countries aren't relying solely on F-35s. 

 

 

 

18 hours ago, Darren Roberts said:

What I don't understand is why the USAF doesn't have the latest versions of both the F-15 and the F-16. That should have been a requirement for sales to foreign nations...they cover the R&D cost and the USAF reaps the benefits of a newer, more advanced platform. As it stands, there are foreign countries with Eagles and Falcons more capable than our own. That's just not right.

 

Thats nothing new. If you have a force of 100 F-16s then you can dump a lot more money into them than a force that has thousands. Moreover a lot of the advanced Teen variants are going to countries that are not going to get F-35, and the super teens are concession prizes. 

 

 

 

17 hours ago, strikeeagle801 said:

Completely agree. the F-15SA and (soon) the F-15QA are LIGHT YEARS ahead of the F-15E, and yet we are giving them to countries that are not really the best US allies right now. The main reason we would not export the F-22 was because we did not want any of our allies...Even our STRONG allies like Japan and Israel, to have parity with the US...Yet, we will export F-15's and F-16's that not only give them parity, but ADVANCEMENT over our models. 

 

Hoping the F-15X does come true. I think that Boeing would be able to pitch more than 12 to the USAF, and I know Israel and probably Japan would be interested in them as well. 

 

Aaron 

 

Because we have F-22s, and as you point out they do not. 

 

 

The simple truth is that trying to maintain superiority in every aspect on every piece of gear would be prohibitively expensive, especially if trying to keep up with smaller countries that put a premium on quality over quantity. The US would rather have 2000 F-16s are good, than 500 F-16Is that are great. 

 

 

13 hours ago, habu2 said:

 

Because F-35 funding.

 

And theres nothing wrong with that. F-35 is the future.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by TaiidanTomcat

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58 minutes ago, TaiidanTomcat said:

And theres nothing wrong with that. F-35 is the future.

 

F-35 is the future of of the AF's air dominance efforts?  I thought that was being left to the F-22's, which by all accounts are way to few in numbers.

 

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1 hour ago, 11bee said:

F-35 is the future of of the AF's air dominance efforts?  I thought that was being left to the F-22's, which by all accounts are way to few in numbers.

 

 

Who is pitching this again? It's not the air force according to the article you posted. 

 

But according to the air force itself there was limited utility in upgrading teen fighters let alone new builds, as 5th generation fighters are the future. 

 

One of the F-22 guys already weighed in on the F-15 pod they're trying to equip it with to keep with F-22s not doing anything than slowing down the F-22s

 

 

I don't have any clowns in this circus so the question is simply is an F-35 more useful in augmenting F-22s or F-15s??

 

But all that aside this might be little more than political welfare. Or simply that F-35s wont be hitting guard units in numbers enough that would offset F-15 attrition. If the F-15s are being used as nothing more than "home defense" against hijacked airliners, and busted TFRs rather than a 5th gen fight over an IADS they should be very sufficient

 

 

The solution of course is a time machine to undo the cancelation of the F-22 with all that "smart power"  

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On 12/22/2018 at 2:09 PM, strikeeagle801 said:

Completely agree. the F-15SA and (soon) the F-15QA are LIGHT YEARS ahead of the F-15E, and yet we are giving them to countries that are not really the best US allies right now. The main reason we would not export the F-22 was because we did not want any of our allies...Even our STRONG allies like Japan and Israel, to have parity with the US...Yet, we will export F-15's and F-16's that not only give them parity, but ADVANCEMENT over our models. 

 

Hoping the F-15X does come true. I think that Boeing would be able to pitch more than 12 to the USAF, and I know Israel and probably Japan would be interested in them as well. 

 

Aaron 

 

The F-22 wasn’t exported because the sensitive software within the aircraft is easily deciphered. It is the aircrafts biggest weakness.

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As long as the 35 can only field 4 AMRAAM's , compared to the 8 on the 22 or F-15, it'll never be an air dominance fighter, past the first 4 off the rail...

 

Jeff

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7 hours ago, jefropas said:

As long as the 35 can only field 4 AMRAAM's , compared to the 8 on the 22 or F-15, it'll never be an air dominance fighter, past the first 4 off the rail...

 

Jeff

 

4ad7939f.JPG

 

K

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11 hours ago, TaiidanTomcat said:

 

4ad7939f.JPG

 

K

Is that a future capability or are current F-35s rolling off the line with provision for an extra two hard points and rails under each wing?

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