F-4B/J MER

[Finn]

To get the right angle on the MER on the o/b stations check pg 75 of this:

 

http://aviationarchives.blogspot.ca/2017/07/f-4bj-ordnancemans-handbook.html

 

Jari

[Rex]

Cool, thanks, Jari.

 

It also shows other useful stuff for Navair versions, such as the explosive bolts to eject the innerwing pylons, the MER shifting fore and aft positions for center of gravity concerns,,,,,,,the method of removing the outerwing weapons adapter for the installation of McDonnell or Royal Jet fuel tanks. (I didn't see the Sgt Fletchers with built in pylons at all,,,,,,but, I only browsed quickly, I might have missed those)

 

For the MBR angle (which I think was the same for the actual rack) and the actual "triangle view of the bombs from the front" differences between the MBR and MER, I think it was Tommy T that had those drawings. These had the same angles involved, but looked different, because of where the bomb racks were attached to the "rail" that held them.

Edited July 23, 2017 by Rex

[Finn]

Rex, check the date on the Handbook, Oct 1965 so perhaps the Sgt Fletcher tanks were much later. 

.

Jari

[Rex]

Ah, I see it is for F-4B/J,,,,,,,,,but, tanks aren't considered Ordnance.

 

(explains why Sgt Fletchers aren't in a pub covering F-4J)

 

he also must have two pubs, one cover is on the blog post (1968), and a different cover and pub is what gets downloaded (1965)

Edited July 23, 2017 by Rex

[Finn]

The site has several pubs including the revised ones on various topics so maybe we'll see an updated one before too long with more info. Also from the looks of the below pic, the early AF F-4Cs had the same pylon/MER arraignment as the Navy Phantoms:

 

 

Jari

[Rex]

Yes, they did. With one very early exception. ("naval style" is covered in the F-4C TO)

 

In the days when there were only MBRs and no MERs yet, there also weren't TERs, because a TER was a follow on development  from the MER design.

 

So, early test USAF Phantoms had the two sets of USN style pylons,,,,,,,with MBRs on the outers, and this funky looking bomb rack thing on the inner pylons. It was a huge "bomb rack lump" on the bottom, and two bomb racks mounted at an angle, mounted directly on the pylon.

[GW8345]

The outboard MER's were hung differently between the USN/USMC F-4's and the USAF F-4's.

 

For USN/USMC F-4's, the MER was hung at a 13.5 degree outboard tilt, the pylon was at 0 degrees.

 

For USAF F-4's, the pylon and MER were where inline with each other and hung at a 7.5 degree outboard tilt.

 

For a MER, the shoulder stations are at a 45 degree angle, for a MBR, the shoulder stations are at a 32 degree angle.

 

Source: AOP-12 Aircraft Store Interface Manual

[Rex]

Yeah, Gerry,,,,,,thanks for that.

 

Except that USAF also used the "navy system" for both sets of pylons. (as in Jari's photo of the White bottomed early F-4C)

 

So, I was wrong then,,,,,the angles and the mounting point spacing is different between the MBR and the MER. I got the triangle difference right, but, have to take a second look at the rack mounting points on the rails.

[Tailspin Turtle]

For what it's worth: http://tailspintopics.blogspot.com/2016/01/f-4-phantom-outboard-pylon-and-mer.html

 

For everything I know so far on F-4 external tanks: http://tailspintopics.blogspot.com/2013/06/things-under-wings-f4h-f-4-phantom.html

[GW8345]

IIRC the early white bottomed USAF F-4C's were basically F-4B's with USAF painted on the side.

[Rex]

Not exactly Gerry.

 

By that time, the F-4Bs had been returned to the USN. (BuNo cards bear this out) So none of the F-4Bs served in Vietnam with the USAF. If you look at the main gear door on a bird sitting on the ground, you can spot a "thick wing" Phantom in a heartbeat. If the door is flat, it is thin wing, if you see a "twist" in its shape, that is a thick winged Phantom. (the wings were bulged on the top and the bottom for wheel clearance) If you can't see the door, but can see the air brake, that has the same "twist" in it as well.

 

The White bottomed USAF F-4Cs were the USAF NS Light Gull Gray over White early deliveries of "real" F-4Cs, that got the top three SEA camo colors painted on after the start of Vietnam. And overall, there were not that many of them.  It wasn't very long at all and the TO matching SEA camo was on all F-4Cs that were painted in SEA. All it takes to spot a White bottomed C is to look at something like the missiles or the nose gear doors. If there is a contrast between the doors, and the nose gear, it is a Full SEA camo, if the doors match the gear then it is White. Same with missiles and pylons or aircraft bellies.

 

edit, of course, there is an even easier way to tell. "37609" as pictured, was 63-7609, a Block 20 new-build F-4C, the 204th real F-4C. If it survived long enough to get a two letter tail code, it would have been marked tiny AF 37, with larger 609 under the two large letters. USN loaner F-4Bs were marked "121xx" except for a brief period when the first two were marked 49405 and 49406.

 

 

Edited July 24, 2017 by Rex

[mrvark]

I was based at Luke in 1976 when they painted some of the aircraft (including F-4Cs) with stripes. I went over to corrosion control (paint shop) one day and saw one of those jets as it was being prepped for painting. They had washed it down with solvent to strip off the 'dead' paint and underneath it all you could still see the original gray paint complete with buzz number--it had never been completely stripped of old paint prior to repainting!