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Hello all, I know this sounds dumb but, can you use oil washes on models painted with Enamel paints? I was thinking if I let the Paint dry for a couple of days, five at most then add multiple coats of Matt cote then the oil wash wouldn't effect the paint? Could this be done? I've looked on the internet and forums for anything concerning oil and I couldn't find anything of use. I know that it sounds like a terrible idea but I really like the look of a oil wash and how much time it gives for fixing mistakes. I just wanted to make sure before I ruin the paint job on my Me-262 B-1/U-1 I'm working on. Any kind of help would be really appreciated, thanks!

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Hello

 

Before switching to awesome Gunze paints, I used to paint with Humbrol Enamels.

First I used enamel Humbrol varnish, then I switched to Future/Klir acrylic.

I did my washes using oil paint thinned with enamel thinner.

Maybe risky on enamel varnish, but safe on acrylic clear cote.

 

i would suggest to wash on gloss acrylic varnish.

On matt varnish you risk to stain to surface, as a filter would do.

then seal with a matt clear cote.

 

Cheers

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Hi Jimbles, yes you'll have to seal it first or the oil's thinner (normally mineral spirits or odorless turpenoid) will eat through the enamel paint.   My cockpit's enamel paint dissolved right before my eyes while I brushed the oil wash on.   I asked a similar question here and learned you need to have a barrier (your clear coat).    

 

For clear coats I've used Future (I find the oil's thinner can still eat through it if you brush it on too roughly) -- perhaps a couple coats of Future would be good.       I've also tried Tamiya TS-13 Gloss coat clear.   Tamiya's TS line is a synthetic lacquer that is impervious to enamel and acrylic thinners -- so there's no chance your oil wash can eat through it.     Flat clear coat (like Tamiya TS-80) will allow the oil wash to spread on larger surfaces better if that is the effect you want, rather than pooling in crevices.     I would like to try their semi-gloss TS-79 sometime.    I find it difficult to control the thickness when using spraycan clear coats though, while Future can be brushed on  (for tight spaces like cockpits),  is self-levelling, and the resulting clear layer is nice and thin.    

 

Lately I used TS-29-gloss black on some parts and find that I can apply oil wash directly onto it, it being an synthetic lacquer, without having to apply any clear coat barrier first.  Again, the only problem with spraycan paint is that it's difficult to apply in thin layers as smoothly as airbrushed enamel paints.   Their spraycans are meant for larger areas like RC car bodies -- decanting them for scale models might be a good idea.

Edited by crackerjazz
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 I have been fooling around for a long time now with using Acrylics and have gotten pretti comfortable with some of them .

 

 Tamiya is one but I love the Gunze H series paints . I have been using Future for the paint sealer  before doing other crazy things to the paint job.  I also use Testor's dullcote for the flat finish ( a lacquer ). depending where I am in the paint process.

 

 So far, I have used oil paints , Vallejo Model wash and AK's interactive ( Enamel ) effects .  

 

 To me , the AK"s Enamels seem to work the best for me . Very subtle if you want.

 

 Cheers, Christian 

 

 

 

KI-51 beauty shots 018b.jpg

Edited by Chris L
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   Jimbles,

   No matter the type of paint used for your color coats, I always seal before applying any kind of wash or filter.  And nothing seals like lacquer clears. I've gone back to my old standards, Testors Glosscoat and Dullcoat. Been my go to clears since the 70s. 

 

  Lately I've been testing with Tamiya's Gloss clear gloss X-22 and it does an excellent job as well.

 

Joel

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55 minutes ago, Chris L said:

 I love the dullcote . I need to try the gloss someday but the Future has bee so handy.

 

 I also liked their metal sealer . Not sure if it's still available .

 

 Cheers, Christian 

 

55 minutes ago, Chris L said:

 

Christian,

  I used  Future/Pledge like most of us, but still preferred Glosscoat. It dries hard as nails, doesn't run, and won't yellow.   What really concerned me is that Pledge does yellow over time. I know this 1st hand, as my clear bottle of Pledge now has a definite yellow tint to it. So over time anything you coated with it will start to turn yellow. It's never been in direct sunlight, so other then keeping it in the dark, it will yellow. 

 

  When you think about it, it's made for floors. The finish wears off from just walking on it, so long lasting means weeks or months, not years. And we like to think that our models will last a life time. 

 

Joel

 

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 Not to disagree with you but Future is an acrylic .  Old canopies were made from acrylic and they did turn a golden color over the years of beeing exposed to the weather.

 

 On the other hand , the birds I sprayed over ten years ago still appear the smae as they did 10/1years ago. Much better than any other clear model finish that i used  prior to that.

 

 Besides , when I spray it, it goes on very thin and I'm starting to believe that the thickness of the clear finish probably makes it look darker or less dark ( just a theory )

 

 I do need to try the Testor's gloss though . I like working with the laquers . ( except for the smell ).

 

 Cheers, Christian

 

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Hmmm...Joel is right, I do see yellowing of the stuff in the bottle:

tciG3ls.jpg

 

But I just examined my Tomcat canopy and there isn't any sign of yellowing that I could detect and I used this same bottle.   So, yeah, maybe it's because the layer is so thin?  Still, I'm having second thoughts about using the stuff again.   If I were to move to Gloss coat, though --- should I expect the same results as a Future-dipped one?    And I guess that would mean spraying the inside of the canopy as well?  Or just the outside?   One advantage I see to using Future is the ease of starting over.    If I see imperfections or didn't like the results in any way I can wash it off with Windex.   For a lacquer-based gloss coat I can't see how the canopy would stand against lacquer thinner.

Edited by crackerjazz
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 I strongly agree with you . I have nothing with Future on it  or even the anciant bottle that has yellowed in over 10 years ...

 

I usually paint a final coat of Future over the decals and then airbrush the Lacqer dulcote  over that . It dries so fast that it does not affect the Future.

 

If you were to apply Lacqer thinner with a brush, it would remove everything to the plastic ( with a few strokes ).

 

Cheers, Christian

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 I use to airbrush but recently I discopvered that I can actualy  handbrush it by mixing Future & Windex ( with Amonia )  50/50 and it goes on well .  It actually comes out smoother that way.

 

 Maybe I still need to adjust my future mixture for airbrushing .

 

 Cheers, Christian 

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 Difficult to airbrush.  It works best if you mist the first couple of coat and let it dry a bit .  The good thing about Future is that applying more seems to solve some of the previous problems .

 

 Cheers, Christian 

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  I've air brushed Pledge on for a gloss base coat for decaling, and I've never gotten a smooth finish like I get with Glosscoat. I've also hand brushed it on, which takes a lot longer, and pooling can be an issue. But the dried coat is much smoother, it's also much thicker.  I've rubbed out Pledge with a Micro Mesh #6,000 & 8,000 pads that has helped.  About the only thing I use it for these days is the lenses for the gauges of my IPs.  I've gone to car polishes and scratch removers to buff and polish my canopies and windscreens which really doesn't leave a thick coating like Pledge does. 

 

Joel

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There seems to be a better oil paint thinner from this article on filtering:

http://ipms-seattle.org/features/tipsandtricks/EC-TAT-2013-07.php

 

By the sound of it, you could safely apply oil paint directly onto enamel without having to seal it first.   Will make a quick trip to Michaels tomorrow; hope they have Mona Lisa in stock.   Can't wait to experiment : )

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Crackerjazz,

  I always go by the rule that if something can remotely and/or possibly go wrong, it will for me. Before I apply any thinner I always take the one additional step of sealing with either Gloss or Mat Testors Dullcoat. Better safe then sorry, and I've had way more "sorrys" then I care to admit. :stooges:

 

Joel

Edited by Joel_W
miss spelling
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I'm not much of a Pledge guy and rarely use it these day, as I much prefer Mr Color Clears, Glosscote and Dullcote and at times X22.  For canopies I prefer to polish and buff them to a crystal clear finish and never have to worry about the Pledge possibly peeling.

Peter

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi guys, I'm happy to report about Mona Lisa thinner for oil paint.  I didn't seal the enamel with Future before weathering with oil and yet didn't experience any lifting.  This is good -- you save a step.    And besides, Future is glossy and makes oil wash pool in the crevices instead of covering flat surfaces.   It might be worth a test on your model, Jimbles  -- and do let us know your results.   But try it on small parts first, instead of the fuselage panels as our paints might behave differently.   I normally use Model Master and Humbrol enamels.  I got the Mona Lisa from Michaels.

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On ‎10‎/‎6‎/‎2017 at 12:59 PM, Peterpools said:

I'm not much of a Pledge guy and rarely use it these day, as I much prefer Mr Color Clears, Glosscote and Dullcote and at times X22.  For canopies I prefer to polish and buff them to a crystal clear finish and never have to worry about the Pledge possibly peeling.

Peter

 

  Bro,

  Gotta agree with you on the use of Pledge these days. Ever since my bottle has shown signs of yellowing, I stopped using it, and like you, went back to the model clears.

   And Crackerjazz, going to try that Mona Lisa thinner for oil washes as well. Just hope that AC Moore carries it.

 

Joel

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