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What is the correct interior green for a P-47D?

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What is the correct color for the cockpit of a P-47D bubble-top?

 

I have a few different options for "interior green", and none of them appear to be the same.  Brand and number would be most helpful.    

 

Thanks,

 

Chris 

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According to my sources, bubble-top -Ds had Dull Dark Green cockpits. DDG was quite different from the zinc chromate-based Interior Green, which during the war could appear different on different planes because it was produced by mixing (basically) black with yellow ZC and varied from batch to batch. DDG was much bluer. Euro 1 Green FS34092 is often given as a good approximation, but IMO it needs to be darkened somewhat.

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MRP makes the dark gull green, acrylic and lacquer. also you can mix from tamiya equal parts Tamiya Flat Green (XF-5) and Tamiya Dark German Gray (XF-63)

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Proper DDG looks too dark for my taste. I used Model Master Euro Dark Green FS34092. Once you put a wash on it I think it looks the part and doesn't hide detail.

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2 hours ago, Grey Ghost 531 said:

Proper DDG looks too dark for my taste. I used Model Master Euro Dark Green FS34092. Once you put a wash on it I think it looks the part and doesn't hide detail.

Agreed, but I still darken it slightly with a bit of black.

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And while the cockpit of all P-47Ds (Razorbacks and Bubbletops) was Dull Dark Green, the wheel wells were Zinc Chromate Yellow.  The old Testor's square-bottle #1184 is a good match, and easily available.  Also, the landing gear struts were usually Olive Drab, rather than aluminum.

 

SN

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I've always assumed it was "Bronze Green" 

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On 1/12/2018 at 11:22 AM, TXCajun said:

I've always assumed it was "Bronze Green" 

I think Bronze Green as a cockpit color was more frequently found in USN planes, although it was used in early B-17 cockpits.

 

As I read through some references I've downloaded over the years, it may well be that P-47s used Medium Green rather than Dull Dark Green, the latter apparently having been dropped as a cockpit color by the USAAF sometime in 1943. The photos I have of P-47 cockpits indeed show a lighter color than DDG No. 30, which was very dark -- basically a black-green ... in which case FS34092 is a pretty good approximation, possibly with a small bit of blue and black added.

Edited by seawinder

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CoulourCoats also has Bronze Green as well as ZCG and ZCY. AFAIK, they're the only source of ZCY (well, perhaps non-acrylic) other than those goofy Testors square bottles...

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    Unfortunately, there isn't a definitive answer. The Bubble tops were made both by Republic, and Curtiss. the maintenance  manuals specify that the cockpits be painted with  a single coat of tinted Zinc Chromate primer. There is no reference according to Dana Bell that the specs called for ANA Interior Green. the formula listed is wrong with way to much black per gallon, making the color much darker. To made it just a little more confusing, each plant followed a different formula with the Republic plant being as close to spec as possible, so it's cockpits would have been much darker. but it's not the exact mix for DDG.  Also note that for some strange reason the color paint called out for the decking under the rear of the bubble was Dark Olive Drab #41, yet the inside canopy framing in Flat Black.   Further issues is that the colors were changed during the span of the production run which could have been based on paint availability issues. 

 

    If you really want to be actuate as humanely possible to the accepted Republic mix used is 1 part Black to 1 part YZC. The printed official mix is 1 part black to 10 parts YZC. Personally I would just go with either DDG or IG with a good black wash and call it a day. 

 

  these issues come up all the time with WWII aircraft. If you think that this is complex, start to research the interior colors that Grumman's used. Grumman Gray isn't an official color, and thus doesn't have an ANA number, yet, every F4F and F6F had it used in parts of the aircraft. 

 

Joel

 

Edited by Joel_W

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2 hours ago, Joel_W said:

Also note that for some strange reason the color paint called out for the decking under the rear of the bubble was Dark Olive Drab #41, yet the inside canopy framing in Flat Black.  

The P-40 used the exterior color beneath the canopy behind the pilot. While the extract of this image from the NATIONAL MUSEUM OF THE US AIR FORCE(TM) appears to show this clearly, I've also read this specifically called out. Makes sense that the P-47 would also use this scheme.

061019-F-1234P-028-extract.jpg.d1240afe7cfd258fc184ce9548974030.jpg

Edited by dnl42

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dnl42,

  I would agree if they were scallops in the fuselage, but it's the rear deck of the cockpit, so I would have thought that the same color would be throughout.

Joel

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A clarification on P-47 interiors.  Republic built aircraft used DDG as previously noted.  Republic seems to have liked the color since it was in use all the way through the F-105 production.  Curtiss used tinted ZC to match interior green.  Records indicate that all of the Curtiss built aircraft went to Training Command and remained in the States.

 

HTH, Dave

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7 hours ago, HistnScale said:

A clarification on P-47 interiors.  Republic built aircraft used DDG as previously noted.  Republic seems to have liked the color since it was in use all the way through the F-105 production.  Curtiss used tinted ZC to match interior green.  Records indicate that all of the Curtiss built aircraft went to Training Command and remained in the States.

 

HTH, Dave

Agreed. I also believe, contrary to Joel_W's post above, that all the Curtiss-produced P-47s were razorbacks. Or have I got it wrong?

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