German Tornado war loads?

[SebastianP]

I've been trying to figure out what options there are for arming up a Luftwaffe Tornado IDS, since the 1/72 kit basically doesn't come with any air-to-surface weapons (it has a recce pod, a buddy refueling pod, two drop tanks, a jamming pod, and a countermeasures dispenser pod, and a pair of Sidewinders. That's it. The IDS kit is very much the exception to the rule that modern Revell kits are weapons sets with a complimentary aircraft model...)

 

Pictures of armed Luftwaffe Tornados are rare as hen's teeth. About the only air-to-surface weapons I've found pictures of are HARM (only on the Tornado ECR in German service, not the IDS); Kormoran (no longer available in plastic as far as I remember, Italeri had them in at least one of their old Tornado kits as well as their NATO weapons set, but they're long OOP, and if they aren't I'll have to buy an expensive model just to loot it for weapons); MW-1 munitions dispensers (these were also included in the Italeri Tornado, but I haven't seen them since, and they're long out of service now); and finally the Taurus KEPD350, which is the only weapon on the list that's readily available since you get two in each Revell or Hasegawa Typhoon kit, or in the Hasegawa European Weapons Set. 

 

So, big question time.

 

Do the Luftwaffe ever load up the Tornado IDS with bombs? And if so, which kind: British-style, American-style; some homegrown design, or what? Also, do they ever use laser guided bombs or JDAMs? I have *plenty* of US Paveways and JDAMS in all sizes, but no idea whether they're appropriate. Likewise, TMDs or WCMDs; Rockeyes; Mk80-series dumb bombs - I don't have any currently, but Hasegawa's weapons sets are cheap. British dumb bombs and LGBs are a little trickier since I'll need a Tornado GR.1 kit for those (as far as I'm aware), but it's not impossible.

 

Also, does the Luftwaffe use air-launched rockets? If so, which kind, and where would I find them in plastic? I'm nowhere near as well versed in the various makes of rocket pods as I am with bombs, but I know various nations (including the US, France, Sweden and Russia) all made their own air-to-surface rockets in various sizes. 

 

If all else fails, I have enough Taurus missiles left over from building Typhoons that I can fully arm a Tornado with them (wings and fuselage stations), but I really want to see if there are any *interesting* real world options for it that I can easily get plastic for.

 

Oh, and while I'm at it - I remember reading that the original versions of the F-4F were set up  only for ground attack, with only Sidewinders for air-to-air, due to concerns that the Russians would view them as "offensive weapons systems". Which weapons would have been used on the F-4F for ground attack in those days, and what air-to-surface weapons were added during the 1990s modernizations? What's the most modern thing I can realistically hang under an F-4F for ground attack?

 

 

Edited March 8, 2018 by SebastianP

[Stefan buysse]

47 minutes ago, SebastianP said:

 

Which weapons would have been used on the F-4F for ground attack in those days, and what air-to-surface weapons were added during the 1990s modernizations? What's the most modern thing I can realistically hang under an F-4F for ground attack?

 

 

 

Hi,

 

They had AGM-65 Mavericks. I remember seeing these on the Pferdsfeld Phantoms (JaBoG-35) and they weren't even ICE/KWS F-4F's.

 

Cheers, Stefan.

 

[SebastianP]

1 minute ago, Stefan buysse said:

 

Hi,

 

They had AGM-65 Mavericks. I remember seeing these on the Pferdsfeld Phantoms (JaBoG-35) and they weren't even ICE/KWS F-4F's.

 

Cheers, Stefan.

 

 

Huh, Mavericks are one of the few weapons I *don't* have in my spares box for whatever reason (I may have some crappy ones from the old Italeri Gripens, but they don't count because they're so terrible). I seem to remember there being a distinct lack of proper single Maverick rails available in 1/72 last I had a good look, but maybe that was fixed at some point? I'll have to have a look at that...

 

Given the state of my spares box (lots of Paveways, JDAMs, modern cruise missiles and glide bombs, and dozens of AIM-120C and AIM-9X air-to-air missiles and their European equivalents, and not a whole lot else), one of my long-standing plans is to get a bunch aircraft that in real life were retired in the 80s and 90s (A-3, A-4, A-5, A-6, A-7, F-4, F-8, F-111) in their last flying configuration, paint them up in modern tactical schemes (A-7E done up in F-35 colors, for example), and load them up with modern weapons like JDAM, JSOW, JASSM, and SLAM-ER. And maybe add more chaff/flare buckets and ECM blisters.

 

Also possibly painting up the F/A-18F, F-22, and F-35A/B as the F-4J, F-4E, and A-7D/E respectively, and loading them up with Paveway I, old-school AAMs and dumb bombs, but that'd be a later project...

[305swag]

The Germans have a war load? Damn , you do learn something new everyday.

[Hoops]

4 hours ago, SebastianP said:

So, big question time.

 

Do the Luftwaffe ever load up the Tornado IDS with bombs? And if so, which kind: British-style, American-style; some homegrown design, or what? Also, do they ever use laser guided bombs or JDAMs? I have *plenty* of US Paveways and JDAMS in all sizes, but no idea whether they're appropriate. Likewise, TMDs or WCMDs; Rockeyes; Mk80-series dumb bombs - I don't have any currently, but Hasegawa's weapons sets are cheap. British dumb bombs and LGBs are a little trickier since I'll need a Tornado GR.1 kit for those (as far as I'm aware), but it's not impossible.

 

Also, does the Luftwaffe use air-launched rockets? If so, which kind, and where would I find them in plastic? I'm nowhere near as well versed in the various makes of rocket pods as I am with bombs, but I know various nations (including the US, France, Sweden and Russia) all made their own air-to-surface rockets in various sizes. 

 

 

 

The German Tornado's definitely don't incorporate any JDAMs or WCMDs, and Germany is a signatory on a cluster munitions ban, so you won't see any of those either. No rockets to my knowledge, but I could be proven wrong. US type iron bombs or LGBs are the most likely if they were ever going to load.

 

Cheers,

 

Hoops

[Finn]

Here is one about to get a GBU-24, inert one:

 

 

Jari

[SebastianP]

Thanks for the picture @Finn, you got me started on looking for specific combinations in pictures which led me to all sorts of fun info.

 

I've now been able to find pictures of Luftwaffe Tornados with the following confirmed stores:

 

GBU-24 (both the Mk84 and BLU-109 versions)

GBU-54 (500 lb Laser JDAM)

LITENING targeting pod (Wikipedia says these may have been upgraded to LITENING III), 

 

I have rather conspicuously *not* found any pictures of the German Tornados with older versions of Paveway; nor larger JDAMs. 

 

The Italian Air Force uses these weapons that I've found so far:

 

GBU-32 (1000 lb JDAM)

GBU-39 (Small Diameter Bomb)

GBU-12 (500 lb Paveway II)

 

Which targeting pod is used is "unconfirmed", but Italy uses LITENING on the AMX, Harrier and Typhoon, so that's *probably* what their Tornados carry as well. 

 

And of course the Brits use all kinds of stuff, but most of it is included in the kits for the RAF versions. 

[Mr Matt Foley]

I searched for information because I saw an article a few days ago about the Luftwaffe purchasing smart bombs from the USA. The recent purchase as I recall was for the SDB GBU-39/53. Unfortunately, I couldn't find the article. It seems Google wants to direct everyone to WWII Luftwaffe "Fritz" etc.

Edited March 9, 2018 by Mr Matt Foley

[Mr Matt Foley]

11 hours ago, 305swag said:

The Germans have a war load? Damn , you do learn something new everyday.

 

They most certainly do. Just ask Serbia.

[Alpagueur]

German Tornados? I'd go one with 4 tanks, one with 2 belly Kormoran and one with a big centerline recce pod

[Hajo L.]

German war load is indeed a very rare term - and I should know that, working for the german Bundeswehr... ;)

 

I found a picture of a Tornado dropping practice bombs:

 

 

I think I also saw a video a couple of years ago pf a Red Flag-sortie with some sort of iron bombs.

 

 

HAJO

[Hajo L.]

Apparently the picture above comes from this video, which shows the Weapons Instructor Course of the Luftwaffe teams in the USA.

 

HAJO

 

 

[bdt13]

On 3/8/2018 at 6:09 PM, SebastianP said:

 

Huh, Mavericks are one of the few weapons I *don't* have in my spares box for whatever reason (I may have some crappy ones from the old Italeri Gripens, but they don't count because they're so terrible). I seem to remember there being a distinct lack of proper single Maverick rails available in 1/72 last I had a good look, but maybe that was fixed at some point? I'll have to have a look at that...

 

Modern Hobbies makes a good 1/72 Maverick and single rail: Click Here I have a few of these I intend to use for A-10 builds, the triple rails haven't been used much in actual combat loads.

[JayBee]

KLICK

[SCOUT712]

MK-83 was only in the inventory of the German Navy Tornados. The Lw Tornados only carried MK-82s. Also the Navy carried AGM-88 on their IDS while the Lw only carried and still carries the HARM ob the ECR.

Cheers

Scout